Club or Entertainment?

[degruch]

I'm staggered that people don't think a Saints fan forum is the ideal place for supporters to discuss this topic.

It's perplexing to be honest.

Absolutely. One of the most unusual things I've ever read on this site, and that's saying something.

Me too, I don't know what's wrong with some people. Lack of tolerance stems from immaturity I guess.

10 - We agree with 'degruch' that this forum is the wrong place to challenge the club over member mistreatment and expect action.

1 - We agree with 'St Fid' that this forum is the appropriate place to challenge the club over member mistreatment and expect action.

the club is never gonna trawl through every 6 page thread to find out whether poster A beats poster B in an idealogical armwrestle - if issues like L2 seating allocation are that important to some members, their opinion needs to be delivered to the club direct and to the point, as personally as possible. Repeating the issue ad infinitum in an attempt to recruit an army of pissed off members (as one forumite is doing, not St Fid, to the best of my knowledge) is boring as hell and achieves nothing. I'm interested to know if anyone really cares enough to raise it at the AGM.

Wake up, I have a feeling that some of that was directed towards you.

Oh really???

I've highlighted some key elements of my point, for those of you who like to jump to conclusions and sling abuse at every poster they misread and believe they are disagreeing with you.

I've taken Ev to task over dragging threads on forever before, once the point is made who wants to read it interspersed with abuse for another 6 pages???

Honestly, I believe the majority of posters on this forum are making this face at this whole thread, as pointed out by several posters.

[St Fidelius]

Oh really???

I've highlighted some key elements of my point, for those of you who like to jump to conclusions and sling abuse at every poster who disagrees with you.

Honestly, I believe the majority of posters on this forum are making this face at this whole thread, as pointed out by several posters.

There you go again speaking for the majority ....

Your "key elements" ....

What a joke, I am voicing my opinion and not "trying to recruit an army of pissed off members.

Don't like it, don't respond.

Sling abuse, yeah righto

[degruch]

Oh really???

I've highlighted some key elements of my point, for those of you who like to jump to conclusions and sling abuse at every poster who disagrees with you.

Honestly, I believe the majority of posters on this forum are making this face at this whole thread, as pointed out by several posters.

There you go again speaking for the majority ....

Your "key elements" ....

What a joke, I am voicing my opinion and not "trying to recruit an army of pissed off members.

Don't like it, don't respond.

Sling abuse, yeah righto

OK St Fid, following on from our exchange under the membership tally sticky, I do owe you something of an apology (so much for no apologies). Your somewhat terse (but not abusive) response to my original question to you did spark the abuse, coming from me...so I was a bit quick off the mark with my unneccessary 'piss off' comment. I apologies and hope you're cool with that - I was out of line.

It's encouraging that you've been in contact with Archie again, and that he responded with less corporate jargon. You guys have a good point, I think members have been shafted and the club should acknowledge that. I just feel it needs further reinforcement off this forum to be effective - that's my point.

Sorry I put the s***s up you so heartily, but I hope you recognise my point.

[saint66au]

Just as an aside, there was an article in the H-S today (cant see it in the online version) about a disgruntled Cats fan who took the club to VCAT over being charged "Gold" seat prices when there was a grandstand pole right in his view

The end result was him recieving a 50% discount on his seat price for 2008...but the real point of the article was how the GFC had been so inflexible and stubborn (claiming that the pole was needed to hold up the grandstand roof..when the whole issue was that its not a premium seat if the pole blocks your view) that he felt the need to take it to VCAT.

[St Fidelius]

Oh really???

I've highlighted some key elements of my point, for those of you who like to jump to conclusions and sling abuse at every poster who disagrees with you.

Honestly, I believe the majority of posters on this forum are making this face at this whole thread, as pointed out by several posters.

There you go again speaking for the majority ....

Your "key elements" ....

What a joke, I am voicing my opinion and not "trying to recruit an army of pissed off members.

Don't like it, don't respond.

Sling abuse, yeah righto

OK St Fid, following on from our exchange under the membership tally sticky, I do owe you something of an apology (so much for no apologies). Your somewhat terse (but not abusive) response to my original question to you did spark the abuse, coming from me...so I was a bit quick off the mark with my unneccessary 'piss off' comment. I apologies and hope you're cool with that - I was out of line.

It's encouraging that you've been in contact with Archie again, and that he responded with less corporate jargon. You guys have a good point, I think members have been shafted and the club should acknowledge that. I just feel it needs further reinforcement off this forum to be effective - that's my point.

Sorry I put the s***s up you so heartily, but I hope you recognise my point.

Mate, I recognise your point, but going to the AGM would mean little IMO.

I have had more than one conversation with the Club on this issue, and they have made their mind up, to me it's not going to change.

I don't know if you realise this, but I am not effected by this at all, but felt for the members that are.

