I took banned drug: Watson

[matrix]

not really Mr Magic

few links
basically the same stuff, opinion pieces really
con and pluggsy debating
and 95% of us saying they should be dealt with harshly (bombers not plugger and con)

[Mr Magic]

Why was Essendon using AOD9604?
For the players to lose weight????

Everything their Sports Science Dept was suggesting/doing was for one purpose alone.
TO improve an aspect of performance.
They weren't just trying to 'catch up' to the competition.
They were trying to 'get in front' of the competition and went to people who could deliver that result.

The minute those in charge (whomever it was) agreed to employ Dank they chose to go down the path they did.

Everything they did since that point in time strongly suggests (I cannot say prove yet) they were prepared to go further than any other club has previously.
They wanted to be #1 and deliberately chose to take on a program of chemical enhancing to achieve their goal.

I don't feel any sympathy for Jobe Watson or any other Essendon player.
I don't for one second believe that not one of them questioned the whole 'chemical program' that was being proposed and they all willingly partook in it. Now that they've been caught they're all 'misled poor athletes'.

IMHO James Hird and Bomber Thompson's fingerprints are all over this and the sooner the sycophants (footy media) wake up to this 'butter wouldn't melt in my mouth' routine, the sooner the delusional Essendon fans will understand they are supporting a club of systematic cheats. (Even the delusional Melbourne fans recognized their team had tanked.)

[SaintPav]

Heard today from someone who works in the media that the word is that Bombers will get fined $5 miilion with no suspensions. Bombers has very strong evidence that they got permission from ASADA that Aod-9604 was ok to use. Not sure if it's true or not and I don't think it makes any sense.

[BigD]

Heard today from someone who works in the media that the word is that Bombers will get fined $5 miilion with no suspensions. Bombers has very strong evidence that they got permission from ASADA that Aod-9604 was ok to use. Not sure if it's true or not and I don't think it makes any sense.

If they had permission to take it why would they be fined.
Bit implausible.
Though you can be fined $500k for not tanking so anything is possible'
Also -the first reporter to have this knowledge would put it straight out there.
They are all so desperate to break the scoop.

[Life Long Saint]

Still don't see how the players can escape a penalty. WADA language is quite specific in who is responsible for what goes into an athlete's body. The fact that no Essendon player bothered to check is very poor.
Wouldn't be an acceptable excuse anywhere else.

[Eastern]

Lets look at the process once charges are laid;

An AFL Tribunal will determine Innocence or Guilt

The AFL will guide the Tribunal on any sanctions they are to hand down

ASADA and WADA will need to approve the sanctions handed down, otherwise they can appeal to the Court of Arbitration for Sport. On this, they can appeal either way

The AFL Commission can lay extra charges (Disrepute, Governance etc) ON TOP of any original charges. They can also set whatever sanction they like

I don't think their is any further options AFTER the Court of Arbitration for Sport, however any extra sanctions can be taken to Court

Still a LOT to be played out on this !!

[Wayne42]

Lets look at the process once charges are laid;

An AFL Tribunal will determine Innocence or Guilt

The AFL will guide the Tribunal on any sanctions they are to hand down

ASADA and WADA will need to approve the sanctions handed down, otherwise they can appeal to the Court of Arbitration for Sport. On this, they can appeal either way

The AFL Commission can lay extra charges (Disrepute, Governance etc) ON TOP of any original charges. They can also set whatever sanction they like

I don't think their is any further options AFTER the Court of Arbitration for Sport, however any extra sanctions can be taken to Court

Still a LOT to be played out on this !!

It'll never end at this rate...

[Con Gorozidis]

If the bombers weazle out of this then the blue print has been laid down .
Lets get the best sports scientists from Germany or the nfl in the USA and have the things in place - so that in the unlikely event of being caught - to create some plausible deniability .
In short lets make dank look like the rank amateur he is

[dragit]

If the bombers weazle out of this then the blue print has been laid down .
Lets get the best sports scientists from Germany or the nfl in the USA and have the things in place - so that in the unlikely event of being caught - to create some plausible deniability .
In short lets make dank look like the rank amateur he is

I like it, the "Rank... Tank n' dank"



Someone get some T-shirts made up.

[Waltzing St Kilda]

For years the AFL couldn't even enforce their own clash strip policy on the Bombers. We had a farcical situation where St Kilda was wearing its clash strip against Essendon at home games.

What chance then that the AFL has the balls to punish the Bombers in any meaningful way? They'll probably be so frazzled by their own inadequacy that they'll take out their frustration on some other team instead.

[Eastern]

For years the AFL couldn't even enforce their own clash strip policy on the Bombers. We had a farcical situation where St Kilda was wearing its clash strip against Essendon at home games.

What chance then that the AFL has the balls to punish the Bombers in any meaningful way? They'll probably be so frazzled by their own inadequacy that they'll take out their frustration on some other team instead.

Thankfully, any punishment/charges (if found guilty) MUST meet the approval of ASADA/WADA !!

[stinger]

and 95% of us saying they should be dealt with harshly (bombers not plugger and con)

whoa there...need to think about the plugga one a bit more...don't be too hasty....

[bobmurray]

Thompson is keeping a very low profile throughout this saga...is he to blame for the whole program, or was it Hird ?"

