I took banned drug: Watson

[saintspremiers]

Looks like the AFL have brought integrity into disrepute by saying and doing nothing.

[Wayne42]

The commentators on 3AW were suggesting the players will get off, but, the people in control of the team will be punished .

Not sure how Watson will get off, unless they need proof Watson was given the banned drug because the 3AW commentators are saying that the banned drug might have been listed on a bit
of paper , BUT, the reality is there is no proof what Watson was ACTUALLY given , hence, he and the rest of the players might get off.

The commentators on 3AW are doing the same as we are doing on here; GUESSING !!

You are probably right, however, Dr Peter Larkins is no mug and he was part of the discussion, Caro thinks she knows exactly what happened, and she now thinks they'll get off.

Maybe, Plugger is Caro ?

[Buckets]

The commentators on 3AW were suggesting the players will get off, but, the people in control of the team will be punished .

Not sure how Watson will get off, unless they need proof Watson was given the banned drug because the 3AW commentators are saying that the banned drug might have been listed on a bit
of paper , BUT, the reality is there is no proof what Watson was ACTUALLY given , hence, he and the rest of the players might get off.

The commentators on 3AW are doing the same as we are doing on here; GUESSING !!

You are probably right, however, Dr Peter Larkins is no mug and he was part of the discussion, Caro thinks she knows exactly what happened, and she now thinks they'll get off.

Maybe, Plugger is Caro ?

Well 3aw also reporting that ASADA have denied the existence of a letter. If that's the case Caro could be extremely wrong....

[fingers]

A thread of immense speculation. Interesting read.

[plugger66]

Id love to know what you think my argument actually is.

Everyone would love to know it, but it seems very confused

I have said time again I have no idea if Essendon players are guilty or not.

I dont understand, why did you say that the players had told ASADA the same thing that Watson publicly said he had done????????

Watson admits taking a drug that is now banned.

Incorrect. He was injected with a banned drug during 2012 when it had been banned under WADA category S0 since January 1 2011.

It hasn't suddenly been banned.

Essendon for some reason are confident that they will get off

Fair enough - presumption of innocence is a tenent of our justice system

. i dont want only Watson stood down because i beleive there are others who have admitted they used something that is banned.

Who are the others and can I see where they had admitted their guilt in public? Only one I know who has admitted that in public is Jobe Watson. But he still is allowed to play even though he admitted to taking a banned WADA drug.

When other Essendon players are dumb enough to plead guilty, they should be banned as well.

i didnt know the public decide the penalty.

They dont. the governing body of the sport, if it had any credibility, would decide that pending an investigation to the admission of guilt.

i think it is the AFL and ASADA so Watson telling us means bugger all to those 2 groups unless of course he is the only one who admitted use.

Who knows because the AFl are deathly silent on the issue. An admitted user of banned substances is not automatically stood down ios incredible and shows the AFL to be weak willed and have double standards.

it can stand him down for bring the game into disrepute or a number of other AFL rulings, but not a word from AFL. Really pathetic.

So my actual argument has always been to wait and see.

So was mine until Jobe Watson admitted guilt publicy. He has said he took a banned substance.

Wow thats so poorly thought out. it is so poorly thought out that it is actually happening.

Umm yes P66, we all know what is happenning, we are asking WHY is it happening when an AFL player has stated publicy that he has used a banned WADA drug. We are asking why doesn't the AFL clarify the situation. We are asking why they lean on some players to stand down when convicted of nothing, while letting an admitted drug cheat play and help his side win a match.

We are asking why the AFL is letting this farce continue and allowing it to taint the competition.

Amazing you can only see the narrowest of realities. Dont you have the capacity to ask why?

it seems we are waiting and seeing. Whether the public like it or not its happening.

Again we can all see the AFl isn't moving and allowing an admitted user of banned drugs play.

The question is WHY??????????????????

As for me being upset surely that is a joke. I have been challenged by many more than you over this issue. Cant see why when all I want to do is wait and see.