There have been previous posts in the past about this issue, and some have stated that they were never informed...

Some have stated that they really don't know the personal details of the people they sit next to and feel that they have lost their company for ever.

The Club should have notified these members effected well before the last season ending, so they could make alternative arrangements.

Archie has stated in last nights email that...

WE HAVE THIS INFORMATION OF WHO SITS WHERE SO IT IS AVAILABLE IF ANYONE WANTS IT

Yes, his response was in CAPS all the way through, but really, how can the Club provide details on members to other members, and I am sure this was never mentioned to them by private emails to those effected.

[degruch]

Mate, I recognise your point, but going to the AGM would mean little IMO.

I have had more than one conversation with the Club on this issue, and they have made their mind up, to me it's not going to change.

The AGM is the ultimate public forum, it couldn't hurt. At least, it'd be better to entertain the notion here, rather than do a JB and fold your arms, citing abuse from pro-St Kilda drones wearing pencil cases on their head.

I don't know if you realise this, but I am not effected by this at all, but felt for the members that are.

I didn't realise that...you're a good egg. Great of you to stand up for those affected. Wish you'd mentioned this earlier!

WE HAVE THIS INFORMATION OF WHO SITS WHERE SO IT IS AVAILABLE IF ANYONE WANTS IT

Well, at least you can hold him to this. As you pointed out too, it was encouraging that he recognised (a) the importance of the issue and how it affects the clubs members, and (b) your efforts, whilst on his holidays. Surely this shows some level of commitment to the St Kilda 'family'. Geez, I've worked in companies of 100 people where you'd be lucky to hear boo from the CEO, let alone a business the size of St Kilda with 30,000 additional stakeholders.

[WayneJudson42]

Easy, soul mate. I think the guy's just saying that if people are aggrieved then they should take it up with the club. Pretty simple position TBH.

Whilst I am unaware, surely their must be proper channels to air ones frustrations? I also don't think a non-official club forum is the place to do it.

The whole... "the club watches this forum so they'll know" is a crap logic IMO.

Sometimes, you just gotta give people a wake up call or a kick up the butt. Sadly.

Thanks mate, you got it in one. I think the inferrence that I'd have majority support in regard to whether others care about 3 member's anger at this issue (seemingly with little action) being posted on this forum continuously, has got St Fid all tied up in knots.

That aside, as you've pointed out, the club is never gonna trawl through every 6 page thread to find out whether poster A beats poster B in an idealogical armwrestle - if issues like L2 seating allocation are that important to some members, their opinion needs to be delivered to the club direct and to the point, as personally as possible. Repeating the issue ad infinitum in an attempt to recruit an army of pissed off members (as one forumite is doing, not St Fid, to the best of my knowledge) is boring as hell and achieves nothing. I'm interested to know if anyone really cares enough to raise it at the AGM.

You two are bound to be made mods any moment now... then you can rate the worthiness of all the threads, and lock ones (like this) that obviously have no relevance to the Club or it's supporters at all (or just annoy you).... thus saving the forum entirely for vital news about Michael Gardiner's impending wedding, and the riveting 'where do ya reckon we'll finish on the ladder next year' threads.....

Until that time inevitably comes, maybe you should pull your heads in and let people discuss whatever they believe is worthy.

And try to avoid drinking alone.

Discuss what you want tbh. The point I make is that perhaps supporters might be better off taking it up with the club.

Why is that so offensive?

I've contributed to the thread. So why say it's of no interest to me? Just because I disagree with certain views?

Where did I state I had a problem with the thread?

At least get your facts right and respect people's right to disagree... lest you embarrass yourself with posts such as this.

Yeah, I'm totally embarrassed....

I also don't think a non-official club forum is the place to do it.

The whole... "the club watches this forum so they'll know" is a crap logic IMO.

But that is just wrong... this is exactly the place to do it, and the Club do watch the forum.

I obviously take more issue with your 'mate', but if you two are gonna give each other reach-arounds and defend each others posts, then you can expect to be tarred with the same brush.

Now there's a pleasant mental picture for a Sunday morning...

Aw shucks. Such hostility towards your Saints bretheren.

Mate, if someone said let's start a petition, I'd sign, np and pass it around. Sadly, A few voices on a forum simply doesn't speak loudly enough. Admins and politicians don;t give a fig, until it pysses enough people off. Then they listen.

I even volunteered to write a letter if there were enough people willing to participate, yet everyone went silent. This, to me, shows that people like to complain, yet are apathetic when it comes to actually doing something.

I was howled down by EFC for it being a waste of time etc. (I think it was him). Hence why I've taken this position on the matter.

I take your point. Viva la democracie.

