Age article

[stinger]

I wonder how any one of us would cope with it? (having to front up to the media pack) Not making excuses, just seeking reasons why the club have been criticized for the presser on Friday.

IMHO his delivery, whilst neither here not there, wasn't the problem...

we'd cope, wouldn't we dave...and do a better job of it at the same time.....

[Dave McNamara]

Yes Pres is learning that footy media a bit different from stockholders and his other traditional constituents. Hopefully picks up the skill soon.

For the sake of our club I hope he really picks up soon too...
or, maybe it's just been the 'market conditions'... since August 1998...?


Hmmmmm... price is around a previous resistance level again? Time to sell...?

For those a bit pressed for time, maybe just scroll down to the Return (loss) on Equity figures, third last stat' from the bottom.
http://financials.morningstar.com/ratio ... tab-growth

And down another lazy $15.3mil this year.
(Imagine if AVJ was actually ALP. What would Tony have to say about those governance results then...?)
http://news.smh.com.au/breaking-news-bu ... 2s0yr.html

However, although el Prez's 'traditional constituents' seem surprisingly tolerant (to me anyway, but apparently I know nothing about business )... the customers are less understanding... http://www.productreview.com.au/p/avjennings.html

I remember that several decades ago they had a very bad (Brand?) name for cutting corners. I also remember walking through one of their display homes, and being amazed at the poor quality of the external finishes... so no idea what was underneath(?)

That was a fair while back. Though maybe not enough has changed? Maybe AVJ is also continuing to go around in circles, rather than moving forward???

AVJ = StK? I hope not.

[Legendary]

[
or, maybe it's just been the 'market conditions'... since August 1998...?

...

That was a fair while back. Though maybe not enough has changed? Maybe AVJ is also continuing to go around in circles, rather than moving forward???

AVJ = StK? I hope not.

Maybe AVJ's share price just mirrors the strength of the residential construction market in Australia? If you superimposed new dwelling construction figures over the top of your graph since 1998, I have a feeling there would be a reasonable degree of consistency between the two...

Or is Peter Summers responsible for government housing policy and interest rates too?! Maybe he was the instigator of subprime lending in the United States?

Actually, I would also be interested in a competitor comparison, to see AVJ's performance relative to their competitors over that period. I recall a few of them going bankrupt ... St Hilliers ... Becton ... seems like AVJ has survived ... despite the gloom. Wonder if that has anything to do with the management?

I would also be interested in the way they have shed some of the underperforming parts of their business to focus on their core activities post-GFC.

[PADDLEPOP1001]

+1

[The OtherThommo]

[
or, maybe it's just been the 'market conditions'... since August 1998...?

...

That was a fair while back. Though maybe not enough has changed? Maybe AVJ is also continuing to go around in circles, rather than moving forward???

AVJ = StK? I hope not.

Maybe AVJ's share price just mirrors the strength of the residential construction market in Australia? If you superimposed new dwelling construction figures over the top of your graph since 1998, I have a feeling there would be a reasonable degree of consistency between the two...

Or is Peter Summers responsible for government housing policy and interest rates too?! Maybe he was the instigator of subprime lending in the United States?

Actually, I would also be interested in a competitor comparison, to see AVJ's performance relative to their competitors over that period. I recall a few of them going bankrupt ... St Hilliers ... Becton ... seems like AVJ has survived ... despite the gloom. Wonder if that has anything to do with the management?

I would also be interested in the way they have shed some of the underperforming parts of their business to focus on their core activities post-GFC.

Compare them to Cedar Woods (Code CWP), Legendary. They don't bother with shrugging their shoulders because the macro environment is tough - they manage well within that environment.

While a lot of builders have gone broke, there are also competitors to AVJ who have thrived in exactly the same housing policy and interest rate environment as AVJ.

AVJ's performance is not the worst, certainly. But, if 1 of the key criteria for investing in a business is the ability of management to generate returns on shareholders funds commensurate with the risk investors take by investing, then AVJ is not worth investing in. They couldn't generate reasonable returns pre-GFC, and they ain't since.

They're a run of the mill underperformer.

[GRAMophone]

I wonder how any one of us would cope with it? (having to front up to the media pack) Not making excuses, just seeking reasons why the club have been criticized for the presser on Friday.

Initially I was incredibly disappointed with the presser but softened my view a little this week. I listened to a media consultant who had been engaged to advise the club re the presser (I believe) and he explained what a difficult and thin line they needed to walk with what was revealed....with and out of respect for Scott. This somewhat explains how evasive and awkward the whole thing came across....for me.

[Dave McNamara]

Initially I was incredibly disappointed with the presser but softened my view a little this week. I listened to a media consultant who had been engaged to advise the club re the presser (I believe) and he explained what a difficult and thin line they needed to walk with what was revealed....with and out of respect for Scott. This somewhat explains how evasive and awkward the whole thing came across....for me.

Respect for Scott???

Bit late now! Where was the respect for Scott within all those leaks against him??? (Leaks which now seem to have dried up... now that the goal has been achieved. Funny about that.)

Every one hates Scott down there...?

