The Fat Lady

[Dis Believer]

Not so much duplicity, but the facts were that richo was the coach for 2019, if only due to prior contractual decisions. so let's get on with it, put the best team in place around him and give it a crack. Results have fallen short of minimum standards, the contractual position will soon not be a factor and we are free to take another path.
If we want to attract good people to the club, we have to behave in a reasonable and measured way. The traditional saints public executions would not have held us in a good light in the wider footy community. So whilst it may not be the quick gratification many sort, I think it will prove a better outcome for sustained success

There is actually a lot of validity to this post. Whilst I am as desperate as anyone to see Cho exit the building, we need to conduct ourselves, as a club, in a professional manner. Despite our disappointment at a wasted year, we can still retain our integrity (or what remains of it). This will no doubt position us better with regards to future coaching and playing prospects that may be trying to decide whether or not to join our club.

The counter to this line of thinking is that Carlton and North Melbourne have become SIGNIFICANTLY more attractive since both their coaches departed and are more likely to attract players (and the right person as coach) based on the optimism and improvement that both have shown.

We will never beat the Cats so there's no point bringing the axe down this week but if we did it next week and gave Ratten or Lade half a dozen games in charge, surely it could do nothing except help our prospects for 2020.

Agreed, but if we go too early on axing Cho and have to pay out a much bigger cheque, you just know that the sizable payout will become the media narrative and not the fresh new broom sweeping life back into the playing list and club…..

[Special]

Not so much duplicity, but the facts were that richo was the coach for 2019, if only due to prior contractual decisions. so let's get on with it, put the best team in place around him and give it a crack. Results have fallen short of minimum standards, the contractual position will soon not be a factor and we are free to take another path.
If we want to attract good people to the club, we have to behave in a reasonable and measured way. The traditional saints public executions would not have held us in a good light in the wider footy community. So whilst it may not be the quick gratification many sort, I think it will prove a better outcome for sustained success

There is actually a lot of validity to this post. Whilst I am as desperate as anyone to see Cho exit the building, we need to conduct ourselves, as a club, in a professional manner. Despite our disappointment at a wasted year, we can still retain our integrity (or what remains of it). This will no doubt position us better with regards to future coaching and playing prospects that may be trying to decide whether or not to join our club.

The counter to this line of thinking is that Carlton and North Melbourne have become SIGNIFICANTLY more attractive since both their coaches departed and are more likely to attract players (and the right person as coach) based on the optimism and improvement that both have shown.

We will never beat the Cats so there's no point bringing the axe down this week but if we did it next week and gave Ratten or Lade half a dozen games in charge, surely it could do nothing except help our prospects for 2020.

Agreed, but if we go too early on axing Cho and have to pay out a much bigger cheque, you just know that the sizable payout will become the media narrative and not the fresh new broom sweeping life back into the playing list and club…..

Only if it goes legal.

Unless AR is completely stupid he knows we are almost zero chance of making finals.

Good luck to him taking that to court. Methinks this mess can be settled without recourse post the Geelong hiding.

[desertsaint]

why not do a deal with him - we'll pay the full season if he resigns. let him keep some respectability.

[Linton Lodger]

He knows, the players know, you know.

Well if that's the case, there needs to be a parting of company now. Otherwise things get really counter productive.

It cannot be assumed Geelong will deliver a hiding. They're out of form and have been worked out to an extent. Who says they're as good as Brisbane or North at this moment in time? Just saying it could be an a honourable defeat and then we just continue to roll along with no direction!

[shanegrambeau]

What is more disturbing?
A) Appoint a caretaker then face a potential dilemma as to whether to do a “full process” or just continue with the caretaker...
B) let Richo run out the season as (for external purposes at least) match day coach then start from zero?

[Linton Lodger]

What is more disturbing?
A) Appoint a caretaker then face a potential dilemma as to whether to do a “full process” or just continue with the caretaker...
B) let Richo run out the season as (for external purposes at least) match day coach then start from zero?

They shouldn't even dream of just going with the caretaker.

[Linton Lodger]

This shouldn't just be all about the Coach, although the next one will be a critical appointment to get right.

There needs to be a hard look at the List. As we know, we are short of stars, we have depth but too many samey players and if Brown is on the outer, need another experienced big defender.

They need to work out which players they can imagine holding their own deep in Finals and ones that would'nt. Then start to move on the latter. That may include trading some decent players.