[WayneJudson42]

The bit I really loved was equating of Reserved seats with purchasing a seat on a plane. Just shows the mentality and mindset of this passionless desicatted adding machine. Apparently you get a better seat on business class but have to pay more - oh no s.hit Sherlock .
:

LOL...

Ok Pencil Head... it was I that made the analogy with the plane seats.

Boy, you really are a touchy SOB at times. If you care to take the emotional claptrap out of your posts, you might actually read things correctly, rather than going off on some abusive tangent.

The analogy was made with reference to and within the context of the amount of service afforded at each level of seating.

And I added that as a basic member, "I" not you or anyone else... speaking ONLY for me myself I... don't have any great expectations of the club.

I doubt that your hysterical over reactions allow you to see the forest for the trees at times.

IIRC, I have acknowldeged the bad decision by the club, adn am willing to voice my concerns along with others.

Now, seriously mate, I reckon I'm pissing in the wind writing this, because you never wanted Butterhead kicked out, and you are now cluutching at the first feasible opportuinity to tell us all how you "told us so".

It's well and good to blow of on the keyboard and call people names... not to mention cast aspersions as to their personality and charater... but if you really care, have the balls to front the club. Simple.

Quite ironic, given the immature rantings you post. As soon as someone stands up for themselves and doesn't roll over from your abuse, you're quick to attack them... worse still, should they even dare to post a logical reply to your post.

You accuse others, yet you prefer to bully your way into showing us all how "mentally" superior you think you are by using clever language. MAte it's too funny if you weren't so sad. Did you get picked on a lot as a kid?

FWIW, I travel to the USA quite a few times a year, and there have been times when the airlines have screwed up. But I take it up with officials and generally get compensated. I must admit, that in 9 years, I've never been bumped from Business to Economy.

And yes, I'd be pissed off if it happened. But I think we've covered that we are in agreeance with THAT issue.

I believe there is a forum QantasSational.com where frequent flyers and Qantas Club members all get along and whinge about the Airline.

I await your next little tirade with glee.

[evertonfc]

Hardly "howling you down" WJ - a bit melodramatic.

As several others have stated, we know the club reads this. You can spin your pro-active lines anyway you like it, but we know they watch - because they contribute here, frequently.

They also claim to be in touch with the fans. So it's a good test of the club on both fronts.

If nothing changes and things get worse, then maybe other action - like a letter - might be needed.

But let's just see, ok? And let's give the club a chance before we barge in with a letter.

Anyway, I'm done on this. We've all had our piece, let's see what happens...

[rodgerfox]

Oh and by golly yes the Club most definately read this site, pretty much daily...and more closely than you'd imagine..I can vouch for that first-hand. I cant see them however acting on a grievance purely 'cos they read it here. I'd imagine that they'd quite rightly think to themselves that if someone feels that strongly about being wronged, they'll at least attempt some communcation via the channels that theyve set in place.

Why do the club read this site?

[Pilgram]

I agree with what WJ42 says

[St Fidelius]

The bit I really loved was equating of Reserved seats with purchasing a seat on a plane. Just shows the mentality and mindset of this passionless desicatted adding machine. Apparently you get a better seat on business class but have to pay more - oh no s.hit Sherlock .
:

LOL...

Ok Pencil Head... it was I that made the analogy with the plane seats.

Boy, you really are a touchy SOB at times. If you care to take the emotional claptrap out of your posts, you might actually read things correctly, rather than going off on some abusive tangent. ....................

Mate, you may have made that analogy but AF did it also.

I gave joffaboy a copy of the email AF sent me

[WayneJudson42]

Hardly "howling you down" WJ - a bit melodramatic.

As several others have stated, we know the club reads this. You can spin your pro-active lines anyway you like it, but we know they watch - because they contribute here, frequently.

They also claim to be in touch with the fans. So it's a good test of the club on both fronts.

If nothing changes and things get worse, then maybe other action - like a letter - might be needed.

But let's just see, ok? And let's give the club a chance before we barge in with a letter.

Anyway, I'm done on this. We've all had our piece, let's see what happens...

You were quite firm in your tone. So now we can't use expressive language?

Melodramatic? Spin? Once again, you must be condoscending, don't you.

Ok, so you're done with your whinge. Good to see.

[rodgerfox]

Hardly "howling you down" WJ - a bit melodramatic.

As several others have stated, we know the club reads this. You can spin your pro-active lines anyway you like it, but we know they watch - because they contribute here, frequently.

They also claim to be in touch with the fans. So it's a good test of the club on both fronts.

If nothing changes and things get worse, then maybe other action - like a letter - might be needed.

But let's just see, ok? And let's give the club a chance before we barge in with a letter.

Anyway, I'm done on this. We've all had our piece, let's see what happens...

You were quite firm in your tone. So now we can't use expressive language?

Melodramatic? Spin? Once again, you must be condoscending, don't you.

