Rich club, poor club

[casey scorp]

As a supporter I was annoyed about the Tassie games because we just couldn't win down there and it definitely cost us top 4 in '06 plus we lost crucial games there in '04 and '05 that could have put us in a much better position for a flag ( e.g. Not having to play in Brisbane first week of the '04 finals) .

I went to most of our Tassie games.

I was annoyed too. But not because "we just couldn't win down there". In fact we won most of our games there.

But we were just not the same team down there. When you go to the footy sometimes you know a team "has come to play". Never, ever, did you get that feeling about St Kilda in Launceston. They were lethargic and sloppy. They lost to teams they just shouldn't have, and just fell in when you were anticipating a percentage booster. You almost always left those games feeling flat.

[evertonfc]

No doubt the article by Jake "Hawthorn" Niall is a great read for smug Hawks supporters (is there any other kind?)

Niall is a Collingwood supporter.

BTW the first club to to move to Docklands (Essendon) had an almost undefeated season its first year there and won the flag.

What does that have to do with anything?

How do you know he's a Collingwood supporter?

He's a Collingwood supporter. It's well known inside footy circles. But he's an extremely astute observer of the game.

I think some St Kilda supporters need to wear this shirt around town.

[skeptic]

I had a lot of respect for GT but his push to get us out of Tassie was pbly the single worse thing that has happened to ys. I feel like if we had adjusted to playing at launceston n perfected our preparation, for travel n wet windy weather footy... it wld have served us well Sept 09

[suss]

I had a lot of respect for GT but his push to get us out of Tassie was pbly the single worse thing that has happened to ys. I feel like if we had adjusted to playing at launceston n perfected our preparation, for travel n wet windy weather footy... it wld have served us well Sept 09

... and he was the coach at the time. That's the embarrassing part- letting the coach make administrative decisions. Insanity.

[Johnny Member]

I would doubt that GT made the call. But I'd imagine he had a fair bit of clout in influencing the decision.

But ultimately, the Board and President would have made the call.

[wolfpup]

In today's Age, Jake Niall writes a thought provoking piece on 4 key decisions which have seen the off field fortunes of St KIlda and Hawthorn diverge in the years since they were struggling co-tenants at Waverley in the late 90s. He argues that Hawthorn have made 4 savvy decisions which have turned them into a financial powerhouse and that the Saints, while they have done a lot of things right, have taken less strategic options. His 4 pivotal decisions are:

Firstly, the decision to embrace/reject the Tasmanian partnership

Secondly, the decision to move to the MCG/Docklands as home base

Thirdly, the decision about home base; Hawthorn moved from Glenferrie and bought the freehold to the Waverley training base from the AFL for $1 while St Kilda swapped Moorabbin for Seaford

Fourthly, Hawthorn invested wisely and reaped millions from pokies at Waverley Gardens while we've got into two losing stoushes with both Moorabbin and Frankston councils.

End result, says Niall, Hawks have vaulted themselves to be one of the moneyed clubs of the AFL while we find ourselves in the soup kitchen.

Worth a read: http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/h ... 2zcsl.html

I am late to this but St.Kilda is unique in Melbourne as we are the only Melbourne team south of the yarra so we may have used that to our advantage. The decisions made to move to Seaford was made in the height of the property boom and just before the GFC hit, i guess from a pre GFC standpoint it was a reasonable choice to move down there. Also it was cheap and we had govt, afl and local council support (lots of money being thrown at the development).


We had the chance to move to Port Melbourne the area earmarked for our potential future home is being developed over the next year or so and its near the cnr of Williamstown Rd and Graham street in the big parkland area. The surrounding areas were industrial and have been rezoned as residential and the parkland is to be surrounded by the biggest residential re-development in Australia's history. Also the parkland at least is part of the City of Port Phillip (home St,Kilda). Oh well.

The footy first ticket did some really good stuff however, they introduced a vast increase in spending on training, sports technology, etc, the Seaford facilities are excellent certainly compared to Moorabin. I am sure that the growth of Seaford, etc will occur over the years albeit at a slower rate and I am sure we will be fine.

