Andy McGrath

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Saintmike65
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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958188Post Saintmike65 »

Life Long Saint wrote: Thu 02 Jun 2022 12:54pm I've never warmed to him as a player. I resented the fact that Essendon were even allowed to draft him.
Given the fact that most of their team was suspended for drug cheating, they were always going to finish last. The AFL should never have allowed the first pick to go to Essendon that season.

Not Andrew's fault, I know...but he's tarred with that brush now.
Totally agree with your point about Essendon holding pick 1 in that draft, despite being caught in the supplement saga.
No sympathy from me towards the bombers in their current plight!
I cannot stand Dodoro posturing and grandstanding during trade periods..full of ego and false bravado!!


saynta
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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958190Post saynta »

Saintmike65 wrote: Sat 04 Jun 2022 11:31am
Life Long Saint wrote: Thu 02 Jun 2022 12:54pm I've never warmed to him as a player. I resented the fact that Essendon were even allowed to draft him.
Given the fact that most of their team was suspended for drug cheating, they were always going to finish last. The AFL should never have allowed the first pick to go to Essendon that season.

Not Andrew's fault, I know...but he's tarred with that brush now.
Totally agree with your point about Essendon holding pick 1 in that draft, despite being caught in the supplement saga.
No sympathy from me towards the bombers in their current plight!
I cannot stand Dodoro posturing and grandstanding during trade periods..full of ego and false bravado!!
Full of ego? Yeah, maybe. Personally, I think he's full of s***.


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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958217Post Goose is king »

The article in the herald sun from champion data has McGrath as Essendons worst kick, takin FB into account league averages on the type of kick attempted. Steele is our worst so it doesn’t mean everything. However McGrath has none of the good attributes Steele is dominant at. For me Amon>McGrath as a target.


saynta
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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958231Post saynta »

Goose is king wrote: Sat 04 Jun 2022 2:52pm The article in the herald sun from champion data has McGrath as Essendons worst kick, takin FB into account league averages on the type of kick attempted. Steele is our worst so it doesn’t mean everything. However McGrath has none of the good attributes Steele is dominant at. For me Amon>McGrath as a target.
Same article also has Seb Ross being rated by Champion Data as our best kick. :D :) 8-) :lol: :lol: :wink:

f****** blue baggers are into Amon in a big way. Mates with Voss evidently.


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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958233Post skeptic »

There’s a lot of reasons not to do a deal here but not dealing with Essendon because we’re scared they’ll screw us would be amongst the sillier ones that keeps popping up.

I’d rather have a team that knows an idiotic deal when it comes across one and doesn’t bite.

Lovett was entirely our fault. He was a well established d#!¥H3@d with a terrible work ethic, a poor attitude, multiple discretions and erratic form. Was never worth anything close to a first round pick. Deal should never have happened and the fact that we bought Essendon’s character reference BS was a sign of how inept an organisation we were.

Carlisle had positives going for him but his implication on the doping scandal, known unsavoury history and unwillingness to do what the bombers wanted in terms of position always made him a highly risky proposition.
Not a disaster but ultimately not a great outcome

Regardless of these… we shouldn’t be afraid to seek out a good trade for the right deal with the nerve to say no.

A potential McGrath trade has a lot of red flags. A lot.

Firstly… the guy would demand big money over an extended period I’m sure. Way more than what he’s worth and beyond the level that he’s capable of performing at.
A sure fire way of returning to mediocrity is tying up the salary cap with players that aren’t playing to what they’re worth.
May cost us players that want more or prevent actually good players from being enticed

Secondly… Essendon will want an arm and a leg. At minimum, first round pick and a good player for a kind of good player that is erratic and can be freezed out.
Maybe he’s around the level of Billings… maybe. But on a good day, Jack does some freakishly good things up forward and either kicks goals or creates them. McGrath gets uncontested kicks and tries to set up play which is fine but the non elite version of this type of player is a dime a dozen

Personally, I’d offer a second rounder with a 22-28 rated player from the list... Max. That’s what he’s worth.