I think you may be getting upset P66. Dont know why. Only trying to get you to think with a bit of logic, not slavishly follow the party line.

All you can say is "wait and see". The bloke is an admitted drug cheat but still is allowed to play in the competition.

The AFLs reputation on illegal performance enhancing drugs is in absolute tatters.

They look like they are soft on drug users and are allowing it to taint the competition. You happy with that. Fair enough. You probably think WWE is fair dinkum as well.

So again quote this poorly thought out argument what ever that is.

Have done as you have asked.

And you can decontruct it all you like but that doesnt make you points any better than mine.

But that is the problem P66, yo dont have any points. All you are doing is following the AFL. You are not thinking for yourself or examining the fact as they have become known since Monday night.

And these are the facts.

Watson admits guilt in taking a banned drug in 2012 that has been on WADA's banned category S0 since 1st January 2012

AFL is a signatory to WADA.

AFL hear the admission of guilt.

AFL do not stand down the admitted drug cheat until the ASADA investigation is completed.

AFL credibility and integrity is in tatters.

Admitted drug cheat Watson helps his team to a 1 point win in a tained game because he is using performance enhancing drugs

Supporters ask why?

You dont ask why, but parrot Essendon and the AFL.

All it does is make your point as I make mine which is quite boring. Lets just wait and see.

Why do i have to wait and see, when I HAVE SEEN an admitted drug cheat on TV admit guilt?

YOu obviously dont think drug cheating is anything to worry about.

Others do.

Far to long but very impressive. try quoting that with substance. Still most of it means Jack.

[Con Gorozidis]

Plugger
Why are you so happy with the chance the bombers might get away with cheating ?

You seem to think you are a 'players man'
Which is just so sad.
Can I ask what level you played at ?
You like them a little too much and it leaves me a little uncomfortable .

And you haven't Pmed me .

[Con Gorozidis]

Ok
It's all out now
This is the bombers case laid bare. It is why they are so cocky .
I have two words to describe their defence .
Cheating c***s
http://m.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/wat ... 2p2wt.html

They should not win with this crap case .
But who knows how deep asadas legal pockets are ?
Maybe asada have agreed to compromise due to budget pressure and we all know the afl have deep pockets .
Asada can't afford 20 or 30 million in legal fees . For the afl it is spare change .
Cheating c***s .

Injustice coming soon unless wada comes in over the top .
I hope they do cos the afl has asada licked .

[Con Gorozidis]

Latest rumour is 'suspended sentences '

If that happens it will be disgusting .

P66 will be happy because he reckons he's 'mates with players '

Quick heads up. You're not the players mate and ill bet they make fun of you behind your back you saddo.

[BigMart]

Throw the book at them to stamp any grey out..... Never go easy on dodgy practises!

[plugger66]

Plugger
Why are you so happy with the chance the bombers might get away with cheating ?

You seem to think you are a 'players man'
Which is just so sad.
Can I ask what level you played at ?
You like them a little too much and it leaves me a little uncomfortable .

And you haven't Pmed me .

Con why do you make things up? Is it to try and make my arguments poor or to try and add something to yours? Show me one post of hundreds I have made on this topis where I have even slightly claimed I will be happy if Essendon get away with it. I actually have maintained since day Essendon have been pathetic in this whole topic. Also it is strange that you think it is so sad i am a players man. What a stupid comment. Have no idea what level I played at has to do with anything but I played very poorly in A grade Ammos which is a very good competition. Also have no idea why me liking players leave you uncomfortable. I havent had sex with many of them but even the few I did it was quite comfortable. By the way I dont remember why i need to PM you. Im happy for you to pm me. Maybe I can replace Kevin Rudd as pm. Now please stop lying about how I feel about Essendon.

[SainterK]

I feel bad for the players, Jobe is evidence enough for mine how they're struggling.

