Watters "Clear headed"

[Sobraz]

Assuming GWS take Boyd at 1, get Franklin, and are still in need of a ruck...

With an excess of big forwards, would anyone entertain the idea of a McEvoy - Patton straight swap?? Keep our pick 3/4, just a player for player trade?

[bigcarl]

Talk of trading McEvoy surprises me.

He's finally starting to show glimpses as his body develops - yet we're looking to offload him?

Yeah, let's not trade away our future.

[gringo]

Assuming GWS take Boyd at 1, get Franklin, and are still in need of a ruck...

With an excess of big forwards, would anyone entertain the idea of a McEvoy - Patton straight swap?? Keep our pick 3/4, just a player for player trade?

i would but I would want a medical on his knees- he was off in Austria or somewhere in his first year getting them done and now a serious knee injury will make him less appealing but if it came back clear a big yeas. Rucks can come cheap but the next Jonathan Brown doesn't come along too often.

[plugger66]

Assuming GWS take Boyd at 1, get Franklin, and are still in need of a ruck...

With an excess of big forwards, would anyone entertain the idea of a McEvoy - Patton straight swap?? Keep our pick 3/4, just a player for player trade?

i would but I would want a medical on his knees- he was off in Austria or somewhere in his first year getting them done and now a serious knee injury will make him less appealing but if it came back clear a big yeas. Rucks can come cheap but the next Jonathan Brown doesn't come along too often.

Neither does the next Big Cox. Both are unlikely to happen but its amazing how we can use names to make the trade appeal or not appeal.

[Richter]

Will Boyd be as good as McEvoy??

I'm sure most would laugh at the comparison, but McEvoy is a superior player to Kruezer, who was the clear #1 in his draft... What's to say Boyd is any different??

Indeed. Though I am not sure that McEvoy is superior to Kreuzer, probably at about the same level give or take... both range of 10-20 in their draft.

Our last superb draft/trade year as it turns out (though 2012 may eclipse it... too early to tell)

#9 Ben McEvoy (one of a few decent rucks - Kreuzer, Bellchambers, Mumford)
#26 traded for Schneider and Dempster (the best value steak knifes in the AFL!)
#42 Jack Steven - knocking on the door of being in the top 10 players in that draft and showing signs of becoming A grade
#57 Fraser Gehrig
#70 Eljay Connors

[st_Trav_ofWA]

Neither does the next Big Cox. Both are unlikely to happen but its amazing how we can use names to make the trade appeal or not appeal.

its fun to play around with it though plugger ... the fact is in all the time i have been posting on here not one hypothetical trade floated on here has come true ... as fans we have our fun thinking who we should target ect ... thankfully the club have professionals who would morethan likly have the wheels in motion for this years trades and drafts

[Beno88]

Will Boyd be as good as McEvoy??

I'm sure most would laugh at the comparison, but McEvoy is a superior player to Kruezer, who was the clear #1 in his draft... What's to say Boyd is any different??

Indeed. Though I am not sure that McEvoy is superior to Kreuzer, probably at about the same level give or take... both range of 10-20 in their draft.

You're kidding right? McEvoy is five times the player Kreuzer is. Comfortably. And doesn't have the injury concerns. Even Carlton supporters would agree with that.

[SainterK]

We've an abundance of specialist forwards, any interest?

[Richter]

Will Boyd be as good as McEvoy??

I'm sure most would laugh at the comparison, but McEvoy is a superior player to Kruezer, who was the clear #1 in his draft... What's to say Boyd is any different??

Indeed. Though I am not sure that McEvoy is superior to Kreuzer, probably at about the same level give or take... both range of 10-20 in their draft.

You're kidding right? McEvoy is five times the player Kreuzer is. Comfortably. And doesn't have the injury concerns. Even Carlton supporters would agree with that.

Think you need to take the St Kilda spectacles off.

Whilst you claim that Kreuzer has injury concerns he's played more AFL games than big Ben - coming up to his 100th (compared to 84). Kreuzer is the better tap ruckman (though no star) and the better forward option. They're probably around level as followers (Kreuzer seems to be forever showing potential but not breaking through in this area) whilst Ben is the better defensive mark.

