Club that win flags aren't meant to have $mill free

[ace]

Clubs that win flags aren't meant t have $mill free to recruit star players.

They are meant to have the salary cap biting hard, so that the competition is more level.

The Swans have now won two flags in less than a decade. Landing Tippet will certainly have them in the running for more.

While YES I do believe that the Swans have recruited superbly in recent years, and that this is a HUGE factor in their success, the extra salary cap is an unfair advantage.

I too can see the advantage for the competition in them being initially successful, but after two flags in less than a decade it is time this advantage was removed.

The Saints did not even win a flag, but playing in repeated GF's with the salary cap squeeze has meant that we have now lost BJ, Ball, Zac and Walsh as players where $$$ was an issue.

Time for common sense to be applied and for the extra salary cap loading for the Swans to go.

St Kilda had a salary cap squeeze because some players had inflated expectations of their worth.
They chose to demand and continue to take big money, hampering the clubs ability to bring in the extra talent needed to push St kilda over that premiership line.
The club foolishly pandered to these demands.
There are no greater culprits in this than Nick Riewoldt and Luke Ball.
It will take a number of years to rid the club of the culture of greed.
Many players will probably leave before the message of team first gets through to players and managers.
Ball and Goddard are just the first to leave.

[CURLY]

How so in regards to Nick Riewoldt?

[whiskers3614]

Apparently as well as costing us 9 flags and blowing the salary cap Luke Ball is now the prime suspect in the JFK assassination!

[StevieSaint]

Bally also ordered 19 men to fly hijacked planes into the twin towers...heard it on SEN before...

[plugger66]

Would you be happy if StKilda drafted a player without interviewing him or doing any physical testing?

If i knew the Pies were going to recruit him and pay him about 500K I would take a fair guess he is fit enough and If it was a player like Bally I would trust his attitude so 100% yes.

[CURLY]

Would you be happy if StKilda drafted a player without interviewing him or doing any physical testing?

If i knew the Pies were going to recruit him and pay him about 500K I would take a fair guess he is fit enough and If it was a player like Bally I would trust his attitude so 100% yes.

Might as well not have recruiting staff then. Just grab players Collingwood delist or show interest in. Could you imagine the uproar if Melbourne took Ball and he spent the season hobbling around.

[plugger66]

Would you be happy if StKilda drafted a player without interviewing him or doing any physical testing?

If i knew the Pies were going to recruit him and pay him about 500K I would take a fair guess he is fit enough and If it was a player like Bally I would trust his attitude so 100% yes.

Might as well non have recruiting staff then. Just grab players Collingwood delist or show interest in. Could you imagine the uproar if Melbourne took Ball and spent the season hobbling around.

And you think the pies were going to pay 500K for someone that was likely to do that? Sorry but I dont get grabbing players that the pies delist.

[CURLY]

Maybe they knew he was good for half a dozen games and they hoped hay where finals who knows maybe Malthouse was adament he wanted a big name no matter what. Why would you risk it? Why would you believe Collingwood that Ball was worth the risk?

[plugger66]

Maybe they knew he was good for half a dozen games and they hoped hay where finals who knows maybe Malthouse was adament he wanted a big name no matter what. Why would you risk it? Why would you believe Collingwood that Ball was worth the risk?

Because they arent a stupid club even if some beleive they are. 500K suggests they knew exactly how fit he was. Melbourne should have had the guts and taken him.

[CURLY]

Maybe they knew he was good for half a dozen games and they hoped hay where finals who knows maybe Malthouse was adament he wanted a big name no matter what. Why would you risk it? Why would you believe Collingwood that Ball was worth the risk?

Because they arent a stupid club even if some beleive they are. 500K suggests they knew exactly how fit he was. Melbourne should have had the guts and taken him.

Steve Johnson ring any bells?