[gringo]

If the bombers weazle out of this then the blue print has been laid down .
Lets get the best sports scientists from Germany or the nfl in the USA and have the things in place - so that in the unlikely event of being caught - to create some plausible deniability .
In short lets make dank look like the rank amateur he is

I'm all for it get them so many freakin drugs they look like pin headed bearded circus ladies or the east german women's swimming team anyway. I want Rhys Stanley's guns so big his knuckles drag and Newnes getting round looking like he has futons gaffered to his biceps.

[SainterK]

Thompson is keeping a very low profile throughout this saga...is he to blame for the whole program, or was it Hird ?"

They still haven't interviewed him.

I wonder if he is being difficult as much as Dank is when it comes to questioning.

[Sobraz]

Thompson is keeping a very low profile throughout this saga...is he to blame for the whole program, or was it Hird ?"

They still haven't interviewed him.

I wonder if he is being difficult as much as Dank is when it comes to questioning.

If he ever took his head out of a massive bag of coke maybe he'd be able to answer some questions..

[Con Gorozidis]

Ok so this is the bombers official case.

1. Doc Reid saw a letter from dank
2. Even if this letter is a fraud we genuinely believed it was legit at the time .

For a strict liability regime . My personal opinion is they are toast .
I also believe that reliance on a geriatric old dr like doc Reid who wouldn't no jack about this kind of thing is naive and unreasonable. The afl is partly responsible for this because their education places a lot of responsibility on the club dr . This was probably ok in the 80s but with 20 or 30 medical staff at a club and a part time dr this is no longer adequate.

So essendon have been misled by the afl in some ways . But that is not wada or asadas problem.

Bombers need to go down.

[Con Gorozidis]

Ok
So as we all suspect Dank is a snake oil salesman .
But Hirdy and Evans were lapping it up.

These two guys have been exposed as the morons they truly are .

They are so thick they remain confident and oblivious to just how thick they are .

http://m.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/bom ... 2p48d.html

[The OtherThommo]

Ok
So as we all suspect Dank is a snake oil salesman .
But Hirdy and Evans were lapping it up.

These two guys have been exposed as the morons they truly are .

They are so thick they remain confident and oblivious to just how thick they are .

http://m.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/bom ... 2p48d.html

Welcome back to the fray, Nick McKenzie and Richard Baker. I wondered what they were working on. Although they mention investments weren't made by the likes of Hird and Evans in any company involved in AOD 9064, Evans and Hird were given a presentation by Calzada. From memory that presentation was before the program began at Essendon. Given Evans had hired Hird to work at Goldman Sachs JB Were, before he hired him to coach, one always wondered if ASADA would send the sniffer dogs down that particular burrow.

I still can't see how this might absolve the players. I would think participation in a program with an added financial enhancement benefit to promoters and others would befit the "strict liability" reasoning even more. I don't recall East German or Chinese swimmers getting a pass because their overseers got an earn out of what the athletes were given.

The "euphoria" angle is also interesting. Maybe they should have tried medical marijuana?

You're right, Con. Evans and Hird always looked dills, more so when the Calzada presentation came out. What, they just happened not to mention is wasn't approved for human use, yet, or didn't Evans or Hird ask, being the top notch biotech analysts they were? Obviously Calzada chose Evans and Hird to present to because of their lack of conflict.

The dots aren't all that hard to join. 1) Evans and Hird receive Calzada presentation and Calzada control AOD 9064 2) Essendon design consent forms for some players to take AOD 9064.

"Strict liability" didn't go away. Like I said, welcome back Richard and Nick.

[matrix]

"far exceeded clinical trials"


gawn...........
have to be

[mullet]

That is a really interesting read. I am surprised there isnt more going on in the news about these latest revelations.

Essendon as a club are in for a huge penalty, I'm starting to think.

Surely the coaches must be sanctioned, especially hird, as he attended a presentation on the drug for god sake, so he knew they were taking it.

I think players may get the lightest penalty available as they are starting to look like the victims, however, the strict liability enforced by WADA will ensure they dont get away without being sanctioned. Which players and how many, who knows. Jobe would have to be one of them though.

[saintspremiers]

That is a really interesting read. I am surprised there isnt more going on in the news about these latest revelations.

Essendon as a club are in for a huge penalty, I'm starting to think.

Surely the coaches must be sanctioned, especially hird, as he attended a presentation on the drug for god sake, so he knew they were taking it.

I think players may get the lightest penalty available as they are starting to look like the victims, however, the strict liability enforced by WADA will ensure they dont get away without being sanctioned. Which players and how many, who knows. Jobe would have to be one of them though.

Indeed. It's all about limiting the player suspensions now.

Demetriou would be shitting himself about this. If he can't convince WADA to go light on the players it's a very bad look for the AFL.

[Eastern]

Lets look at the process once charges are laid;

An AFL Tribunal will determine Innocence or Guilt

The AFL will guide the Tribunal on any sanctions they are to hand down

ASADA and WADA will need to approve the sanctions handed down, otherwise they can appeal to the Court of Arbitration for Sport. On this, they can appeal either way

The AFL Commission can lay extra charges (Disrepute, Governance etc) ON TOP of any original charges. They can also set whatever sanction they like

I don't think their is any further options AFTER the Court of Arbitration for Sport, however any extra sanctions can be taken to Court

Still a LOT to be played out on this !!

It'll never end at this rate...

That would be what mesers Hird, Evans, Thompson & Watson would be hoping !!

[Eastern]

Should this whole sorry saga be viewed this way?

ESSENDON DIDN'T CHEAT. THEY PROVIDED THE TOOLS, PROCESSES & FACILITIES FOR THEIR PLAYERS TO CHEAT !!

[Eastern]

Deleted !!