Finally… you make this deal happen and you once again signal to rival clubs that we’re fools that trade treasure for trash.
Give us your Hanneberys, Carlisles, Kents etc

It’s taken us years to shake this rep and we’re just now getting to the point where we’re able to erase the damage from the list

Like I said earlier… if you’re going to pay through the nose, at least get a star for the trouble. Many suggested we went overs for Hill but he was a proven talent that has found his spot and no one is complaining about the deal now.


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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958244Post happy feet »

Vortex wrote: Sat 04 Jun 2022 10:47am
B.M wrote: Thu 02 Jun 2022 7:27pm McGrath is NOT what we need

He is bog average as a mid and we have plenty of small defenders

He’s nowhere near as good as Sinclair

Would be a dumb recruiting decision- so he’ll probably be a Saint
They've been keen on Billings in the past, maybe a swaping of two bog average players could be the spark each needs to pull their fingers out. Our recruiters would be silly not to discuss a straight swap because Billings seems have reached his cieling at St Kilda.
Silliest suggestion I have seen in a long time.


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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958246Post magnifisaint »

Vortex wrote: Sat 04 Jun 2022 10:47am
B.M wrote: Thu 02 Jun 2022 7:27pm McGrath is NOT what we need

He is bog average as a mid and we have plenty of small defenders

He’s nowhere near as good as Sinclair

Would be a dumb recruiting decision- so he’ll probably be a Saint
They've been keen on Billings in the past, maybe a swaping of two bog average players could be the spark each needs to pull their fingers out. Our recruiters would be silly not to discuss a straight swap because Billings seems have reached his cieling at St Kilda.
Please!
McGrath has nothing on Billings plus he just signed a new contract. St Kilda don't want to get rid of Billings. You do!


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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958277Post Vortex »

magnifisaint wrote: Sat 04 Jun 2022 9:49pm
Vortex wrote: Sat 04 Jun 2022 10:47am
B.M wrote: Thu 02 Jun 2022 7:27pm McGrath is NOT what we need

He is bog average as a mid and we have plenty of small defenders

He’s nowhere near as good as Sinclair

Would be a dumb recruiting decision- so he’ll probably be a Saint
They've been keen on Billings in the past, maybe a swaping of two bog average players could be the spark each needs to pull their fingers out. Our recruiters would be silly not to discuss a straight swap because Billings seems have reached his cieling at St Kilda.
Please!
McGrath has nothing on Billings plus he just signed a new contract. St Kilda don't want to get rid of Billings. You do!
Billings is playing in the seconds. Probably will end up at another club. Just the reality of the situation.


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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958345Post B.M »

Billings had zero pre season and missed the first 6 games… a bit behind the 8 ball.

He and Hunter Clark are so far above VFL it’s ridiculous


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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958348Post Laurie »

Yes,they are above VFL standard however give me Clark in the side well before Billings any day .
BOOM BOOM


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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958349Post Laurie »

Yes,they are above VFL standard however give me Clark in the side well before Billings any day .
BOOM BOOM


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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958366Post Shaggy »

Vortex wrote: Sun 05 Jun 2022 10:11am
magnifisaint wrote: Sat 04 Jun 2022 9:49pm
Vortex wrote: Sat 04 Jun 2022 10:47am
B.M wrote: Thu 02 Jun 2022 7:27pm McGrath is NOT what we need

He is bog average as a mid and we have plenty of small defenders

He’s nowhere near as good as Sinclair

Would be a dumb recruiting decision- so he’ll probably be a Saint
They've been keen on Billings in the past, maybe a swaping of two bog average players could be the spark each needs to pull their fingers out. Our recruiters would be silly not to discuss a straight swap because Billings seems have reached his cieling at St Kilda.
Please!
McGrath has nothing on Billings plus he just signed a new contract. St Kilda don't want to get rid of Billings. You do!
Billings is playing in the seconds. Probably will end up at another club. Just the reality of the situation.
Cognitive bias. You have been pushing against Billings for years. First time dropped and now you believe it proves he is history with the Saints despite missing most of 2022 due to injury. The Adelaide game showed he needs to get fit rather than being rushed back.