As for pokies, i have no idea about pokies, how they work, etc

[Johnny Member]

I think what is interesting about the Saints, and unique, is that although we were 'successful' for a decade - it was never plain sailing.

So where we played finals and in GFs but never really capitalised on it compared other clubs, I think our situation was a bit different.

We were making dough from 2003-2006 on the back of on-field performance and excitement. Although the conservative Docklands deal turned out to be a dud, it's hard to blame Butters and co. for doing it. Basically, we were battling to get crowds so we locked in a fixed deal. We received x amount regardless of what the crowd was. This was clever at the time - but obviously once we started selling the joint out a few years later, we were missing out on the extra revenue.

Still, in the financial predicament we were in when the deal was signed, conservative decisions were warranted.

But anyway, whilst in the middle of this 'successful' period we sacked a coach then missed the finals the following year. And, we were maligned (rightly so) for being dead boring to watch. So when we came good in 2009, it's fair to say that the club didn't have any on-field momentum to speak of, to really rally the fans.

We obviously burst on to the scene in a way that was not expected by anyone in 09, but then by 11 our decade of 'success' was finished.


So on paper, we had a decade of success and didn't capitalise on it - but in reality it wasn't as clear cut as that.

[onlooker2]

The footy first ticket did some really good stuff however, they introduced a vast increase in spending on training, sports technology, etc, the Seaford facilities are excellent certainly compared to Moorabin. I am sure that the growth of Seaford, etc will occur over the years albeit at a slower rate and I am sure we will be fine.(quote)

Understand the logic Wolfpup but I don't think the Club has got this time up its sleeve. This issue has an urgency about it. Seaford is a non winner for the Club and should do something about relocating sooner all of which have been discussed before. Somewhere more central and with easier access and better commercial opportunities eg Linton St, Fitzroy St, Port Melb and some spoke about Elsternwick Park.

[thejiggingsaint]

An interesting article I thought, and not much there that I could (honestly) complain about. Personally, I LOVE to see us playing at Docklands (a matter of personal taste I guess) As far as the Seaford move is concerned, my view is that we have what appears to be a first class training facility, compared with Moorabbin. The negotiations with Kingston Council were a shambles in the end, but at THIS moment we have what we have and need to embrace it and maximise every positive factor it can bring to us. The priority (for mine) is to rebuild the team and the administration in tandem. Call me an optimist, but I do feel that there's been a distinct shift toward us moving up. Much of the credit for this (IMHO) has to be with an ex-Hawthorn employee; Chris Pelchen. With this new coach, we stand on the brink of recovery from all the "gloom and doom" predicted for us.

GO SAINTS! (to hell with the rest)

[wolfpup]

The footy first ticket did some really good stuff however, they introduced a vast increase in spending on training, sports technology, etc, the Seaford facilities are excellent certainly compared to Moorabin. I am sure that the growth of Seaford, etc will occur over the years albeit at a slower rate and I am sure we will be fine.(quote)

Understand the logic Wolfpup but I don't think the Club has got this time up its sleeve. This issue has an urgency about it. Seaford is a non winner for the Club and should do something about relocating sooner all of which have been discussed before. Somewhere more central and with easier access and better commercial opportunities eg Linton St, Fitzroy St, Port Melb and some spoke about Elsternwick Park.

I agree with you, |I wish we chose port melbourne, but we have to live with what we have got(for now i guess), if we had have moved to port we would have been surrounded by 20-30K new people and an entire new market for us (once the development is completed).

[Austinnn]

BUMP! Have a read of the article again, and realise all things are transient, and with the right decisions and some luck, anything is possible.

Let's just take our medicine, lick our wounds and focus on making those good decisions.

[saintbrat]

In regards to Hawks and waverley I'm pretty sure its not as simple az paying $1, there is a property developer involved so where , hence townhouses on the ovals edge

[thejiggingsaint]

Austinn you make too much sense for this place I'm with you 100% time to put past (perceived) mistakes where they belong: in the dustbin of history! No need to ignore the LESSONS however! For Goodness sakes lets look FORWARD, just for once!