Where have the Saints gone?

[rodgerfox]

Been wondering for a while exactly why my love of AFL footy and the Saints is continuing to wane at a rapid rate.

This is a club that was once a lifestyle for me. Life would revolve around where we were playing the coming weekend, and my mood depended on whether we won or not.

My daily routine consisted of scouring every newspaper and website for any hint of Saints related news.

And forget about Thursday. I'd be useless until the teams were announced. Then even worse on the Friday. My weekends were totally dictated by the footy.

Going back a few years before that as a kid, I'd go down to training with my mate at least twice a week. We'd ended up knowing the whole team and coaches and they'd even let us help out at training. Before games at Moorabbin, we'd sneak into the rooms as the boys were getting ready. Most of the time, they'd let us stay in there.

The place was full of 'Saints men'.

When we played away, my mate and I would go to the Supermarket early in the morning and stock up on supplies with our pocket money, then jump on the train at Bentleigh station and hea to enemy territory. I'd be as nervous as I was when I played myself!

I had a scrapbook with pictures from the paper of every player, and I'd head down to Moorabbin and get them signed. I still have that scrapbook actually.

I was the only kid at my high school to become a member of the Plugger Squad. Some club (I have no idea what it was actually in aid of) that got you a Plugger badge and a bunch of Plugger postcards.

Basically, I was a Saints fiend. A complete and utter footy head.


As a young adult, I probably got worse. I stopped playing myself so all my energy went into following and supporting the Saints.

The newspaper cutouts and stalking players for autographs at training ceased, but the intense beer fuelled footy discussions at the pub after work started. This also coincided with us playing good footy under Stan.

I was probably more intense and obsessed with the Saints and the footy than ever.

The passion became more fierce when Watson was in charge. We were shiit. And we needed to be defended. I needed to defend us, because nothing was happening on the field to suggest we could look after ourselves! I had to go into bat for us at every opportunity.

Then things changed. The Saints were overtaken by men with a strut. With a swagger. Saints men were back in charge. But Saints men who didn't seem content with being everyone's 'second team'.

When GT took over as coach, I never felt better about the Saints. We had a Saint as Pres, a Saint as Coach and a real sense of belief in the club. It eminated throughout the supporter base - and it scared the rest of the footy world.


Now fast forward to the present.

Where have all the Saints gone?

Ross Lyon. Silvagni. Drain. Fraser. Tudor.

These guys aren't 'Saints'. They're employees of the club. Not a part of it's makeup.

Even the playing list is looking more and more like a rep side instead of a Saints team. At one point recently, over a third of the players on the ground in Saints jumpers had been with another club only 12 months earlier.

Burke and Thompson are clearly Saints - but we don't see these guys. To be honest, I couldn't even tell you if they're still even on the Board or not.

There just doesn't seem to be anything 'Saints' about the Saints anymore.

Some would argue that perhaps this a good thing? Maybe it took Hawthorn to can the strategy of giving every job at the place to a 80's premiership player, for them to win a flag and move forward?


I find it very hard to get passionate about the club right now. The Saints were a big part of my life. Win, lose or draw.

The club at the moment seems far more like a business with employees, than a footy club with heart and passion.

I can't support a business with passion and emotion like I supported and followed a footy club.

[spert]

It is a bit quiet on the Saints front, but maybe that's a good thing. All the years of controversies, star recruits, coaching and board public spats, playing at the boggy old Moorabbin ground or Arctic Park etc etc, have not delivered us the next premiership. I am hoping that the board and coaching team are quietly formulating the next assult on a flag for the long-suffering Sainter. I see the situation of Richmond recruiting Cousins and all the public fanfare involved, as something the Saints club of years gone by, would have done in desperation.

[Leo.J]

...I find it very hard to get passionate about the club right now. The Saints were a big part of my life. Win, lose or draw.

The club at the moment seems far more like a business with employees, than a footy club with heart and passion.

I can't support a business with passion and emotion like I supported and followed a footy club.

Couldn't agree more...

[GrumpyOne]

...I find it very hard to get passionate about the club right now. The Saints were a big part of my life. Win, lose or draw.

The club at the moment seems far more like a business with employees, than a footy club with heart and passion.

I can't support a business with passion and emotion like I supported and followed a footy club.

Couldn't agree more...

Heresy.

[TriColourDisciple]

The lack of Saints at our club has been a concern to me aswell.
After Thommo was sacked, l was kind of hoping that we might get Danny Frawley back to Moorabbin as Coach.
I honestly thought & mistakingly believed, that Robert Harvey was a St.kilda man through and through, & would continue on in some sort of coaching role at our club to help us a strive towards that illusive, long awaited, Premiership. Instead....Sadly, He's with Carlton helping them to plot our downfall.
Totally agree with you, We need more Sainters.

