Jason Gram

[saint66au]

Grammy may put it inside 50 a million times, but unfortunatley he's possibly the worst bloke in the side to have this stat

Maybe we need to look at "targets hit inside 50" cos Ill lay odds hes not in the Top 50 in the AFL at that

THose 50m helicopter punts are great if they sail thru for a goal, but for a marking forward they are a nightmare.

Haivng said that, the OP is too strong IMO. Grammy brings flair, dash and run and carry to the side. Its just a shame that his finishing needs so much work.

[Solar]

thought his balance was very good. Needs to place the ball and not kick the side off it.

maybe a chat with dal could help

[The_Dud]

is probably the biggest worry we have at the moment

at least half of his kicks are absolute spuds, and the other half weren't all superb

it does look like he's tyring to kick the ball too hard, maybe he needs to try relaxing and when kicking long, and just let it happen

[rexy]

This post probably sums up the form and value of Jason Gramm very well. Gramm is easily an AFL best 22 standard of footballer however I think it is quite probable that he could be a genuine elite player if he could improve his poise when kicking and his willingness to commit his body to a contest.

Gramm and his admirers should be flattered that so many people beleive he could be even better than his stats suggest he already is.

[St Fidelius]

Gram's disposal by hand and foot have been a problem for a while.

At least two of his disposals resulted in goals to Adelaide.

He seems to try to kick the ball too hard which results in a clanger kick, he just needs to focus more on this at training.

People bag Clinton Jones on his disposal, but Gram's disposal is not much better

The difference is one player gets a lot more of the ball than the other.

That's because Jones is playing a tagging role where his opponents possessions or lack of, are a factor

Again at least two of Gram's disposals resulted in goals to the opposition.

He tries to kick the ball too hard which often results in a clanger kick and when he tries to pass the ball by foot they have too much hang time, which just leaves his team mate under pressure.

Don't get me wrong, Gram is in our best 22, but he does need to improve on his disposals by hand and foot IMO

and further to this, Jarrad McVeigh amassed 33 disposals this week. compared to just 16 last week, of which 9 possessions (last week) were scored in the first quarter....

Now tell me Gram is better value than Jones....???


Both are and should be in our best 22 but for value Jones wins hands down ATM...

Possessions mean nothing unless they are useful, I much prefer Jones contribution to the side than Gram at the minute

[SainterK]

Jason himself was dissapointed with his kicking efficiency last night, you could read it in his body language. I think he is good enough to own the problem, and turn it around.

[St Fidelius]

Jason himself was dissapointed with his kicking efficiency last night, you could read it in his body language. I think he is good enough to own the problem, and turn it around.

He has had that problem for a few seasons and showing his disappointment, really means JACK...

It is time he really addresses that in his game

[Teflon]

Lot's of negativity thrown towards grammy,so I'll throw in some stats for statsman who was looking for some positives Gram brings to the side

Currently ranked number 1 in the league for inside 50's....might be enough to keep him in the squad this week...

Ranked 8th in the league for tackles laid....not bad for someone who doesn't know how to lay a tackle...

Has covered the most meters in the league so far..

No,Grammy isn't perfect and makes a few mistakes,probably more than many...however,as I said,his positives FAR outweigh his negatives. Not to bad for a half assed pre season

J Gram - Kicking Effectiveness Last Night = 58%

C Jones - 64%

Dal Santo (35 touches) - 69%

Ray (supposedly a dodgy disposer...) - 75%

Grams run and carry is vital to us - the area we needed some growth in....but its one thing to say hes number 1 for fwd 50 entries.....and entirely another IF you take note of how many of those hit a target and how many are bombed, mongrel punts.

He has work to do BUT he laid 6 tackles (Im also not filled with confidence when I see him trying to stick a tackle..) but hes obviously been told its an area hes gotta lift.

[jonesy]

I know the stats can be misleading,and I used them to advantage for my argument.
Not saying he's a superstar,and he does need to work on his kicking,but he is very important to us,even when he is turning it over often,he still has a big upside.. I guess most are saying the same thing...except a few calling for him to be chopped...

[Teflon]

I know the stats can be misleading,and I used them to advantage for my argument.
Not saying he's a superstar,and he does need to work on his kicking,but he is very important to us,even when he is turning it over often,he still has a big upside.. I guess most are saying the same thing...except a few calling for him to be chopped...

I wouldnt chop him but we have to remember to beat the BEST aka Cats/Hawks....we cant afford to cough it up consistently - and not just Gram.

We should be aiming for a flag - these sides are who we are hunting, thats the measure so this area of our game has to be a focus.

Watch Dogs/Port in this area - unbelievable skill levels.

[Ghost Like]

He's a long way from being dropped, along with Dal he's our best evasive player, when he has the ball he draws players to him and side steps which helps break lines (zones).

I agree he tries to kick the ball too hard and sometimes doesn't check all possible options, using the bomb as a last resort (the resort he should have used when he was caught in the lights in the back pocket).