[shanegrambeau]

What is more disturbing?
A) Appoint a caretaker then face a potential dilemma as to whether to do a “full process” or just continue with the caretaker...
B) let Richo run out the season as (for external purposes at least) match day coach then start from zero?

They shouldn't even dream of just going with the caretaker.

Yet it happens. Taking nothing away from Rhyce Shaw’s attributes, look at all the hyperbole - it’s dangerous and might sway or complicate rationality.1

[shanegrambeau]

What is more disturbing?
A) Appoint a caretaker then face a potential dilemma as to whether to do a “full process” or just continue with the caretaker...
B) let Richo run out the season as (for external purposes at least) match day coach then start from zero?

They shouldn't even dream of just going with the caretaker.

Yet it happens. Taking nothing away from Rhyce Shaw’s attributes, look at all the hyperbole - it’s dangerous and might sway or complicate rationality.1

[shanegrambeau]

What is more disturbing?
A) Appoint a caretaker then face a potential dilemma as to whether to do a “full process” or just continue with the caretaker...
B) let Richo run out the season as (for external purposes at least) match day coach then start from zero?

They shouldn't even dream of just going with the caretaker.

Yet it happens. Taking nothing away from Rhyce Shaw’s attributes, look at all the hyperbole - it’s dangerous and might sway or complicate rationality.1

[St Loxton]

What is more disturbing?
A) Appoint a caretaker then face a potential dilemma as to whether to do a “full process” or just continue with the caretaker...
B) let Richo run out the season as (for external purposes at least) match day coach then start from zero?

If we choose B the AFL may accuse us of tanking.

[Devilhead]

Whoever agreed upon the extension trigger should be sacked

In effect its holding the club to ransom and not allowing us to move forward

How the management didn't have the foresight to fully weigh up the negative aspects of this trigger and take this scenario into account is extraordinary.

A coach should be made to earn his position - if he has proven himself to be good enough then give him a standard extension - it's not like other clubs were lining up to poach Richo when we extended his contract

Now the club just sits treading water - slowly drowning with the lifebuoy in reach but not being able to touch it

[ace]

I don't want her sitting next to me.
I am fat and at Marvel with the seat spacing there just isn't enough room for two fat people sitting side by side.

[SAINT-LEE]

Interesting aside
The original saying is "it's not over till the fat lady sinks "
This was a term used in American 8 ball, as the game concludes when the 8 ball sinks ( goes in the pocket)
That's why they say fat ladies at bingo for number 8

Anyway... time for AR to step down for the good of the club ... Sink seems more appropriate

While I'm at it......it's like the bastardization of the "Fremantle doctor"
It is the Fremantle "docker" because when we had sailing ships they had to wait for that breeze to come into port up river

I heard the same about fat lady and billards....problem is there is yet to surface one single written reference to this saying in history up to 1976.
Prior to 1976 no one had ever written or spoken the term " it's not over until the fat lady sings"... a reference made by a USA sportscaster from opera.

I had this discussion with a mate about 5 years ago and as our wives were shopping for shoes we spent 31 days straight uninterrupted searching the net for a single written reference in billiards history to " it ain't over until the fat lady sinks"....not one until after 1976 when the infamous fat lady sings comment was made....maybe you can find one and settle the argument.

[ace]

Not so much duplicity, but the facts were that richo was the coach for 2019, if only due to prior contractual decisions. so let's get on with it, put the best team in place around him and give it a crack. Results have fallen short of minimum standards, the contractual position will soon not be a factor and we are free to take another path.
If we want to attract good people to the club, we have to behave in a reasonable and measured way. The traditional saints public executions would not have held us in a good light in the wider footy community. So whilst it may not be the quick gratification many sort, I think it will prove a better outcome for sustained success

There is actually a lot of validity to this post. Whilst I am as desperate as anyone to see Cho exit the building, we need to conduct ourselves, as a club, in a professional manner. Despite our disappointment at a wasted year, we can still retain our integrity (or what remains of it). This will no doubt position us better with regards to future coaching and playing prospects that may be trying to decide whether or not to join our club.

The counter to this line of thinking is that Carlton and North Melbourne have become SIGNIFICANTLY more attractive since both their coaches departed and are more likely to attract players (and the right person as coach) based on the optimism and improvement that both have shown.

We will never beat the Cats so there's no point bringing the axe down this week but if we did it next week and gave Ratten or Lade half a dozen games in charge, surely it could do nothing except help our prospects for 2020.