Ok, so you're done with your whinge. Good to see.

Wayne, you're very quickly becoming a serial thread wrecker.


How about trying to keep on topic.

[WayneJudson42]

Hardly "howling you down" WJ - a bit melodramatic.

As several others have stated, we know the club reads this. You can spin your pro-active lines anyway you like it, but we know they watch - because they contribute here, frequently.

They also claim to be in touch with the fans. So it's a good test of the club on both fronts.

If nothing changes and things get worse, then maybe other action - like a letter - might be needed.

But let's just see, ok? And let's give the club a chance before we barge in with a letter.

Anyway, I'm done on this. We've all had our piece, let's see what happens...

You were quite firm in your tone. So now we can't use expressive language?

Melodramatic? Spin? Once again, you must be condoscending, don't you.

Ok, so you're done with your whinge. Good to see.

Wayne, you're very quickly becoming a serial thread wrecker.


How about trying to keep on topic.

Is this on topic enough?

IF YOU'RE SO P1SSED OFF AT THE CLUB, GET OF YOUR BACKSIDE AND DO SOMETHING PRO-ACTIVE ABOUT IT.

St Fid: I wasn't aware of the email. Oops.

JB:: I retract if you were quoting the email.

[rodgerfox]

Is this on topic enough?

IF YOU'RE SO P1SSED OFF AT THE CLUB, GET OF YOUR BACKSIDE AND DO SOMETHING PRO-ACTIVE ABOUT IT.

St Fid: I wasn't aware of the email. Oops.

JB:: I retract if you were quoting the email.

Very much so.

However you're probably being a bit presumptuous in thinking that people on here aren't or haven't already taken it up with the club.

[joffaboy]

Edited - Already sorted above.

No worries WJ

[WayneJudson42]

Is this on topic enough?

IF YOU'RE SO P1SSED OFF AT THE CLUB, GET OF YOUR BACKSIDE AND DO SOMETHING PRO-ACTIVE ABOUT IT.

St Fid: I wasn't aware of the email. Oops.

JB:: I retract if you were quoting the email.

Very much so.

However you're probably being a bit presumptuous in thinking that people on here aren't or haven't already taken it up with the club.

Not being presumptuous at all. TBH. But so far, the only one who's backed up his stand is St Fid who's written an email. If others have done so, then perhaps they'd like to share their experiences.

Any dare I say it, but if you or JB or anyone else had done so, and the response was less than satisfactory, then no doubt we would have heard about it.

One would thinkk that alogical conclusion to draw.

[joffaboy]

Is this on topic enough?

IF YOU'RE SO P1SSED OFF AT THE CLUB, GET OF YOUR BACKSIDE AND DO SOMETHING PRO-ACTIVE ABOUT IT.

St Fid: I wasn't aware of the email. Oops.

JB:: I retract if you were quoting the email.

Very much so.

However you're probably being a bit presumptuous in thinking that people on here aren't or haven't already taken it up with the club.

Not being presumptuous at all. TBH. But so far, the only one who's backed up his stand is St Fid who's written an email. If others have done so, then perhaps they'd like to share their experiences.

Any dare I say it, but if you or JB or anyone else had done so, and the response was less than satisfactory, then no doubt we would have heard about it.

One would thinkk that alogical conclusion to draw.

When this first happened there were at least four regular contributers who contacted the club directly - two being Fireman and AOK. The other two i cant remember but they all told of being dismissed and no argument would be entered into - pay up or piss of scum.

That was the message and that is still the message coming from Mr Passion the CEO.

[rodgerfox]

Oh and by golly yes the Club most definately read this site, pretty much daily...and more closely than you'd imagine..I can vouch for that first-hand. I cant see them however acting on a grievance purely 'cos they read it here. I'd imagine that they'd quite rightly think to themselves that if someone feels that strongly about being wronged, they'll at least attempt some communcation via the channels that theyve set in place.

Why do the club read this site?

Anyone??

If the club reads this site, yet will only take anything seriously if 20,000 paid up members write them letters and all stand up at the AGM - why bother reading this site?

What's the point?

[markp]

Oh and by golly yes the Club most definately read this site, pretty much daily...and more closely than you'd imagine..I can vouch for that first-hand. I cant see them however acting on a grievance purely 'cos they read it here. I'd imagine that they'd quite rightly think to themselves that if someone feels that strongly about being wronged, they'll at least attempt some communcation via the channels that theyve set in place.

Why do the club read this site?

Anyone??

If the club reads this site, yet will only take anything seriously if 20,000 paid up members write them letters and all stand up at the AGM - why bother reading this site?

What's the point?

So they know when to request that certain threads be locked, for the Fox report (now in hiatus), and for all things JLH.... but mainly to keep an eye on us unwashed savages, and gauge our fickle moods.