Kreuzer is marked more harshly because he was taken at #1 but, like Bryce Gibbs and Jack Watts, he remains a decent footballer.

[cwrcyn]

Just take pick 3 or 4, and pick 21 or 22 and pick the best players you can. Beyond that, trade an experienced older player and maybe a third round pick for a competent key defender. Follow the same pattern next year and it should give us what we need.

[Con Gorozidis]

It's vitally important we keep those players aged in their early to mid 20's - Roberton, Geary, Armitage, Stanley, McEvoy and Steven. That's our core right there.

Totally agree....
If we get say Aish + best available kid at 22 plus a 25 yo old key defender ill be happy.

My only concern is I believe Stanley is a ruckman and that we have 3 ruckmen of similar ages.

Not sure how we should manage this? I cant see Rhys or Hickey happily running around in the VFL for the next 6 years.

[Old Mate]

Agree Con. I like Stanley cos he can play that swingman role and is perfect as that second ruck man. Hickey and McEvoy are one position players. I still cannot understand the Hickey investment unless we don't rate Ben.

[Siposstar#2]

Agree Con. I like Stanley cos he can play that swingman role and is perfect as that second ruck man. Hickey and McEvoy are one position players. I still cannot understand the Hickey investment unless we don't rate Ben.

Last year they were both injured? Who would have known both woul have such good injury runs this year? Especially with Rhys' injury history

[Old Mate]

Agree Con. I like Stanley cos he can play that swingman role and is perfect as that second ruck man. Hickey and McEvoy are one position players. I still cannot understand the Hickey investment unless we don't rate Ben.

Last year they were both injured? Who would have known both woul have such good injury runs this year? Especially with Rhys' injury history

Agreed we needed ruck depth. Just question the large investment for a 'back up' ruck man ie draft picks (I realise there was more to the trade than just giving pick 13). For team balance I don't see both Hickey and Ben in the same team.

[BigMart]

Every player has a price

But you need to do well out of the trade....

It's like making a purchase, you cannot want it to much, or get in a bidding war.... Or you'll end up paying overs...

[The Redeemer]

about dp #1, at his presser today


Now that could mean anything, but he did not rule out the possibility of trading for it.


trading will be a real interesting time this year.

We've been reported to be one of the clubs in talks with GWS about acquiring pick 1. Personally I don't like this path. As BM has said a number of times, pick 1 does not mean the best player from the draft. As we know pick 1 equals Tom Boyd and tall's often do not live up to their expectations whereas midfielders are a surer bet. Instead of paying overs (example McEvoy and pick 3) I'd get best available at pick 3 and take a punt on tall timber later in the draft. I'd be looking at trading for pick 1 if we didn't have a top 5 selection up our sleeve but we are in a strong position as it is, why get greedy?

If we trade McEvoy and pick 3 then what?

We don't have a mature ruck that will match up with our slightly younger mids in sync with the idea that talls take longer to develop than smalls.

It makes no sense whatsoever to execute the trade suggested.

[Heidelberg_Saint]

Just take pick 3 or 4, and pick 21 or 22 and pick the best players you can. Beyond that, trade an experienced older player and maybe a third round pick for a competent key defender. Follow the same pattern next year and it should give us what we need.

Totally agree.

[Wayne42]

What if we were thinking of trading say Dal and McEvoy for pick 1, and picking up say Aish and Scharenburg (or whatever two top mids).

How would that sit with people?

Or Dal and Gilbo (or Dal in some other combo)???

Everyone keeps looking at Boyd for the number one, but what if we're concocting a way to get the top two mids in this years draft? What if we constructed a deal with (assuming we get pick 3 and GWS get pick 1) whoever gets pick 2 that they get Boyd, and we get pick 1 & 3, but we don't take Boyd with pick 1?

There's more than one way to skin a cat......

Example : We send Dal & pick 3 to Melb, and Gilbo to GWS and Melbourne give us a pick two, send a ruckman to GWS (pick one of plenty they have). GWS give us pick 1, and we allow Boyd to go to dees at pick 3.

