Where have the Saints gone?

[saintsRrising]

So Milne as an Essendon reject...is not a Saints man?

GTrain played for the Eagles and to the best of my knowledge is now a Saints man through and through....but he is now not a "Saints man" ?


Why does being at another club first rule you out of becoming a "Saints man"?

We picked up Winmar after he had played senior footy in WA. Why does that make him suitable to be a "Saints man " and someone like Gram who playeda few games at the Lions not?


I once sat an a game with an ex-StKilda rover from an era ago sitting behind me...he spent the game barracking for the Blues!!!

[WayneJudson42]

Good point SB.

I think being a supporter is more of a labour of love. When you're young, nothing really matters, but when you get older, you adopt more "adult" points of view.

Footty has been a business way back since the latter years of the VFL. If you want an eilte comp, you gotta move with the times... and that involves $$$. Like it or not. This entails comercial decisions and compromises.

These days, I keep it simple by putting it into perspective with my entire life. That way, I don't get to stressed about it.

I pay my money... I watch my team. That's where I'm a bit more rational, in that I see my membership as a way to see games and help the club. I have been raised to believe that when you give, do it without expecting in return.

I'm confidant enough in myself, and don't have a deep seated "yearning" to be acknowledged by the club TBH.

[rodgerfox]

Why does being at another club first rule you out of becoming a "Saints man"?

It doesn't.

Not sure where anyone has said that??

[iwantmeseats]

gee, a bit disappointing this thread. but at the same time I can understand the points Roger and JB are making.

As I have mentioned before, I think this may have a certain amount to do with how the club interacts with its members. It NEEDS to embrace them more and make them feel more like a part of the whole grand plan ( its NOT rocket science). I think the stink may have set in when we lost whats his face, sorry Im light on the names and details, he was running the membership department at the time I think.

The shafting of members with reserved seats on L2 is the biggest disappointment for me. I dont even hold a seat on L2, but its a straight up shafting pure and simple.

Here's hoping the return of footy in 09 may just get you all stirred up a little.

[saintsRrising]

Having said that however, our lack in membership .

So this must be FACT based on your past statements.

Please post the St Kilda Membership Numbers from the "passion years" which exceed say the membership numbers from say the "passionless" 2008.

[saintsRrising]

Why does being at another club first rule you out of becoming a "Saints man"?

It doesn't.

Not sure where anyone has said that??

Then why can't Lyon, Tidur etc become Saints men?


Some who we pick up will become Saints men...others not.

This applies to kids drafted, players traded for, just as much to coaches hired.


Some will become "attached" to us...some not.

[evertonfc]

I have to say, I agree with much of what RF has said.

- I don't like how the fans are treated by the club.
- I don't like the feeling that the club is not 'ours' as it was during the early days of RB/GT. What RF said about us - as St Kilda people - striking fear into the opposition generated an extroadinary sense of pride.
- The loss of community in the club. Saintsational is more of a community than St Kilda FC. We are now considered customers.
- Why has the club's public profile died? Everyone got scared because of the final days under RB - but who says you have to be a tossbag in public? Look at someone like Eddie McGuire or the way David Smorgan used to do it. All class and the club looks fantastic.
- Why have Burkey and Thommo gone so quiet?
- Why is the club considered the most media-unfriendly and stand-offish?
- Where is the f****** soul of the club? Moorabbin? Seaford? Casey? TD? Sandringham?

I guess I could throw in something about the list or the playing style, but since that is a coaching-specific issue, more to do with Ross Lyon than those others at the club.

[rodgerfox]

Having said that however, our lack in membership .

So this must be FACT based on your past statements.

Please post the St Kilda Membership Numbers from the "passion years" which exceed say the membership numbers from say the "passionless" 2008.

"The optimism that is surrounding St Kilda heading into the 2006 season is translating into an off-field boom for the club as long-suffering Saints fans clamour to become members. With the start of the pre-season still more than a week away, the Saints already have more than 21,000 members, around 2000 more than the same time last year. And with 1000 additional members usually equating to around $100,000 in additional revenue, it is a huge boost to the once struggling club - whose financial performance off the field has improved just as much as its on-field performance in recent years. Such is the growth in St Kilda membership in recent years that this year the club signed up some 18,000 members before Christmas, which was more than its entire membership of 17,696 in 2002."


We currently have 14708 members.

Well, well down.

Pre-Season 2006 we were coming off a Top 4 finish and a Prelim appearance. We had over 18,000 members before Xmas.