This isn't just about the fear of cheating, it's all the potential side effects long term.

I've always said I'd be happy for the players not to be directly punished, but for it to be a loss of premiership points and the club heavily sanctioned.

[Sobraz]

The broom is sweeping like never before..

That article, full of lawyer double speak, does nothing but skirt the issue and highjack the intention.

Why were players taken to an off site location and administered drugs by someone other than their club doctor?

Why consider using AOD in the first place if it is relatively pointless, or covered in such grey areas?

Wavers?

They will get away with this, like many fearfully predicted, but they are drug cheats of the highest order.. Systemic team doping..

A disgrace. The game is dead.

[plugger66]

The broom is sweeping like never before..

That article, full of lawyer double speak, does nothing but skirt the issue and highjack the intention.

Why were players taken to an off site location and administered drugs by someone other than their club doctor?

Why consider using AOD in the first place if it is relatively pointless, or covered in such grey areas?

Wavers?

They will get away with this, like many fearfully predicted, but they are drug cheats of the highest order.. Systemic team doping..

A disgrace. The game is dead.

Why and how will they get away with it? If they cheated they will go and if they didnt they shouldnt go. Have no idea why the game is dead. Maybe because the saints arent going well. I bet if we were on top of the ladder the game wouldnt be dead.

[dragit]

I feel bad for the players, Jobe is evidence enough for mine how they're struggling.

This isn't just about the fear of cheating, it's all the potential side effects long term.

I've always said I'd be happy for the players not to be directly punished, but for it to be a loss of premiership points and the club heavily sanctioned.

That would do nothing to encourage players to take a little bit of ownership of what goes in their bodies... If the club dr says its okay, then all good... If its not okay the club will take the wrap.

Professional athletes, whether in individual or team sports need to take responsibility... EFC have failed their players, but unfortunately that is bad luck, the players need to be penalised too.

[happy feet]

There has been some fantastic debate and Banter on this thread. P66 and Con, I stand in awe of your efforts in all your posts. I have been thinking about this topic for a while and thought I would throw this contribution into the mix. I once heard rugby league great Wayne "Junior" Pierce talk to a group of kids about sport and why you should always play within the rules. He said that if you broke the rules when you played, and if you do happen to win, you will know deep in your heart you did not deserve to win.

So to the Bomber fans, I say this, go your hardest and if you do happen to taste that ultimate success enjoy that nagging doubt that you will have in the back of your mind 'were we good enough or was it something else'. The players will have to carry this doubt for the rest of their lives. Jobe Watson seems like a good bloke, he will be thinking this every time he looks at Charlie. If there are no sanctions, then we will have lost any integrity in our game for a long long time, but those involved in this sorry saga at the Bombers will carry this around with them, inside them like a cancer, forever. I can't think of a worse punishment.

[mullet]

Yep we all know it didnt "offend the WADA prohibited list"

However they didnt check carefully enough. It wasnt approved for use.

EFC didnt check properly, they didnt know what they were doing, but still used their players as chemical test tubes.

It isnt that hard to check for something if you check properly with both eyes open.

[Dis Believer]

Id love to know what you think my argument actually is.

Everyone would love to know it, but it seems very confused

I have said time again I have no idea if Essendon players are guilty or not.

I dont understand, why did you say that the players had told ASADA the same thing that Watson publicly said he had done????????

Watson admits taking a drug that is now banned.

Incorrect. He was injected with a banned drug during 2012 when it had been banned under WADA category S0 since January 1 2011.

It hasn't suddenly been banned.

Essendon for some reason are confident that they will get off

Fair enough - presumption of innocence is a tenent of our justice system

. i dont want only Watson stood down because i beleive there are others who have admitted they used something that is banned.

Who are the others and can I see where they had admitted their guilt in public? Only one I know who has admitted that in public is Jobe Watson. But he still is allowed to play even though he admitted to taking a banned WADA drug.