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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958402Post Vortex »

Shaggy wrote: Sun 05 Jun 2022 11:44pm
Vortex wrote: Sun 05 Jun 2022 10:11am
magnifisaint wrote: Sat 04 Jun 2022 9:49pm
Vortex wrote: Sat 04 Jun 2022 10:47am
B.M wrote: Thu 02 Jun 2022 7:27pm McGrath is NOT what we need

He is bog average as a mid and we have plenty of small defenders

He’s nowhere near as good as Sinclair

Would be a dumb recruiting decision- so he’ll probably be a Saint
They've been keen on Billings in the past, maybe a swaping of two bog average players could be the spark each needs to pull their fingers out. Our recruiters would be silly not to discuss a straight swap because Billings seems have reached his cieling at St Kilda.
Please!
McGrath has nothing on Billings plus he just signed a new contract. St Kilda don't want to get rid of Billings. You do!
Billings is playing in the seconds. Probably will end up at another club. Just the reality of the situation.
Cognitive bias. You have been pushing against Billings for years. First time dropped and now you believe it proves he is history with the Saints despite missing most of 2022 due to injury. The Adelaide game showed he needs to get fit rather than being rushed back.
So does Ratts have cognitive bias also? He might be a high draft pick but he's in the Sandy side for a reason. How he responds will be what matters.


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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958407Post CQ SAINT »

St.Kilda supporters can be fickle farkers, but the reality with Billings is, we have been waiting a while, with an expectation of more.
I hope he delivers it this year, without injury or rollercoasting performances. We have been confident he will but as yet he hasn't.
Making the difficult look easy, 20+ possessions as a high half forward, yet the impact has been average, if not ordinary.
Otherwise, he may rejoin the most promising young players in the list, vying for the same positions and frankly, he might just be out gunned.
He is the only one who should be questioned on his form and only he can answer.


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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958520Post Goose is king »

Thank go he signed an extension with Essendon


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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958522Post Banger9798 »

Billings has produced in the past and he has done it often.

Yes he has had some ordinary patches, but his demotion is down to conditioning.

He is a very good player and is best 22 easily.

Watch his second half of the season,, a fit JB will be crucial in September


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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958523Post B.M »

Hasn’t Billings got 40 odd Brownlow votes

I think is is marked hard because of his draft position- supporters want him to be better!

He is a HF

Hardest position in footy, especially in a poor team

To average 20 and nearly a goal per game is good numbers… if it weren’t for his inaccurate goal kicking he’d be A Grade


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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958524Post bangaulegend »

Spot on because he was number 3 supporters did expect more & I can see why but as Pav said on another post Re - JB not the worst pick no. 3 & not the best , but still a handy player we just need to get over it & accept it for what it is .


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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958527Post SaintPav »

saynta wrote: Sat 04 Jun 2022 6:40pm
Goose is king wrote: Sat 04 Jun 2022 2:52pm The article in the herald sun from champion data has McGrath as Essendons worst kick, takin FB into account league averages on the type of kick attempted. Steele is our worst so it doesn’t mean everything. However McGrath has none of the good attributes Steele is dominant at. For me Amon>McGrath as a target.
Same article also has Seb Ross being rated by Champion Data as our best kick. :D :) 8-) :lol: :lol: :wink:

f****** blue baggers are into Amon in a big way. Mates with Voss evidently.
This is getting ridiculous.

Don’t Carlton have a salary cap?

Are we still in the running?


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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958530Post CQ SAINT »

Billings was dropped because he was under done and played pretty average football. He is probably in the best side he has played in and has been carrying injuries for while and none of thats got anything to do with him being a number 3 draft pick.


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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958532Post bangaulegend »

CQ SAINT wrote: Tue 07 Jun 2022 9:38pm Billings was dropped because he was under done and played pretty average football. He is probably in the best side he has played in and has been carrying injuries for while and none of thats got anything to do with him being a number 3 draft pick.
And who said it was :?