Pre-Season 2009 we are too. We now have under 15,000 members.

[Saints94]

I have to say, I agree with much of what RF has said.

- I don't like how the fans are treated by the club.
- I don't like the feeling that the club is not 'ours' as it was during the early days of RB/GT. What RF said about us - as St Kilda people - striking fear into the opposition generated an extroadinary sense of pride.
- The loss of community in the club. Saintsational is more of a community than St Kilda FC. We are now considered customers.
- Why has the club's public profile died? Everyone got scared because of the final days under RB - but who says you have to be a tossbag in public? Look at someone like Eddie McGuire or the way David Smorgan used to do it. All class and the club looks fantastic.
- Why have Burkey and Thommo gone so quiet?
- Why is the club considered the most media-unfriendly and stand-offish?
- Where is the f****** soul of the club? Moorabbin? Seaford? Casey? TD? Sandringham?

I guess I could throw in something about the list or the playing style, but since that is a coaching-specific issue, more to do with Ross Lyon than those others at the club.

Thats exactly right Everton Morabin isn't our home what is St.Kilda fc treats our fans like s*** i farking hate it there isn't any love or soul at our club

[iwantmeseats]

hmmm, I wonder if other clubs have as many fickle supporters as we do?

[Saints94]

hmmm, I wonder if other clubs have as many fickle supporters as we do?

Freo, Collingwood etc.

[WayneJudson42]

Having said that however, our lack in membership .

So this must be FACT based on your past statements.

Please post the St Kilda Membership Numbers from the "passion years" which exceed say the membership numbers from say the "passionless" 2008.

"The optimism that is surrounding St Kilda heading into the 2006 season is translating into an off-field boom for the club as long-suffering Saints fans clamour to become members. With the start of the pre-season still more than a week away, the Saints already have more than 21,000 members, around 2000 more than the same time last year. And with 1000 additional members usually equating to around $100,000 in additional revenue, it is a huge boost to the once struggling club - whose financial performance off the field has improved just as much as its on-field performance in recent years. Such is the growth in St Kilda membership in recent years that this year the club signed up some 18,000 members before Christmas, which was more than its entire membership of 17,696 in 2002."


We currently have 14708 members.

Well, well down.

Pre-Season 2006 we were coming off a Top 4 finish and a Prelim appearance. We had over 18,000 members before Xmas.

Pre-Season 2009 we are too. We now have under 15,000 members.

So how do you justify the 2008 numbers given that we'd sacked GT and finished 9th with RL and played like crap? On your logic, 08 should have seen a drastic decline in memberships.

[WayneJudson42]

Sorry to double post... but here's something out of left field.

YOU make your own passion. You don't rely on the club to do it for you. In life, you make your own happiness, and not rely on others to do it for you.

The dissapointments seems to be coming from people's expectations about what they want.

Just as success breeds success... negativity breeds negativity as is evidenced in this thread.

I'm as excited and optimistic as I have been every January for the last 38 years.

[rodgerfox]

So how do you justify the 2008 numbers given that we'd sacked GT and finished 9th with RL and played like crap? On your logic, 08 should have seen a drastic decline in memberships.

It did drop by 3%.

The overall increase in club memberships in 2008 was up towards 2%.

So for us to decline by 3% is pretty significant.


Anyway, I didn't think I even put forward a logic in regards to membership numbers??

I simply suggested that a decline in members recently and limp Saints crowds may point to many others sharing my feelings in regards to support for the club.

[tweedaletomanning]

I have to say, I agree with much of what RF has said.

- I don't like how the fans are treated by the club.
- I don't like the feeling that the club is not 'ours' as it was during the early days of RB/GT. What RF said about us - as St Kilda people - striking fear into the opposition generated an extroadinary sense of pride.
- The loss of community in the club. Saintsational is more of a community than St Kilda FC. We are now considered customers.
- Why has the club's public profile died? Everyone got scared because of the final days under RB - but who says you have to be a tossbag in public? Look at someone like Eddie McGuire or the way David Smorgan used to do it. All class and the club looks fantastic.
- Why have Burkey and Thommo gone so quiet?
- Why is the club considered the most media-unfriendly and stand-offish?
- Where is the f****** soul of the club? Moorabbin? Seaford? Casey? TD? Sandringham?

I guess I could throw in something about the list or the playing style, but since that is a coaching-specific issue, more to do with Ross Lyon than those others at the club.

Sadly, you are 100% correct.

[rodgerfox]

Sorry to double post... but here's something out of left field.