When other Essendon players are dumb enough to plead guilty, they should be banned as well.

i didnt know the public decide the penalty.

They dont. the governing body of the sport, if it had any credibility, would decide that pending an investigation to the admission of guilt.

i think it is the AFL and ASADA so Watson telling us means bugger all to those 2 groups unless of course he is the only one who admitted use.

Who knows because the AFl are deathly silent on the issue. An admitted user of banned substances is not automatically stood down ios incredible and shows the AFL to be weak willed and have double standards.

it can stand him down for bring the game into disrepute or a number of other AFL rulings, but not a word from AFL. Really pathetic.

So my actual argument has always been to wait and see.

So was mine until Jobe Watson admitted guilt publicy. He has said he took a banned substance.

Wow thats so poorly thought out. it is so poorly thought out that it is actually happening.

Umm yes P66, we all know what is happenning, we are asking WHY is it happening when an AFL player has stated publicy that he has used a banned WADA drug. We are asking why doesn't the AFL clarify the situation. We are asking why they lean on some players to stand down when convicted of nothing, while letting an admitted drug cheat play and help his side win a match.

We are asking why the AFL is letting this farce continue and allowing it to taint the competition.

Amazing you can only see the narrowest of realities. Dont you have the capacity to ask why?

it seems we are waiting and seeing. Whether the public like it or not its happening.

Again we can all see the AFl isn't moving and allowing an admitted user of banned drugs play.

The question is WHY??????????????????

As for me being upset surely that is a joke. I have been challenged by many more than you over this issue. Cant see why when all I want to do is wait and see.

I think you may be getting upset P66. Dont know why. Only trying to get you to think with a bit of logic, not slavishly follow the party line.

All you can say is "wait and see". The bloke is an admitted drug cheat but still is allowed to play in the competition.

The AFLs reputation on illegal performance enhancing drugs is in absolute tatters.

They look like they are soft on drug users and are allowing it to taint the competition. You happy with that. Fair enough. You probably think WWE is fair dinkum as well.

So again quote this poorly thought out argument what ever that is.

Have done as you have asked.

And you can decontruct it all you like but that doesnt make you points any better than mine.

But that is the problem P66, yo dont have any points. All you are doing is following the AFL. You are not thinking for yourself or examining the fact as they have become known since Monday night.

And these are the facts.

Watson admits guilt in taking a banned drug in 2012 that has been on WADA's banned category S0 since 1st January 2012

AFL is a signatory to WADA.

AFL hear the admission of guilt.

AFL do not stand down the admitted drug cheat until the ASADA investigation is completed.

AFL credibility and integrity is in tatters.

Admitted drug cheat Watson helps his team to a 1 point win in a tained game because he is using performance enhancing drugs

Supporters ask why?

You dont ask why, but parrot Essendon and the AFL.

All it does is make your point as I make mine which is quite boring. Lets just wait and see.

Why do i have to wait and see, when I HAVE SEEN an admitted drug cheat on TV admit guilt?

YOu obviously dont think drug cheating is anything to worry about.

Others do.

You and I run across each others bows a fair bit, but this is your finest post ever - well done sir.....

[Sobraz]

Have no idea why the game is dead. Maybe because the saints arent going well.

Nothing to do with the Saints..

The fact that a club that undertook a planned program to gain an edge through illegal ('or right on the borderline' ) practices, and have found a way to make it so convoluted that its all too hard, and the game goes on as if nothing's happened..

We all know they cheated.. Or at the very very least, intended to cheat.. What were their priorities? What was their ultimate aim? Can the explain, why go own this road? The real questions are being ignored over issues of definition and timeframes.. There is no integrity..

I've said it before plugger, if not got the Saints, for me, the game can go f@%k itself.. Never more than right now.. It's actually upsetting me, but that's the nasty reality our game is played in..

[markp]

Have no idea why the game is dead. Maybe because the saints arent going well.

Nothing to do with the Saints..

