Something old, something new.

[saynta]

https://www.saints.com.au/news/1322527/ ... difference

"While St Kilda's young core have rightly been earning headlines, the behind-the-scenes work of the older and wiser Seb Ross has been just as important. "


..........read on.

[Banger9798]

Damn good player

[B.M]

He’s to blame for some lean years

I don’t care if he was the best player, it was his fault!!!

Would never get a game in a good team!!!!

StKs worst ever dual B&F

[saynta]

He’s to blame for some lean years

I don’t care if he was the best player, it was his fault!!!

Would never get a game in a good team!!!!

StKs worst ever dual B&F

[The_Dud]

He’s to blame for some lean years

I don’t care if he was the best player, it was his fault!!!

Would never get a game in a good team!!!!

StKs worst ever dual B&F

Yes probably would have struggled getting a game in the midfield of the top teams.

Not sure how good Ken Walker, Reg Garvin, Harold Bray or Lance Oswald were, but yes could easily be our worst ever dual b&f winner.

[saynta]

He’s to blame for some lean years

I don’t care if he was the best player, it was his fault!!!

Would never get a game in a good team!!!!

StKs worst ever dual B&F

Yes probably would have struggled getting a game in the midfield of the top teams.

Not sure how good Ken Walker, Reg Garvin, Harold Bray or Lance Oswald were, but yes could easily be our worst ever dual b&f winner.

Really showing your ignorance there. Well done.

Do you ever post anything positive. Give it a try, You may like the feeling.

[Teflon]

He’s to blame for some lean years

I don’t care if he was the best player, it was his fault!!!

Would never get a game in a good team!!!!

StKs worst ever dual B&F

Yes probably would have struggled getting a game in the midfield of the top teams.

Not sure how good Ken Walker, Reg Garvin, Harold Bray or Lance Oswald were, but yes could easily be our worst ever dual b&f winner.

Agree Dud good call and keep call it as you see - ignore the pc dullards
Ross is serviceable no more no less
My hope is the next year or 2 or so he’s pushed out of midfield

[saynta]

They say ignorance is bliss, but it also seems to be contagious.

I am sure RTB appreciates Seb.

[B.M]

Don’t get it?

Ross L is a master coach

S Ross is an average footballer

Ross L selects S Ross

Confusing???

By the way
If I was called the worst dual B&F winner in an AFL team
I would take it

Not sure how it relates to political correctness either???

Simple fact
Average footballers don’t win multiple B&Fs or make AA squads or get 50 Brownlow votes

Seb recruited to Hawthorn- he’d be a triple premiership player

He’s a better player than Liam Shiels

[Teflon]

Roll roll troll roll
Who gives a **** it’s a view
Don’t like it ?
Bugger off
I’m sure Ross could care less

[skeptic]

The last two years have categorically proven that his base line out outside his B&F years could have been so much better than it was.
I think like many players over that period, he fell into the trap of being comfortable, doing those dinky helicopter kicks, having too many patches with not enough touches and not being overly accountable to his opponent.

And that’s what drew the criticism on this forum.

In the last last season and a half, he’s completely pulled his finger out and become close to our consistently best player and surprise surprise… all the criticism has stopped dead in its tracks.

Remember when he played onDangerfield and let him go up and take an uncontested mark to win Geenog the match… and BM along with others said… well that’s not his role despite preaching for years and years that you follow your man and when it’s your time you go.

How about the patches of time when he was on the other side of the ground away from play for 20min and “doing his role” getting 15 touches a game.

All that BS has stopped, the excuses have stopped and there’s no need for justification.

Personally… I like his last season and a half more than his BF years… may not be getting as much ball but is consistently playing good to great things, and is heavily involved in the big moments and turning games.

If we’d seen more of this… he’d go down as an all time great

[B.M]

It’s a ridiculous view

Embarrassingly so

[B.M]

The criticism has stopped because he’s made posters look stupid

Since 2016 he’s been a quality player, since 2018 a leader

Has had a super career

Changed roles
Tagged in 2020
Played wing in 2021
Back inside for the last couple of season

[saynta]

The criticism has stopped because he’s made posters look stupid

Since 2016 he’s been a quality player, since 2018 a leader

Has had a super career

Changed roles
Tagged in 2020
Played wing in 2021
Back inside for the last couple of season

He sure has, hence the hate. I have continually posted much the same over the years.

It is obvious that some have never understood the roles his coaches have given him.

I posted the OP so SS posters could get a look into Seb and his career to date. I did not forsee it as a platform to further abuse and denigrate him.

Unfortunately I gave some SS posters more credit than they deserve.

[Ghost Like]

I posted the OP so SS posters could get a look into Seb and his career to date. I did not forsee it as a platform to further abuse and denigrate him.

Thank you for posting the link saynta but to be fair it was his greatest supporter who opened up that can of worms by trying to be a smart ar$e. Trying to make out as if no one else has ever given him credit or any form of appreciation...actually making up his own quotes and attributing them to the entire forum's beliefs.

[The_Dud]

Seb is a good to very good player.

Great? Elite? Superstar? No.

He thrives in a better team, like most. Rising tide lifting all ships etc.

[saynta]

Seb is a good to very good player.

Great? Elite? Superstar? No.