YOU make your own passion. You don't rely on the club to do it for you. In life, you make your own happiness, and not rely on others to do it for you.

The dissapointments seems to be coming from people's expectations about what they want.

Just as success breeds success... negativity breeds negativity as is evidenced in this thread.

I'm as excited and optimistic as I have been every January for the last 38 years.

You've missed my point entirely.

I'm not unhappy, happy, disappointed etc. with the club. In fact the opposite. I'm finding myself not caring much about it. I don't care enough about the club and those running it to be passionate one way or the other. I've lost interest.

I think many are.

[WayneJudson42]

Sorry to double post... but here's something out of left field.

YOU make your own passion. You don't rely on the club to do it for you. In life, you make your own happiness, and not rely on others to do it for you.

The dissapointments seems to be coming from people's expectations about what they want.

Just as success breeds success... negativity breeds negativity as is evidenced in this thread.

I'm as excited and optimistic as I have been every January for the last 38 years.

You've missed my point entirely.

I'm not unhappy, happy, disappointed etc. with the club. In fact the opposite. I'm finding myself not caring much about it. I don't care enough about the club and those running it to be passionate one way or the other. I've lost interest.

I think many are.

Oh, ok. Good for you. Thanks for sharing it with us.

[saintspremiers]

So how do you justify the 2008 numbers given that we'd sacked GT and finished 9th with RL and played like crap? On your logic, 08 should have seen a drastic decline in memberships.

It did drop by 3%.

The overall increase in club memberships in 2008 was up towards 2%.

So for us to decline by 3% is pretty significant.


Anyway, I didn't think I even put forward a logic in regards to membership numbers??

I simply suggested that a decline in members recently and limp Saints crowds may point to many others sharing my feelings in regards to support for the club.

Agree.

It's not right IMO to just blame the recession on the drop in membership numbers......last year it went pear shaped from early in the new year - very few signed up from January onwards.

The club doesn't have that "passion" about it anymore, and I blame Westaway and Archie mainly.

I reckon Silvagni and Lyon, though, are developing a real passion and love for the club - and are busting their guts to get the most out of the players.

This is perhaps why we got to the Prelims last year, even given the off-field woes we now have (revenue/membership/seaford wise etc).

[tweedaletomanning]

So how do you justify the 2008 numbers given that we'd sacked GT and finished 9th with RL and played like crap? On your logic, 08 should have seen a drastic decline in memberships.

It did drop by 3%.

The overall increase in club memberships in 2008 was up towards 2%.

So for us to decline by 3% is pretty significant.


Anyway, I didn't think I even put forward a logic in regards to membership numbers??

I simply suggested that a decline in members recently and limp Saints crowds may point to many others sharing my feelings in regards to support for the club.

Rodger, you are SPOT ON!

I would like to add, the fact that we gave everything we could in the finals, and to be SOOO blown out of the water by BOTH grand Finalists, showed to everyone how FAR away we REALLY are to the ultimate prize.

Would you feel slightly different if we had just gone down by a point in the prelim?

I guess its like religion. Some of us are losing our faith, knowing that faith alone won't just make everything alright "SOMEHOW"..

[marksnsparks]

Sorry to double post... but here's something out of left field.

YOU make your own passion. You don't rely on the club to do it for you. In life, you make your own happiness, and not rely on others to do it for you.

The dissapointments seems to be coming from people's expectations about what they want.

Just as success breeds success... negativity breeds negativity as is evidenced in this thread.

I'm as excited and optimistic as I have been every January for the last 38 years.

You've missed my point entirely.

I'm not unhappy, happy, disappointed etc. with the club. In fact the opposite. I'm finding myself not caring much about it. I don't care enough about the club and those running it to be passionate one way or the other. I've lost interest.

I think many are.

Just an observation RF, but you are still interested enough to post on this forum. I'd say you needed to be pretty passionate or at least involved in a club to post regularly on a fan forum, especially deep into the summer!!

I suspect you just need a cuddle and for someone to tell you everythings going to be OK.

Regaring 'Sainters' at the club, I think it's not a bad thing to get fresh outside blood into a club whose name has been a byword for failure for the past 40 years.

That was hard to say, but like an alcoholic, we need to admit we have a problem before we get better...

[Banger2Plugger]

Gez, I think I have had enough of describing our relationship with the club like an old marriage loosing the sex.

Time you went to counseling old Rodge see if we can re-spark the relationship.

Passion is an emotion - fuelled only by the individual, perhaps you need to have a good look around at other aspects of your life which might be a little down.

