Billings v Bont

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Re: Billings v Bont

Post: # 1651083Post Sainternist »

Billings could be due for a breakout season. Would be great to see the critics silenced. Don't really care about Bontempelli's progress. It's a bonus for the game if he's exciting to watch, but to dwell over that we didn't pick him up in the draft is futile. You may as well spend time being tied up down in a dungeon, getting whipped by a madame!


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BigMart
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Re: Billings v Bont

Post: # 1651092Post BigMart »

Bont is not in the same league as Priddis and Mitchell

Or Jack Steven for that matter

There is 11 b&f awards in those 3 and basically 30ppg every game
Bont would be lucky to hit 25 in many games

Whatever the position... he just ain't as consistently dominant.

He is good for his age, will get better

But they (and others I mentioned) are proven jets over a long period

Hannebery is easily better at this stage


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Re: Billings v Bont

Post: # 1651094Post Myron Gaines »

Bont is lightyears ahead of Billings. Bont impacts games at big moments & showed it on the big stage in last years finals series. He is everything we want Billings to become. It's a big year for Jack, he needs to step up.


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Re: Billings v Bont

Post: # 1651095Post Spinner »

BigMart wrote:Bont is not in the same league as Priddis and Mitchell

Or Jack Steven for that matter

There is 11 b&f awards in those 3 and basically 30ppg every game
Bont would be lucky to hit 25 in many games

Whatever the position... he just ain't as consistently dominant.

He is good for his age, will get better

But they (and others I mentioned) are proven jets over a long period

Hannebery is easily better at this stage

Great.

Did you mind subjectively rating all other 700 odd players in the game?

Until then and probably for sometime after, I'll take any objective rating there is.


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Re: Billings v Bont

Post: # 1651096Post BigMart »

Of course he's ahead of Billings

Billings has had 3 injury interrupted years, is not as big and probably not as good.

Billings two best quarters in AFL do indicate his ability though

His first quarter vs WC at Etihad
His last quarter vs WB at Etihad

And he dominated in another game this year, against Hawthorn maybe?

He will go another level at least in 17


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Re: Billings v Bont

Post: # 1651114Post mightysainters »

Myron Gaines wrote:Bont is lightyears ahead of Billings. Bont impacts games at big moments & showed it on the big stage in last years finals series. He is everything we want Billings to become. It's a big year for Jack, he needs to step up.
This... Bont will be one of the best players in the league much like he was in the second half of last season.

Billings contested to uncontested ratio last year was terrible. Needs to win his own ball and use those sublime skills


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Re: Billings v Bont

Post: # 1651124Post Bluthy »

http://www.saints.com.au/video/2017-02- ... lings-1702

Played a kick off the ball sitting in space a lot in this game. Has that footy intelligence to know where the most dangerous spot to be is and the way the play will break. But won't get that much space in the real stuff. I reckon he'll be given licence to roam a fair bit where he feels he can be most dangerous and get into the game. If they are shutting him down on the fwd/wing then he can drift back to help launch us from the back and get involved. He's a player we need it in his hands as much as possible.


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Re: Billings v Bont

Post: # 1651126Post stkfc1 »

Bluthy wrote:http://www.saints.com.au/video/2017-02- ... lings-1702

Played a kick off the ball sitting in space a lot in this game. Has that footy intelligence to know where the most dangerous spot to be is and the way the play will break. But won't get that much space in the real stuff. I reckon he'll be given licence to roam a fair bit where he feels he can be most dangerous and get into the game. If they are shutting him down on the fwd/wing then he can drift back to help launch us from the back and get involved. He's a player we need it in his hands as much as possible.
And thats exactly what we need. At the moment oppostion coaches first prioirty would be Operation: Shut down Jack Steven (which is a very effective game plan agianst us.). We need players like Billings and Gresham to be giving them headaches on who to go to, as you cant tag them all and Steven can get off the leash a bit. Our forwards will be a massive headache for opp coaches this season. Time for our midfleld to do the same.


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Re: Billings v Bont

Post: # 1651203Post supersaints »

Moods wrote:
supersaints wrote:
Moods wrote:
dragit wrote:Some solid points made… and you guys must be right as he is ranked the 5th best midfielder in the comp by champion data which is extraordinary for a player that averages around 24 touches per match and isn't in the top 50 for most standard midfield stats.

What I have noticed is that when he does something normal on the field - like a normal handpass or tackle, the corresponding commentary is befitting of someone who has just raised the dead or parted a large body of water… cyril-rioli-esque.
I reckon you're referring to the Semi final against the Hawks where he was very good, but possibly some commentators went over the top - understandable considering it was a big Melbourne final, doggies won unexpectedly and a 19 year old kid played well. I actually think that his game is underrated though. I'm one of the few people who had him in the best 3 players on the ground in the GF. I had Josh Kennedy and Picken only in front of him. I actually think people expect too much from him and things like that kick to Boyd in the goal square is just considered part and parcel of his game. He's not electric quick like Judd was (who was a similar height) and he doesn't smash heads so I think he goes a bit unnoticed. I'm not a huge wrap for mids who accumulate 30+ possessions every week Dane Swan style. Chris Judd didn't often get over 30, even at his peak. Quality mids are often tagged so the quality of their possessions becomes ultra important. I'm a big fan of Jack Steven but not as big as some. I would like him to become more consistent with the ball in hand. He breaks lines and is very capable of hitting fwds on the chest, but he can also can spray the ball. To become an elite mid in the comp I reckon that's the one area of his game he needs to improve by about 10% and he will be there.