He thrives in a better team, like most. Rising tide lifting all ships etc.

Better.

[cwrcyn]

I thought last year he was one of our best, and probably was our best in the second half of the season when we were struggling.

He's a tireless worker, and I'd have him in our top three players this year so far.

I never understood the criticism of him.

[skeptic]

The criticism has stopped because he’s made posters look stupid

Since 2016 he’s been a quality player, since 2018 a leader

Has had a super career

Changed roles
Tagged in 2020
Played wing in 2021
Back inside for the last couple of season

So walk me through the logic

He’s been a quality player since 2016 and was heavily criticised due to emotional, irrational dislike by supporters… but that’s suddenly stopped in the last year and a half, outside of his B&F years without him improving.

That’s what you’re suggesting.

So if he hasn’t improved…
Is your argument that the emotionally irrational, hateful supporters have suddenly decided not to become emotionally irrational, hateful supporters.

Is that what you’re arguing?

That he’s playing the same as he always has and suddenly the people that were criticising him for it have stopped? You can’t really believe that BM.
Equally unlikely is the logic that supporters that didn’t rate him suddenly started too even though he hasn’t improved and they already hated him.

So which is it

[B.M]

It is pretty simple

He’s a good player, has been for 8 years

He hasn’t suddenly got better he’s always been good

It’s supporters who are fickle and ignorant


Who do we blame for poor seasons? Who is the scapegoat??
The best player - who for some reason should be better

2020 - 2021
What was different
Change of role - to a less offensive role
COVID
Twins

Did he suddenly get worse - of course not, that is stupid - he was just used differently.

On improvement
In 2017 at 24 he was a B&F and again at 26 - that was his peak
He improved to that point

Did you expect him to keep going and be as good as Dangerfield?

[skeptic]

It is pretty simple

He’s a good player, has been for 8 years

He hasn’t suddenly got better he’s always been good

It’s supporters who are fickle and ignorant


Who do we blame for poor seasons? Who is the scapegoat??
The best player - who for some reason should be better

2020 - 2021
What was different
Change of role - to a less offensive role
COVID
Twins

Did he suddenly get worse - of course not, that is stupid - he was just used differently.

On improvement
In 2017 at 24 he was a B&F and again at 26 - that was his peak
He improved to that point

Did you expect him to keep going and be as good as Dangerfield?

So your argument is that the fickle supporters who irrationally hate him have now changed their mind. He was a scape goat but isn’t anymore.

Good stuff

[B.M]

That’s exactly it

When we were poor, someone needed to be responsible

Allan Richardson, Seb Ross, MAV Weller and Jack Newnes were to blame

Not
Woeful list management decisions that meant we had a lot of poor players on the list
Poor recruiting
Injuries to key players
Poor player development

We wanted to put our frustrations on individuals

Seb was one of those who was blamed

Just read this forum to see that

[B.M]

Oh

And they haven’t changed their mind

They just pretend they never potted him, and justify their bulls***!

[Sainter_Dad]

I love the night of the Trevor Barker Awards
I love that we have players who are deemed Best and Fairest

I hate a system that rewards mediocrity

Trevor Barker Award voting system:

Five coaches (Senior Coach plus 4x Assistant Coaches) will vote in each match.
Not all players need to be given a vote
A poor result may see only 3-4 players receive votes, a strong result might see 15-16 players
Coaches to vote confidentially, ie. not confer with each other
Each player can receive votes as follows:
1 vote: played role effectively (but should not be used as an encouragement reward)

2 votes: among the best for St Kilda in this game

3 votes: one, two or very occasionally, three players who are deemed the very best on ground

4 votes: an exceptionally outstanding game, very rarely given (say 10+ goals, or 45+ possessions)

So:
A player plays 22 games 'effectively' they will poll 110 votes

A player who plays 11 games and is 'among the best for St Kilda in this game' will poll 110 votes

A player who plays 7 games and is deemed 'the very best on ground' loses to both these players

WE REWARD CONSISTENT MEDIOCRITY
Prove me wrong!!!!!!

Last year from #4 down we did not even have players who 'played their role effectively for 22 games!!!!

I would not rate the TBA as a career milestone - sorry - it is an award mired in Average.

I would use average Brownlow votes more (but even this is a midfielders award) - and Seb averages .25 of a vote per game (same as Armo, Heath Black, Adrian Fletcher) I am happy with this as there are only 3 players on our list with a better average - Steele is on .54 votes per game

I look at Seb overall as a a good warrior who excelled in our average years - but seriously - until very recently I would shut my eyes when he had the ball

[skeptic]

That’s exactly it

When we were poor, someone needed to be responsible

Allan Richardson, Seb Ross, MAV Weller and Jack Newnes were to blame

Not
Woeful list management decisions that meant we had a lot of poor players on the list
Poor recruiting
Injuries to key players
Poor player development

We wanted to put our frustrations on individuals

Seb was one of those who was blamed

Just read this forum to see that

Garbage BM.

Simply garbage bordering on delusion. Injuries, poor development and recruiting are universally accepted on this forum as issues that we’ve had to deal with and things that we’ve done poorly. List management too.

Like everything else with Seb, you play favourites and twist things to justify you’re own bias.

This would be contender for worst post of the year