GWS Get GIlbo and a decent ruck for pick 1, Dees get Dal and Boyd for a decent ruck and, and we get two gun young mids for Dal and Gilbo.

I like your suggestion, supporter loyalty to the players is one thing but waiting since 1966 is another thing entirely, I want to see real success, in my lifetime, so do what it takes

[SaintPav]

Will Boyd be as good as McEvoy??

I'm sure most would laugh at the comparison, but McEvoy is a superior player to Kruezer, who was the clear #1 in his draft... What's to say Boyd is any different??

Indeed. Though I am not sure that McEvoy is superior to Kreuzer, probably at about the same level give or take... both range of 10-20 in their draft.

Our last superb draft/trade year as it turns out (though 2012 may eclipse it... too early to tell)

#9 Ben McEvoy (one of a few decent rucks - Kreuzer, Bellchambers, Mumford)
#26 traded for Schneider and Dempster (the best value steak knifes in the AFL!)
#42 Jack Steven - knocking on the door of being in the top 10 players in that draft and showing signs of becoming A grade
#57 Fraser Gehrig
#70 Eljay Connors[/quote

We let Barlow go after he trained with us over 07/08. He would have been very handy.

[southernsaint]

Well you would have to say that g.w.s. dont really want boyd otherwise they wouldnt be thinking about trading pick 1. They probably happy to take one of the top three or so midfielders in the draft but hoping to con a good ruckman and defender out of a bottom four club, but still able to then draft another gun midfielder. If you look at our draw, melbournes and the dogs there is a fair chance we could end up with pick 2, pick 3 at worse. Maybe we should try the compensation pick g.w.s has which i think is pick 8 or 10 and draft two midfielders. If boyd slips to us we could still pick up a top ten midfielder. It all sounds good in theory, but just dont think we are that well placed to trade with g.w.s. for what they want.

[saintbrat]

what did he say

http://www.saints.com.au/video/2013-07- ... ce-in-full

[older saint]

I would be trying for Jonathon Paton instead of pick1. He might come a bit cheaper as well.

Well Patton would replace Roo when he goes. IMO Patton would cost a top 5 pick.

I'm not sure how highly rated Patton is internally at the club. There was a recent article where Sheedy named a few players he thinks will become AFL legends. Cameron's name was suggested as well as a number of midfielders. Patton's name didn't come up. With Buddy a likely addition to their roster and Cameron already there, I would think GWS would think carefully about trading pick 1 (Boyd) or perhaps Patton instead given his knee issues.

You are probably right, Patton is still valued highly and it would take a pick inside the top 5 to pry him away. Or perhaps we look at a player + pick 20 (our second rounder)? Not sure if that would get it done but I hope its a question the recruiters are asking.

Pattons knees are stuffed - don't want damaged goods regardless of age

[Old Mate]

Yeah I've heard his knees are stuffed even prior to the ACL.....but still good enough to go pick 1 a few years back. Would require the standard medical checks.

[saintsRrising]

I don't really see the point in us having a crack for the number 1 pick this year. We have Tom Lee and Spencer White who we picked up last year as up and coming key forwards. Sure we don't know that they will make it but I don't see the point in narrowing our options at this stage by gunning for Boyd at #1. Better we grab a top quality mid like Aish or Kelly this year. Next year we'll have a bit more of a sense of how Tom Lee at the least is going and we can decide then whether we aim for another KPP at our first pick.

Agree.

With Stanley, Lee, and White we have some potential up forward already. In addition Siposs will gain strength over the next year or two. Hickey may or may not improve as a ruck forward as well.

We need a classy mid. We have depth mids, but need some real class to aid Steven.

We also need a key back or 2, but do not need to trade a an early pick for one.

[BigMart]

There is one basic thing you have to be able to do as a key fwd....

Take a one out or pack contested grab.... Inside 50, not as a floating third man in either

Haven't seen hickey do that in 10 games since pre season started... At any level yet

Lee, Kosi, White, Staley, Siposs and of course Nick all have taken grabs