So you don't like???
Neal
Dangerfield
Martin
Treloar
Hannabery
Kennedy

What's not to like??? Very strange opinion
Yeah - all great players, but I rate Bont ahead of all but 2 of them - Danger and Kennedy
Still don't understand why you don't rate someone because they average over thirty possessions a game ?, the list is the players who averaged over 30 last season.. what don't you like about it/ them?

I would bet Jack Stevens will get close to a 30 average this year , does that mean you would like him better if he averaged less possesions... your statement still makes no sense whatsoever to me ? I'm struggling to understand why you don't rate players because get more than 30?l possessions??

I'm not saying the most possessions are what's the most important stat, but I don't see how anyone could rate players lower because they get more possessions??


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Re: Billings v Bont

Post: # 1651251Post Moods »

supersaints wrote:
Moods wrote:
supersaints wrote:
Moods wrote:
dragit wrote:Some solid points made… and you guys must be right as he is ranked the 5th best midfielder in the comp by champion data which is extraordinary for a player that averages around 24 touches per match and isn't in the top 50 for most standard midfield stats.

What I have noticed is that when he does something normal on the field - like a normal handpass or tackle, the corresponding commentary is befitting of someone who has just raised the dead or parted a large body of water… cyril-rioli-esque.
I reckon you're referring to the Semi final against the Hawks where he was very good, but possibly some commentators went over the top - understandable considering it was a big Melbourne final, doggies won unexpectedly and a 19 year old kid played well. I actually think that his game is underrated though. I'm one of the few people who had him in the best 3 players on the ground in the GF. I had Josh Kennedy and Picken only in front of him. I actually think people expect too much from him and things like that kick to Boyd in the goal square is just considered part and parcel of his game. He's not electric quick like Judd was (who was a similar height) and he doesn't smash heads so I think he goes a bit unnoticed. I'm not a huge wrap for mids who accumulate 30+ possessions every week Dane Swan style. Chris Judd didn't often get over 30, even at his peak. Quality mids are often tagged so the quality of their possessions becomes ultra important. I'm a big fan of Jack Steven but not as big as some. I would like him to become more consistent with the ball in hand. He breaks lines and is very capable of hitting fwds on the chest, but he can also can spray the ball. To become an elite mid in the comp I reckon that's the one area of his game he needs to improve by about 10% and he will be there.


So you don't like???
Neal
Dangerfield
Martin
Treloar
Hannabery
Kennedy

What's not to like??? Very strange opinion
Yeah - all great players, but I rate Bont ahead of all but 2 of them - Danger and Kennedy
Still don't understand why you don't rate someone because they average over thirty possessions a game ?, the list is the players who averaged over 30 last season.. what don't you like about it/ them?

I would bet Jack Stevens will get close to a 30 average this year , does that mean you would like him better if he averaged less possesions... your statement still makes no sense whatsoever to me ? I'm struggling to understand why you don't rate players because get more than 30?l possessions??

I'm not saying the most possessions are what's the most important stat, but I don't see how anyone could rate players lower because they get more possessions??
Read what I said carefully Supersaints - never said I didn't rate players because they got high possessions. I said I wasn't a fan of them accumulating high possessions - DANE SWAN STYLE. In other words give and go and chip kicks around the backline. What I'm trying to say is just because a player gets high possessions every week doesn't make them the best. There are other attributes I rate higher. Winning plenty of the ball is obviously VERY important for a mid so it would be stupid to say that I rate them lower because they get high stats. I rate Gary Ablett and Robert Harvey as the best 2 mids I have seen (with Chris Judd). Both got enormous stats. A gun mid needs to be able to win inside ball, have great hands, break lines and be a very accurate kick. He must also have a fantastic tank to get away from the inevitable tagger. As a rule he needs to be fast and strong as an ox. All players mentioned are terrific footballers and I'm certainly not denigrating any of them. Dane Swan, at his best, was in the top category as he broke lines and set up play continuously. He wasn't at his best for the last 3-4 years though despite still winning high stats. Jack Steven has great speed, but personally I reckon the one thing holding him back from being elite is his consistency with kicking. His handpassing and his inside strength are only average as well. That's very harsh I know but we're talking about the best of the best


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Re: Billings v Bont

Post: # 1651258Post BigMart »

I rate players who win a lot of footy

Because ball winning itself is a skill, perhaps the most relevant

If you have the footy... the opposition have not

Harvey was an accumulator - 2 Brownlows
Swan - Brownlow
Priddis - Brownlow
Mitchell - Brownlow

Isn't accumulating the footy, a different way of saying winning the footy... a mids job
If you're not winning it, it's going the other way and I50

Kennedy, Parker, Hannebery - Stars
Ball winners


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Re: Billings v Bont

Post: # 1651260Post supersaints »

Thank you for your explanation.. Moods . I get what you are saying, tho I'm in the group that thinks the Bont is overrated at present, but he clearly had the potential to be the best.
I think that it's BT who creates the hype.. just like he did with the package... I recall being howled down when I suggested that Members was the new Jake Stringer.. Members stats are better than Stringers on games played... and Members has a great attitude it all went to Stringers big head and he ended up getting dropped.
I'm not sure what the Bonts personality is like ...but I've read enough on here to suggest Billings character is up with the best, he has the ability to be supreme elite.. this season should show JB in a better light ...it's his first uninterrupted pre season


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