Agreed, but if we go too early on axing Cho and have to pay out a much bigger cheque, you just know that the sizable payout will become the media narrative and not the fresh new broom sweeping life back into the playing list and club…..

Only if it goes legal.

Unless AR is completely stupid he knows we are almost zero chance of making finals.

Good luck to him taking that to court. Methinks this mess can be settled without recourse post the Geelong hiding.

Any termination of Richo short of his contract expiring will cost money.
The club is in debt to the AFL who will have to approve any action.
They may say we don't care if St Kilda lose the next 6 games.
Some team has to win, that is unlikely to be St Kilda, so what.
Just don't incur any more costs than is absolutely necessary.

[BarryGrogan]

This shouldn't just be all about the Coach, although the next one will be a critical appointment to get right.

There needs to be a hard look at the List. As we know, we are short of stars, we have depth but too many samey players and if Brown is on the outer, need another experienced big defender.

They need to work out which players they can imagine holding their own deep in Finals and ones that would'nt. Then start to move on the latter. That may include trading some decent players.

Clubs do this constantly.

[thejiggingsaint]

May just have to bite the bullet and let Forrest Gump coach out the season, then cut him loose. I agree with Ace, lets not waste even MORE money for the sake of seeing the back of Richardson..... There's NO way we are going to win any more than possibly 2 more games this season anyway...FINALS??? Yeah! RIGHT!!!!

[linmarnic]

Rooey On the Couch tonight said that he has no doubt that Richo will coach out the year

[B.M]

Pity we can’t sack the list.

We have sacked the moron who devised our pathetic strategy to put us in this situation

We have sacked the guy that picked the players in those drafts

We have got rid of a few assistants and dev coaches

We are about to sack the coach who’s been there during this s***show

The board who employed these current failures is gone

Now we are just left with the 30 very average AFL players that Norm Smith couldn’t coach to a finals series

Until that changes, struggle street it is!

Unless our new coach, does actually have a magic wand?!

[MC Gusto]

I don’t understand the money thing? Yes understand we are in debt, but seriously how much can paying out the remainder of his contract be? 1/3 of a season, pro rata? That’s not massive

Certainly when you think about the money we’ve spent or tried to spend on players, assistant coaches etc. what’s the big deal??

[B.M]

It’s not paying out this season that’s the concern, it’s paying 600k for next season while paying a new coach 1M at the same time. That would be a poor business decision. Especially when there’s little to be gained for sacking him right now, as opposed to R18 when he will be sacked.

[Darth Vader]

I don’t understand the money thing? Yes understand we are in debt, but seriously how much can paying out the remainder of his contract be? 1/3 of a season, pro rata? That’s not massive

Certainly when you think about the money we’ve spent or tried to spend on players, assistant coaches etc. what’s the big deal??

It’s not our money to spend - AFL won’t let us pay out anything we don’t have to.

[Myron Gaines]

Bevo turned the Dogs around from a basket case to a flag inside 2 years. Fagan has taken the Lions from wooden spooners to top 4 in 18 months. The wheel can turn quickly. Fix the culture, fix performance. It starts with leadership (on & off field). Must get this next coaching appointment right or we are screwed for another decade.

[Bowey Boy]

Didn’t we have an extension clause with Ross Lyin?

[minneapolis]

Interesting aside
The original saying is "it's not over till the fat lady sinks "
This was a term used in American 8 ball, as the game concludes when the 8 ball sinks ( goes in the pocket)
That's why they say fat ladies at bingo for number 8

Anyway... time for AR to step down for the good of the club ... Sink seems more appropriate

While I'm at it......it's like the bastardization of the "Fremantle doctor"
It is the Fremantle "docker" because when we had sailing ships they had to wait for that breeze to come into port up river

I heard the same about fat lady and billards....problem is there is yet to surface one single written reference to this saying in history up to 1976.
Prior to 1976 no one had ever written or spoken the term " it's not over until the fat lady sings"... a reference made by a USA sportscaster from opera.

I had this discussion with a mate about 5 years ago and as our wives were shopping for shoes we spent 31 days straight uninterrupted searching the net for a single written reference in billiards history to " it ain't over until the fat lady sinks"....not one until after 1976 when the infamous fat lady sings comment was made....maybe you can find one and settle the argument.

Hey Lee, are you married to Imelda Marcos?

31 days waiting while the wives were shopping for shoes deserves a Master Husband medal. I go mentally swirly after 31 minutes and my wife usually says "Oh for god sake, I will meet you at home".