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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958533Post Brunswicksainter »

skeptic wrote: Sat 04 Jun 2022 7:06pm There’s a lot of reasons not to do a deal here but not dealing with Essendon because we’re scared they’ll screw us would be amongst the sillier ones that keeps popping up.

I’d rather have a team that knows an idiotic deal when it comes across one and doesn’t bite.

Lovett was entirely our fault. He was a well established d#!¥H3@d with a terrible work ethic, a poor attitude, multiple discretions and erratic form. Was never worth anything close to a first round pick. Deal should never have happened and the fact that we bought Essendon’s character reference BS was a sign of how inept an organisation we were.

Carlisle had positives going for him but his implication on the doping scandal, known unsavoury history and unwillingness to do what the bombers wanted in terms of position always made him a highly risky proposition.
Not a disaster but ultimately not a great outcome

Regardless of these… we shouldn’t be afraid to seek out a good trade for the right deal with the nerve to say no.

A potential McGrath trade has a lot of red flags. A lot.

Firstly… the guy would demand big money over an extended period I’m sure. Way more than what he’s worth and beyond the level that he’s capable of performing at.
A sure fire way of returning to mediocrity is tying up the salary cap with players that aren’t playing to what they’re worth.
May cost us players that want more or prevent actually good players from being enticed

Secondly… Essendon will want an arm and a leg. At minimum, first round pick and a good player for a kind of good player that is erratic and can be freezed out.
Maybe he’s around the level of Billings… maybe. But on a good day, Jack does some freakishly good things up forward and either kicks goals or creates them. McGrath gets uncontested kicks and tries to set up play which is fine but the non elite version of this type of player is a dime a dozen

Personally, I’d offer a second rounder with a 22-28 rated player from the list... Max. That’s what he’s worth.

Finally… you make this deal happen and you once again signal to rival clubs that we’re fools that trade treasure for trash.
Give us your Hanneberys, Carlisles, Kents etc

It’s taken us years to shake this rep and we’re just now getting to the point where we’re able to erase the damage from the list

Like I said earlier… if you’re going to pay through the nose, at least get a star for the trouble. Many suggested we went overs for Hill but he was a proven talent that has found his spot and no one is complaining about the deal now.
People forget but we won the Carlisle trade hands down. We would have for sure drafted Aaron Francis with that pick (were Heavily linked before trade period)… some careers he’s gone on to have

Also got Gresh out of that deal.


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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958537Post SunnyErnie »

Forget about McGrath. Karl Amon is our man. Get him as a Free Agent and we are laughing. Pace and class is what we need with the added bonus we retain our draft picks so we can grab more guns in the draft. Win win IMHO. Just like Crouch was.

If we can grab a Free Agent every year and keep hitting the draft every year then the sky is the limit.


St Kilda should never trade with Essendon and Sydney ever again!!!

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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958555Post Banger9798 »

SunnyErnie wrote: Tue 07 Jun 2022 11:08pm Forget about McGrath. Karl Amon is our man. Get him as a Free Agent and we are laughing. Pace and class is what we need with the added bonus we retain our draft picks so we can grab more guns in the draft. Win win IMHO. Just like Crouch was.

If we can grab a Free Agent every year and keep hitting the draft every year then the sky is the limit.
FFS, just get his Mum to make him nominate us


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Re: Andy McGrath

Post: # 1958565Post saynta »

SaintPav wrote: Tue 07 Jun 2022 8:45pm
saynta wrote: Sat 04 Jun 2022 6:40pm
Goose is king wrote: Sat 04 Jun 2022 2:52pm The article in the herald sun from champion data has McGrath as Essendons worst kick, takin FB into account league averages on the type of kick attempted. Steele is our worst so it doesn’t mean everything. However McGrath has none of the good attributes Steele is dominant at. For me Amon>McGrath as a target.
Same article also has Seb Ross being rated by Champion Data as our best kick. :D :) 8-) :lol: :lol: :wink:

f****** blue baggers are into Amon in a big way. Mates with Voss evidently.
This is getting ridiculous.

Don’t Carlton have a salary cap?

Are we still in the running?
Salary caps have never worried those see you next tueday's before. The very reason they are called brown baggers


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