[HarveysDeciple]

TCD...I'm glad Harvey showed more character and commitment then some of our fans.

He gives the club 21 years service, busts his gut every week, playing with injuries, rejecting offers to leave the club for large sums of money.

Cries on field for the club....and as soon as he retires and explores other options some of our fans lose the plot....

He is a st.kilda man, a greater st.kilda man then you or I....far more loyal and committed to the club then you will ever be...so don't insult a club legend with crap like that and grow a f****** spine so you can deal with the fact that just because someone spends a couple of days a week teaching carlton players how to play in the midfield doesn't in anyway shape of form diminish his love for the club or what he has achieved.

[TriColourDisciple]

I'm a St.kilda supporter, not an individual idol worshipper. So I wouldn't expect you to understand the angle I'm coming from.

[St Fidelius]

The lack of Saints at our club has been a concern to me aswell.
After Thommo was sacked, l was kind of hoping that we might get Danny Frawley back to Moorabbin as Coach.
I honestly thought & mistakingly believed, that Robert Harvey was a St.kilda man through and through, & would continue on in some sort of coaching role at our club to help us a strive towards that illusive, long awaited, Premiership. Instead....Sadly, He's with Carlton helping them to plot our downfall.
Totally agree with you, We need more Sainters.

WTF??

Danny Frawley??

What difference does it make if our coach did play for the Saints?

Did Alastair Clarkson play for the Hawks?

Did Bomber Thompson play for the Cats?

A coach is given the job to coach and it means absolute jack sh1t if he ever played for the club, he still would have the same passion to be successful in his job.

[HarveysDeciple]

I'm a St.kilda supporter, not an individual idol worshipper. So I wouldn't expect you to understand the angle I'm coming from.

My understanding is that you think he doesn't love the club as much as you thought......and his stature is somewhat diminished in your eyes? isn't that what you are saying?

[BringBackMadDog]

Where have all the Saints gone?

Ross Lyon. Silvagni. Drain. Fraser. Tudor.

These guys aren't 'Saints'. They're employees of the club. Not a part of it's makeup.

What a load of GARBAGE!! In 1980 Essendon made Kevin Sheedy coach of their club, a recently retired player from their most hated arch rivals. Fast forward almost a quarter of a century, he is now a club legend. And BTW when Sheedy got sacked at Essendon, he didn't then sue the club for unpaid holiday or long service leave nor has he sniped the club in the media every chance he got, unlike the supposed great saints man Thomas.

[HarveysDeciple]

I'm a St.kilda supporter, not an individual idol worshipper. So I wouldn't expect you to understand the angle I'm coming from.

and am I an individual idol worshipper? Interesting accusation..

[WayneJudson42]

So what the OP is saying is that he still hasn't moved on from the GT era.

I too was like you Rodge, but I guess I grew up. Life happens and I now have kids. I still like the footy, but it doesn't take top priority in my life.

Apart from perhaps Harvey, who else can people state would be a great addition to our coaching panel? Not just fanciful suggestions... but people who have the credentials to back up your choice.

Why do we need "Saints" men? As someone already mentioned about Clarkson...

Was Sheeds a Bomber? Was Malthouse an Eagle or Pie? Was Matthews a Lion?

The list continues. You hire the best available for the job.

As of Butterhead... Just because he didn't play, who's to say that Westaway isn't a passionate Saints man? To give up his time for the club speaks volumes AFAIAC.

Last t time I checked... Bromberg and Nettlefold were also formar Saints players.

I too remember when you could sneak into the rooms and see Cowboy smoking a ciggie after the game. But times have moved on, and the game has changed. Question the demise of the game as a whole by all means, but let's not make it out to be a Saints problem only.

My belief in the club under GT was fuelled by the success and apparent rise in the club's fortunes. They were exciting times... which led to nothing in the end because they couldn't control their respective egos.

GT has gone, Rodge. Move on. Get behind who we have... or just give it away.

A very depressing way to start the year IMO.

[Saints94]

I hate when our saints players don't hi five any of our fans before any matches

[WayneJudson42]

Where have all the Saints gone?

Ross Lyon. Silvagni. Drain. Fraser. Tudor.

These guys aren't 'Saints'. They're employees of the club. Not a part of it's makeup.

What a load of GARBAGE!! In 1980 Essendon made Kevin Sheedy coach of their club, a recently retired player from their most hated arch rivals. Fast forward almost a quarter of a century, he is now a club legend. And BTW when Sheedy got sacked at Essendon, he didn't then sue the club for unpaid holiday or long service leave nor has he sniped the club in the media every chance he got, unlike the supposed great saints man Thomas.