The fact that a club that undertook a planned program to gain an edge through illegal ('or right on the borderline' ) practices, and have found a way to make it so convoluted that its all too hard, and the game goes on as if nothing's happened..

We all know they cheated.. Or at the very very least, intended to cheat.. What were their priorities? What was their ultimate aim? Can the explain, why go own this road? The real questions are being ignored over issues of definition and timeframes.. There is no integrity..

I've said it before plugger, if not got the Saints, for me, the game can go f@%k itself.. Never more than right now.. It's actually upsetting me, but that's the nasty reality our game is played in..

I think they'll get there's shortly, and big time.

USADA was criticised, mocked, vilified during the lance armstrong investigations, many gave him the benefit of the doubt right up to the last, and he never tested positive either. WADA wont give a damn about how 'big' the EFC are in an obscure little sporting code played down under.

I keep saying, Warne got 12 months for taking a single diuretic tablet 'his mum gave him'.

They are gawn... I suspect the AFL are currently remaining silent because they know the hammer fall is imminent anyway.

[remboy]

The feeling from the AFL is probably that once it was being investigated by WADA and ASADA they had to wait for those bodies to finish their investigations. I still think that even if ASADA say they haven't got enough proof to charge the players, the AFL will then step in and lay their own penalties.
At the very least this whole event has been a bad look for the AFL. It's hard enough competing against other football and sporting codes at the best of times. I think the AFL will be very keen to protect their brand and the Bombers will feel it eventually.
Having said all of that, I still think the AFL should be saying something. Even if it's to support the players while the investigation goes on.
I know it's a totally separate incident but why should we have to suspend Milne while Essendon are given a green light to play. I'm not sure if it was Westaway or someone else but they said the AFL need to come up with some guidelines as to how clubs are meant to handle these worts of situations. I don't think it's good enough for the AFL to sit back and let the clubs take their own action and then say, after the fact, whether or not they are happy. If they had a blanket rule for how clubs should handle situations where clubs or players are under investigation it would at least let us know where they stand on these matters. At the moment nobody has got any idea.

[matrix]

It could be written on a stick of celery that it was legal....it doesn't matter.

Suspended sentaces

[Mr Magic]

I've missed the last 6 pages of this thread.
Anything new?

[magnifisaint]

I've missed the last 6 pages of this thread.
Anything new?

Peter Bell who is a lawyer reckons that Watson should have been stepped down immediately after he made his admission

[Scollop]

Ok
It's all out now
This is the bombers case laid bare. It is why they are so cocky .
I have two words to describe their defence .
Cheating c***s
http://m.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/wat ... 2p2wt.html

May I remind you sir of your previous post

Im glad to see some sense is prevailing on here!

There is just so much evidence to suggest that EFC and Hird have been lying about this since day 1.

And this notion that it is all super complicated and their clever Lawyers are going to save them and set them free based on some expert legal knowledge is hilarious.

When lawyers look at a footy club - they see bags of money and gullible clients.

"yeah guys this is really complicated and we can make a case on your behalf - here is our charging schedule and our bank account number'.

...and after you read this, go back to theage.com.au article and read the last couple of sentences...Kane is basically saying that it's going to be near impossible for EFC to use as part of their defense that they weren't using AOD as a PED...but on the other hand someone has to pay for the lease on the Range Rover

[Scollop]

Yep we all know it didnt "offend the WADA prohibited list"

However they didnt check carefully enough. It wasnt approved for use.

EFC didnt check properly, they didnt know what they were doing, but still used their players as chemical test tubes.

It isnt that hard to check for something if you check properly with both eyes open.

The information was easily accessible and publicly available for all Essendon players to check in early 2012 but I agree with someone else said; players are spoon fed from the time they arrive at their club.

In a way, this whole scandal is a wakeup call for parents of these young men. Essendon deceived its players and that is why I reckon a few of them including Mark McVeigh and Jobe Watson feel betrayed by the people they trusted.