[Con Gorozidis]

I thought this thread was going to be about the Pies- They won a flag and played in 2 gfs. So guys like Swan, Pendles, Thomas are on massive coin. We know for sure Cloke is on massive coin - one of the highest paid in the comp.
Yet they still have money to throw around and then on top of that Eddie talks about fair play from the Eagles on Wellingham. Man I hope like hell he goes for nothing.

Swans managed to win a flag on a budget. They can probably back-end him knowing Goodesy only has one more year left. No other swans probably on big coin.

[plugger66]

I thought this thread was going to be about the Pies- They won a flag and played in 2 gfs. So guys like Swan, Pendles, Thomas are on massive coin. We know for sure Cloke is on massive coin - one of the highest paid in the comp.
Yet they still have money to throw around and then on top of that Eddie talks about fair play from the Eagles on Wellingham. Man I hope like hell he goes for nothing.

Swans managed to win a flag on a budget. They can probably back-end him knowing Goodesy only has one more year left. No other swans probably on big coin.

I think the Swans would be on the salary cap limit. They were last year and I cant see what has changed.

[CURLY]

I thought this thread was going to be about the Pies- They won a flag and played in 2 gfs. So guys like Swan, Pendles, Thomas are on massive coin. We know for sure Cloke is on massive coin - one of the highest paid in the comp.
Yet they still have money to throw around and then on top of that Eddie talks about fair play from the Eagles on Wellingham. Man I hope like hell he goes for nothing.

Swans managed to win a flag on a budget. They can probably back-end him knowing Goodesy only has one more year left. No other swans probably on big coin.

Okeefe is on big coin.

[bobmurray]

The AFL always claimed to be scared to challenge the players manipulating the draft because before free agency it was a way of curtailing the players running to court to cry restraint of trade. Now they should toughen the f*** up on these piss weak dogs who mess with the system. Tippett isn't a free agent he should go to the club that gets a deal done with Adelaide for his services. Same with Caddy, we have free agency to placate these wankers now they want free agency from the day they are drafted. The AFL is letting this get silly. he and Caddy should both be told they are getting investigated for draft tampering (like they should have done with Ball) then this would stop.

Our resident restraint of trade merchant.....are you sure the clubs or the players look at this angle...are you sure Jeff Brown didn't have it covered when he drew up the current player rules....

[battye]

The AFL always claimed to be scared to challenge the players manipulating the draft because before free agency it was a way of curtailing the players running to court to cry restraint of trade. Now they should toughen the f*** up on these piss weak dogs who mess with the system. Tippett isn't a free agent he should go to the club that gets a deal done with Adelaide for his services. Same with Caddy, we have free agency to placate these wankers now they want free agency from the day they are drafted. The AFL is letting this get silly. he and Caddy should both be told they are getting investigated for draft tampering (like they should have done with Ball) then this would stop.

This is a serious question, because I don't know an awful lot about restraint of trade laws... but in a sporting competition isn't there a reasonable expectation that things will be handled differently to other professions. For example, women do not play in the AFL. So player movements occurring only via draft and trade seems like a reasonable and realistic expectation.

I do know that a similar fear was faced in cricket in Europe and India (ie. "Kolpak" players participating in county cricket, "ICL" players being banned from the sport because it's was an unauthorised league, etc) and the court cases ultimately went the way of the authorities. Kolpak players were no longer allowed to play in England and ICL players for the most part were only allowed to play again if the BCCI (Indian cricket board) let them.

[gringo]

The AFL always claimed to be scared to challenge the players manipulating the draft because before free agency it was a way of curtailing the players running to court to cry restraint of trade. Now they should toughen the f*** up on these piss weak dogs who mess with the system. Tippett isn't a free agent he should go to the club that gets a deal done with Adelaide for his services. Same with Caddy, we have free agency to placate these wankers now they want free agency from the day they are drafted. The AFL is letting this get silly. he and Caddy should both be told they are getting investigated for draft tampering (like they should have done with Ball) then this would stop.

This is a serious question, because I don't know an awful lot about restraint of trade laws... but in a sporting competition isn't there a reasonable expectation that things will be handled differently to other professions. For example, women do not play in the AFL. So player movements occurring only via draft and trade seems like a reasonable and realistic expectation.