Me, I'm a passionate saints fan throu and throu - I can't wait for the next training report, some details, and the intra club match. I want to see these new recruits and what they are going to offer us - I wanna see how RL brings the beast out of these men upon crossing that white line.

I don't care about the score - other than we are in front.

I want to see them hard at it, I want to see them strike fear into the opposition with every tackle.

I don't care about the style and flair - I want uncompromising tough football. I want wins on the board.

And if you as a long suffering saints supporter, can't be passionate or excited about a side that finished top 4 last year....

Go back to the videos and watch us languishing at the bottom of the ladder cos to me you sound like you have a bad case of being spoilt by the stkilda sides of recent years.

I'm a saints supporter, I am proud and passionate.

PS I do believe Kevin Sheedy spat a few dummies in his book - so I don't believe his departure was as dignified as some make out it to be on here.

[WayneJudson42]

Gez, I think I have had enough of describing our relationship with the club like an old marriage loosing the sex.

Time you went to counseling old Rodge see if we can re-spark the relationship.

Passion is an emotion - fuelled only by the individual, perhaps you need to have a good look around at other aspects of your life which might be a little down.

Me, I'm a passionate saints fan throu and throu - I can't wait for the next training report, some details, and the intra club match. I want to see these new recruits and what they are going to offer us - I wanna see how RL brings the beast out of these men upon crossing that white line.

I don't care about the score - other than we are in front.

I want to see them hard at it, I want to see them strike fear into the opposition with every tackle.

I don't care about the style and flair - I want uncompromising tough football. I want wins on the board.

And if you as a long suffering saints supporter, can't be passionate or excited about a side that finished top 4 last year....

Go back to the videos and watch us languishing at the bottom of the ladder cos to me you sound like you have a bad case of being spoilt by the stkilda sides of recent years.

I'm a saints supporter, I am proud and passionate.

PS I do believe Kevin Sheedy spat a few dummies in his book - so I don't believe his departure was as dignified as some make out it to be on here.

Agree. I suggest it's more of a case of the wife reinventing herself, getting some plastic surgery and getting on with life... then one day, Hubby wakes up to find a different woman he fell in love with. So rather than embrace the change, Hubby prefers to whinge about "the good old days" when Missus did everything to keep him happy.

As a member, I have never felt wanted or unwanted. Too many people looking for:

1- a reason to complain for the sake of complaining

2- someone to fulfill their need to feel as if they belong.

Passion comes from within.

I do find it odd that people come here to attack the club for not embracing them, yet are happy to pile shyt on players and staff.

TBH, if I was AF, I wouldn't be too keen to embrace some posters, given the scorn they pour on him. Likewise for some of the players.

It's almost like going to the pub and getting knocked back by a girl. "Oh but I'm attracted to you, so why do you treat me with contempt and not accept my offer for sex? You b1tch!" Dumb logic.

Meh, maybe I don't let it worry me as some it does some... which BTW is cool, as you're entitled to live your life as you see fit.

[rodgerfox]

It's almost like going to the pub and getting knocked back by a girl. "Oh but I'm attracted to you, so why do you treat me with contempt and not accept my offer for sex? You b1tch!" Dumb logic.

That's incredibly dumb logic. And I'm completely perplexed as to how that relates to this thread in any way shape or form??

[rodgerfox]

Gez, I think I have had enough of describing our relationship with the club like an old marriage loosing the sex.

Time you went to counseling old Rodge see if we can re-spark the relationship.

Passion is an emotion - fuelled only by the individual, perhaps you need to have a good look around at other aspects of your life which might be a little down.

Me, I'm a passionate saints fan throu and throu - I can't wait for the next training report, some details, and the intra club match. I want to see these new recruits and what they are going to offer us - I wanna see how RL brings the beast out of these men upon crossing that white line.

I don't care about the score - other than we are in front.

I want to see them hard at it, I want to see them strike fear into the opposition with every tackle.

I don't care about the style and flair - I want uncompromising tough football. I want wins on the board.

And if you as a long suffering saints supporter, can't be passionate or excited about a side that finished top 4 last year....

Go back to the videos and watch us languishing at the bottom of the ladder cos to me you sound like you have a bad case of being spoilt by the stkilda sides of recent years.

I'm a saints supporter, I am proud and passionate.

PS I do believe Kevin Sheedy spat a few dummies in his book - so I don't believe his departure was as dignified as some make out it to be on here.

You're welcome to your view.

But like a few others, you've missed my point.

[degruch]

Does this thread actually have a point?