Vortex wrote: ↑Mon 15 Apr 2024 12:21pm
skeptic wrote: ↑Mon 15 Apr 2024 11:38am
Sanctorum wrote: ↑Sat 13 Apr 2024 12:05pm
What's happened to the presumption of innocence??
In recent times state DPPs have come under severe criticism from judges for prosecuting alleged male perpetrators of sexual crimes against women only for these to be thrown out of court for lack of evidence.
In some European countries the media are allowed to publish only the initials of people charged with committing an offence. That provision should also be adopted in Australia!
It’s a reasonable point IMO or at least a conversation that has to be had.
When you have these big social movements like Me Too, my experience is that in the first instance, often things tend to get over course corrected.
It is hugely HUGELY important that we move away from the time of running victims down after the come forward, disregarding, shaming and seeking to discredit them in the sense that it’s the easiest way to have an inconvenient, horrible truth go away.
The flipside is of course as you’ve pointed out… we abide by the principle of innocent until proven guilty. I don’t know what’s in place with Carl in terms of evidence (I have no insight into the case whatsoever)… But regardless of what happens from this point (innocent, guilty, charges dismissed due to lack of evidence… whatever), his legacy is destroyed.
Though the news was always going to get out, it pbly shouldn’t have been reported like this in the news. I don’t know, what do other people think
I have a very similar story to Asiu with a friend who is in his 60s and just had his court case a few weeks ago. It was an event that took place 50 years ago between a then 14 yo girl and 16 yo boy. The judge through it out in minutes, however for my friend he has had his life ruined, spent 170k, has travel restrictions. All because he was advised to plead guilty by all of his lawyers based on the complexity of the current legal system and it meaning a lesser punishment.
Interestingly a few days after the court case, it was reported in the media the NSW AG and minister for justice were going to review all of the sexual abuse allegation cases, over 400, currently waiting to be heard in the NSW courts. They were claiming the PP we’re not doing their job properly as most of the cases didn’t pass the pub test but were sending the cases to the courts to have the courts deal with it only for many of them to be batted away quickly.
My friend is quite wealthy and it is suspected the girl was after his money as she now has the green light to pursue him for his money in a civil case. This was a single carnal knowledge event that happened over 50 years ago and no claim of abuse or rape or any violence, essentially a consenting sexual act between 2 teenagers.
This circumstances are very tricky
When I was a mental health case manager, i was allocated a person that was in their early 30s. When I met him, he was on treatment for Bipolar - overweight, self-care wasn’t great, very depressed.
A few years back, they had been a social worker with what was formally Child Protection Services. They were allocated to meet with a young female (teenager in refuge services) about whatever social supports were on offer - he states that he didn’t feel safe going by himself as she had a big trauma history.
This man was openly gay and said that it was suggested that because of his sexuality, there wouldn’t be any issues.
He went and did the assessment and then a few days later a sexual assault claim emerged that he denied. He said that whilst he wasn’t forced to leave… nobody in the office would talk to him anymore, he got allocated the worst hours and jobs… then was effectively performance managed out of the job… went from getting a promotion 6 months earlier to underperforming the whole time.
Couldn’t get another job as he got flagged on the system as being involved in a child sex incident.
Because of the loss of income, he lost mortgage and his long term relationship fell apart.
Through the stress of it all… he had a breakdown and developed Bipolar. Started heavy duty meds, stacked on weight, functioning/self-care deteriorated rapidly.
Matter went to court a few years later.
Under oath, the young lady that made the allegations retracted them. Stated that she was in a terrible place at the time, the system had walked her into abusive situations on numerous occasions, she hated it and everyone in it and at the time, just wanted to destroy a part of it.
He was vindicated. She went to jail.
5-6 years after that outcome… his name still pops up on any working with children’s check as someone involved in a child sex incident.
He can’t get that removed and has a whole bunch of professional options closed to him. I dug around as much as I reasonably could and it looks like the story checks out as described
I case managed that person for maybe 2 years and they were in a reasonable place when I left… but I think about that sometimes.
That person’s whole life was destroyed for no good reasons. They’ll never get back the things they had or the life they were building. It resonated with me a bit because whilst I never worked in this particular area… I was the same age and general field when this happened to them.
Not making a point… but yeah, the system is complicated.
These days I work at a court… the concept that it’s a better outcome for people to plead guilty vs fighting for their innocence is a real thing that people deal with everyday.
Plead guilty to this offence and have time served/fine/go on an adjourned undertaking, or contest it and stay in custody until the next court date in 6 weeks.