I do know that a similar fear was faced in cricket in Europe and India (ie. "Kolpak" players participating in county cricket, "ICL" players being banned from the sport because it's was an unauthorised league, etc) and the court cases ultimately went the way of the authorities. Kolpak players were no longer allowed to play in England and ICL players for the most part were only allowed to play again if the BCCI (Indian cricket board) let them.

I'm married to a lawyer and have lots of friends in the law. The AFLPA have been pushing for a limited free agency as they believe it's a way for freedom of movement while allowing the competition to keep some regulation over competitive balance. The only reason it was allowed was because the threat was always that it is a restraint of trade. Just because it's a sport it doesn't stop it from being a workplace.

[Vazelos]

The AFL need a strong Sydney, a billion dollar business doesnt let strategic markets like NSW go to chance. Its a business, not a fair sporting contest, have known this for years!!

[SuperDuper]

It shows that the Swans were well below their salary cap this year and they got the premiership fair and square... ie the extra room they have was not crucial in 2012...
look at their good players in the GF:

goodes: selection 43
okeef: selection 56
Daniel Hannebery: selection 30
Malceski selection 64
alex johnson selction 57

Kennedy: traded for selection in the 30's/40s

all amongst sydneys best in the GF....

Add to that Parker, who they somehow got at 40 even though he was a gun in the TAC cup..

Simply, some smart recruiting won them a premiership..

[Dave McNamara]

It shows that the Swans were well below their salary cap this year and they got the premiership fair and square... ie the extra room they have was not crucial in 2012...

Ex-Hawks president Jeff Kennett and Crows chairman Rob Chapman have slammed the policy that gives Sydney an extra $862,000 to spend on player payments.
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/afl/lions-l ... 6490197018

I hear your point Super D, but though I have no idea how much of their inflated cap the swines spent last season, remember that all clubs have to spend at least 92-95% of their cap, so IMHO they still did not win the premiership fair and square.

But wait, if The Telegraph is on the money... there's more..., it just keeps on getting better for those swines...

The Sunday Telegraph understands the Swans will only have to give up pick No. 42 in next month's national draft because of a clause in Tippett's contract with the Crows which allows him to go to the club of his choice for a second-round selection...

Maybe our Saintas aren't the only ones to have written a really silly clause into a player's contract...?

The 25-year-old will get $4 million over four years.

It's believed the Crows offered $800,000-a-season for Tippett to remain in Adelaide, while Brisbane ($750,000) and the Gold Coast's ($700,000) weren't close to matching the Swans' deal.
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/afl/more-ne ... 6489649611

And how did they secure this bargain pick? Yep, salary cap greater than the other competing clubs whom they easily outbid...

They're now a chance for back-to-back hollow AFL-sponsored flags...

[matrix]

Thats what i would think. Adelaide would nearly make him go in the pre season draft than take somethink like pick 22. I doubt Sydney would let a star go to Adelaide so that wont work either. Tippett may want to go there but may have to go to GC.

True...but Tippets manager can say trade with the Swans or he will go to Suns for free. Suns have second pick, but GWS cannot pick another Crows players this year as they gained one last year. So the Crows bargaining position and ability to play hard ball is weakened.

well thats what i thought but someone said GWS can pick him up because they took davis last year.
this year they can take whomever they like
????

[plugger66]

Thats what i would think. Adelaide would nearly make him go in the pre season draft than take somethink like pick 22. I doubt Sydney would let a star go to Adelaide so that wont work either. Tippett may want to go there but may have to go to GC.

True...but Tippets manager can say trade with the Swans or he will go to Suns for free. Suns have second pick, but GWS cannot pick another Crows players this year as they gained one last year. So the Crows bargaining position and ability to play hard ball is weakened.

well thats what i thought but someone said GWS can pick him up because they took davis last year.
this year they can take whomever they like
????

They can pick him up by trading for him. That is the only way.