Personally I'd load him up for the week with some tapes of Andrew MacLeod and say this is how you deliver the ball. MacLeod does not kick the ball too hard, rarely misses a target or makes the wrong decision when running through the half back line.

Plenty of upside for Gram IMHO

[onlooker]

Agreed that Gram is in our best 22 and when on song an important cog for the Saints. When delisted at Brisbane (at the time they had better players available for the spots he was looking at - the Scott boys won out) he was a one sided player whose disposal was inconsistent and Matthews didn't have much of an opinion of his defensive skills particularly under pressure which is a mandatory requirement in the Matthews game plan. At the Saints I think Gram's defensive game skills have picked up hugely, he's still one sided and I dont think that will ever change now and his foot disposal needs a big lift at the moment. He's not giving the forwards much of a chance to gain possession at the first attempt when he's got the ball.

[Mr X from the West]

Gee, we're getting picky aren't we? 15 other teams would love to have Gram in their side. Yes, he sprays a few kicks, and yes he probably doesn't love getting his head kicked and punched in close in contests.

But he has a great ability to win the ball, and he is one of the most skillful players in the team...his little gives, his run and carry, his long goals (remember them?) are all so valuable to us....

Love him.

[Saints Premiers 2008]

Gee, we're getting picky aren't we? 15 other teams would love to have Gram in their side. Yes, he sprays a few kicks, and yes he probably doesn't love getting his head kicked and punched in close in contests.

But he has a great ability to win the ball, and he is one of the most skillful players in the team...his little gives, his run and carry, his long goals (remember them?) are all so valuable to us....

Love him.

not getting picky at all...fact is most teams could know to leave gram alone and he will run all he likes and 1/2 turn the football over

he sprays more than a few kicks...most of the kicks on the run are sprayed...and how can a player be skillful if they cant kick??? the fundamental part of our game????

[matrix]

shesh we better trade him then
he's dead wood

[saintsRrising]

The rest of Gram's game was good..it was just his skills which were worse than his normal strandard.

Indeed his "general" game was more complete.

In favour too is that Gram is one of our few genuinely quick players.

So no way will he not be in the 22 next week.

[saintsRrising]

not getting picky at all...fact is most teams could know to leave gram alone and he will run all he likes and 1/2 turn the football over

Funny my observation is that most teams actually do their best to try and shut down Gram's running off HB....which is why he finds it alot more difficult to take his long bouncing runs over the last few seasons.

[ausfatcat]

When delisted at Brisbane (at the time they had better players available for the spots he was looking at - the Scott boys won out) he was a one sided player whose disposal was inconsistent and Matthews didn't have much of an opinion of his defensive skills particularly under pressure which is a mandatory requirement in the Matthews game plan.

A. He wasn't delisted he was traded very different

B. The reason he didn't get many games at Brisbane was more to do with him being 18 in a team that was dominating with 25 to 29 year old's iwinning three premierships in a row...

And did Matthews ever state publicly about Gram's defensive pressure? Your just making it up...

[dalboy]

Gram is one of our most important players, his kicking for goal has room for improvement, i think you'll find he is looking at the screen to watch himself during the kicking action, maybe someone on here could put together a highlights package for Grammy and tell him to concentrate on the ball during the game and then watch his highlights at home later.

[ThePunter]

It's obvious to me that he is a better kick when he isn't trying to kick the bladder out of the leather, but just gently aims to propel the ball towards his target.

Translation: he muffs it when he tries to kick it too hard.

[spert]

Gawd, I hope we don't start losing -the knives will really be out. Make sure you look at our wins so far as excellent team efforts. The current team is a winning team, and Gram like a lot of other players is part of the winning formula. I saw him do some pretty effective plays regardless of skill errors.

[onlooker]

[
And did Matthews ever state publicly about Gram's defensive pressure? Your just making it up...[/quote]

No I'm not making it up. At the time Matthews said words to the effect that they delisted (sorry traded) Gram because his defensive game wasn't up to the level of other players (he was talking about the Scott brothers) they had available. Mathews wasn't having a dip at him he was just explaining why Brisbane were prepared to let him go. Your point is probably right; Gram was young and the Scotts were probably approaching, or at their peaks as players and all other things being equal Gram wasn't going to get a decent look in. I was interested in Matthew's comments cause Gram was coming to the Saints and as I said in my previous post Gram is in our best 22 when his game is on song.

[bobmurray]

Gram's kicking may be dodgy at best but that's not his biggest problem..

What's with his hairdo..it's a shocker.....

[plugger66]

Cannot believe what some people write on here. Grammy has been good both weeks and his kicking sometimes can be poor but he gets it and sets up goals. Surely that out ways a few poor disposals. He is also gives us run which we severely lack.

[bobmurray]

Can believe what some people write on here. Grammy has been good both weeks and his kicking sometimes can be poor but he gets it and sets up goals. Surely that out ways a few poor disposals. He is also gives us run which we severely lack.

He's flawed,thats the gist of the thread...As long as his sprayed kicks don't cause too much damage going the other way then he is still a valuable member of the team......