100% correct. And I have it on very good authority that Sheed's was gutted and is still filthy about the way he was treated. A class act.

Off topic,, but I reckon Knights is dreaming if he thinks Sheeds has stood back to give him room. What a joke.

[fingers]

How else do you become a "Saints man" other than being there like RL etc? GT? we know how that has ended.

RF I understand what you are saying but you need to move with the club. Succes IS what matters and if that means bringing in expertise from outside the Saints realm then so be it....eg Carlton and Harvey - hardly a Blues man.

There is something there for you to get passionate about.....find it.

[WayneJudson42]

so was everyone "passionless" in 1997 under Alves? Or less so in 91 and 92 under Sheldon? Or even in 78 under Patterson?

[rodgerfox]

I'm not saying that everyone needs to be passionless, just because I am.

Just sharing some thoughts.


Having said that however, our lack in membership and passion from the crowd at games, certainly suggests it may be more than just me who finds it hard to 'love' the business that now holds the name of the club that I loved.

[degruch]

Don't worry, you'll get over it Rodge.

[Solar]

hey rog I here what you say but I would be more worried if those of 16 -22 felt the same....

I actually missed a final last year because of work, would have been crazy thought in 2004-05 for me to do this. I think alot of that passion has died when we had so many retirements in the past 2-3 years. But now there are new young players to watch develop and come through.... we get to experience lynchy's first game, maybe hynds first goal..... dawson sticking it up the hawks by kicking the winner.... you get the point...

I actually believe that give lyon one more successful year and he will be a saint in our eyes.

[rodgerfox]

So what the OP is saying is that he still hasn't moved on from the GT era.

The GT era?

As per the OP, I've been following the Saints rabidly since I was a kid.

The decline in interest actually started during GT's 'reign'. It really started to kick in I think when Demetriou took over the comp.

The Saints were the only thing keeping me interested in AFL footy at all. Now that I barely recognise the club these days, any interest that was still intact is pretty much gone.

The club now is literally just another revenue source for the AFL. It's not a club at all.

[joffaboy]

...I find it very hard to get passionate about the club right now. The Saints were a big part of my life. Win, lose or draw.

The club at the moment seems far more like a business with employees, than a footy club with heart and passion.

I can't support a business with passion and emotion like I supported and followed a footy club.

Couldn't agree more...

Got it in one.

Passionless, money hungry, couldn't care less about the fans attitude from the club.

Their heartless heavy handed extortion of $125 more (or piss of you scum fan) for one game less encapsulates everything wrong wioth our club.

Since Westaway has taken over the place has become a rabble

- substantial loss coming up, after years of profits
- debacle at Seaford
- s.hitting on the loyalty of members and forcing them to become SC members in an obscene cash grab at the expense of loyalty.

RodgerFox is deadset correct. The Saints are a sterile "business" headed by non Saints people like Archie Frasier with all these no Saints interlopers like Lyon and his motely crew of mercenaries.

We made the PF last year and about the only reason i went was I knew it was Rob Harveys last game as we were light years away from Hawthorn.

I hardly could get excited last year about our "brand" and our prospects.

Almost completely killed off by the unseemly cash grab at the expense of loyal fans this year.

I will still get a membership, undoubtedly like RodgerFox and AOK and Fireman and others will, as we are diehards and love our Saints, however the likes of Westaway and Frasier and the mercenaries in the football dept are killing my passion for the club and the game.

[joffaboy]

So what the OP is saying is that he still hasn't moved on from the GT era.

The GT era?

As per the OP, I've been following the Saints rabidly since I was a kid.

The decline in interest actually started during GT's 'reign'. It really started to kick in I think when Demetriou took over the comp.

The Saints were the only thing keeping me interested in AFL footy at all. Now that I barely recognise the club these days, any interest that was still intact is pretty much gone.

The club now is literally just another revenue source for the AFL. It's not a club at all.

Again completely spot on.

[Saints94]

Well its hard for me because im a country boy never ever been to a training session in my life i try my best to get to matches last one i went to was saints v port rd 18 so yeah but im being the best saints fan i can be in the country like right now im at Barmah with my dad

[Saints94]

Is training today?

[saintbrat]

Rf - another way of processing it may just be that you are heading to a new phase of life--- where the practicalities of being a supporter have overtaken the emotion of being a supporter

there is a saying in relation to another of life's topics- (which I won't mention for fear of beginning another debate)
it's not the source that has moved away from you , it's that you have moved away from the source.

where as for me the joy and enthusiasm of being a saint supporter is part of the new me... I am relatively young as far as being a member and addict. ( can't you tell)

may those of you who are jaded and unforgiving find something to like about the 'new' saints who are coming in .