The dud didn't seem to.
How come Lenny played on? (Was he tipped-off that the hated Cuddles was going to take that long walk of a short plank? May well have been..., but if so, why was not Dal also tipped off...?)
Tony's source (and probably those around Tony's source) certainly didn't seem to hate Scott...?

Still haven't heard anything decisive that Cuddles has done wrong... that wasn't debunked in that presser!

So are El Prez and El Netters wrong? And if they weren't telling us porkies, then why don't we still have a coach...? No one who has defended the presser, nor the 'campaign' leading up to it, has been able to answer that one...

Still way too much not adding up.

The only things that do seem clear... our resident FU (or maybe FUs?) clearly won the power struggle at the Seaford House of Cards, and so Cuddles is out of the cabinet, out of the party, and out of the House..., and our Club is outta' pocket another $500K... maybe more depending on how much Choco ends up negotiating.

Hope that share price fares better...

[spert]

I still don't think any AFL coach is so hopeless and unloved that a struggling club can just throw $500k away to remove him, rather than let him run his contract out- I smell A GREAT BIG RAT.

[Con Gorozidis]

I still don't think any AFL coach is so hopeless and unloved that a struggling club can just throw $500k away to remove him, rather than let him run his contract out- I smell A GREAT BIG RAT.

Can you elaborate on what that rat might be?

[markp]

I still don't think any AFL coach is so hopeless and unloved that a struggling club can just throw $500k away to remove him, rather than let him run his contract out- I smell A GREAT BIG RAT.

It must have gotten to the 'untenable' point.

And I suspect Williams' people said "yes".

So trigger pulled.

[Richter]

Still haven't heard anything decisive that Cuddles has done wrong... that wasn't debunked in that presser!

So are El Prez and El Netters wrong? And if they weren't telling us porkies, then why don't we still have a coach...? No one who has defended the presser, nor the 'campaign' leading up to it, has been able to answer that one...

Still way too much not adding up.

Dave, I'm not sure that you really are interested in hearing reasons why Watters was sacked (tbh I think you prefer to carp and complain from the sidelines), but if you are then check out this thread from bf... there's some interesting posts from Persevering Saint, Gringo and a couple of others that will help you to put things together.

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/n ... 426/page-3

[SENsei]

I still don't think any AFL coach is so hopeless and unloved that a struggling club can just throw $500k away to remove him, rather than let him run his contract out- I smell A GREAT BIG RAT.

It must have gotten to the 'untenable' point.

And I suspect Williams' people said "yes".

So trigger pulled.

No "yes" yet from Williams himself though it seems.

[Dave McNamara]

Still haven't heard anything decisive that Cuddles has done wrong... that wasn't debunked in that presser!

So are El Prez and El Netters wrong? And if they weren't telling us porkies, then why don't we still have a coach...? No one who has defended the presser, nor the 'campaign' leading up to it, has been able to answers that one...

Still way too much not adding up.

Dave, I'm not sure that you really are interested in hearing reasons why Watters was sacked (tbh I think you prefer to carp and complain from the sidelines), but if you are then check out this thread from bf... there's some interesting posts from Persevering Saint, Gringo and a couple of others that will help you to put things together.

http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/n ... 426/page-3

Hi Rich, no, I am very interested in hearing something... hence my ongoing annoyance at the 'denials' made during that pressor of nearly all the stuff listed in your (very interesting) link. And I'm still waiting for answer to that.

No one expected him to bag out Watters at all. What we expected was at least an explanation for the change of mind of the board. What we got was just "we have changed out vision for the club and Watters was not a part of it".

What COULD have been said was "we have found that irreconcilable differences between staff has developed and at this point it would be best to part ways". No, still doesnt say much but it does give a clue as to what the issues might have been without dragging his name through the water. - Nutsngum.

I reckon Nutsngum should be our PR advisor to the board.

The guy is a total knob and should never be allowed into a footy club ever again. These are facts, just ask Nick Dal Santo who he didn't speak to one on one for 11 months. It has nothing to do with senior players running the show, the whole club hated him.
Not too mention an infamous meeting he has with our co major sponsor and bagged members of our admin to them…guess what, they got on the phone and rang admin to tell them, surprise surprise. - BrianSpeaking

Mates at Subiaco said similar things. - Jezzarayman.

The AFL scene is a small family. Word gets around. Seems everyone knew about the 'real' Cuddles, even Jezzrayman's mates at Subi... but not our previous selection committee...? Did no one bother to ask around? How could they have missed such a gigantic elephant in the room??? Or maybe they did ask around, maybe they asked one of our WA-based Saintsationalists who has posted that Cuddles was loved over there? Others have posted here that Cuddles was loved at Skunkland (ok, not necessarily such a good thing), others have posted here that he was loved by our younger players...?

For me, it's not a case of believing what one wants to believe, but wanting to know what can be believed.

Players play, coaches coach and administrators administer. - hayes

Now that'd be good to see at our mighty Saintas!



PS: I only look at BF for the Sandy match threads, so I'm not nutsngum, Mowman, hayes nor mysaintersK.