Trout gone end of Year

[WellardSaint]

Roo was frustrated with the passes over his head and at his ankles 3/4 times a game, that is why he should have kicked at least 100 more goals in his career and maybe got a flag. I wont support AFL players who cant kick 30-40 metres with reasonable accuracy, one of the current mobs biggest issues and directly related to recruiting bar Goddard and Montagna and a couple of others over the years.

i look back at games from the 90's, and grounds looked worse than Etihad,
but our skiils are worse now than back then.
The grass was wet, muddy etc, but guys could kick better than some of ours now.
Roo and other forwards are getting poor delivery.
And these are professionals.

After reading this and some of your other posts, it just occurred to me that you probably have a mental disability (IQ between 26 - 70).

I'm not laughing at you but feeble minded people like you shouldn't reproduce.

I just thanked you for the post, because you certainly need the kudos.
Also, I have been puzzled since my teens about the origin of my weaknesses.
You have saved me from paying a lot of money to psychologists-
so it's a huge relief to have the support of a fellow sufferer,
a "brother-in-arms" as it were.
A kindred spirit, one who is treading the same path as myself,
one who can guide me through the obstacles on the way to enlightenment.

we should catch up for a beer, unless your medication prohibits the consumption of alcohol.
I will just buy you a cordial for your sippee cup

[parkeysainter]

19-8 and the gap is widening.

[chico2001]

Linton, well put together. Only problem is that we have won 1.5 games this year and that blows the thinking of top recruiting right out the window and that's a fact. That stat means more than any other data on the planet. It cannot be disputed. It has been said 100 times on various threads that some of the top recruits have not shone this year there have been a lot who have supported them as well and thats fair . Why wont someone put a pass mark on the saints for this year? should be easy for keyboard warriors such as us.
saintpav ...you reckon posters are feebleminded , give us the advantage of your 135+ IQ and tell us where we will finish on the ladder this year, how many games will we win with these very good players we have?

[takeaway]

Linton, well put together. Only problem is that we have won 1.5 games this year and that blows the thinking of top recruiting right out the window and that's a fact. That stat means more than any other data on the planet. It cannot be disputed. It has been said 100 times on various threads that some of the top recruits have not shone this year there have been a lot who have supported them as well and thats fair . Why wont someone put a pass mark on the saints for this year? should be easy for keyboard warriors such as us.
saintpav ...you reckon posters are feebleminded , give us the advantage of your 135+ IQ and tell us where we will finish on the ladder this year, how many games will we win with these very good players we have?

You have stated "and that's a fact" in a number of posts, and in all of them you should be saying "and that's my opinion", because they are certainly not facts.
Drafting from 2013 onwards is still very much a work in progress, with all players drafted still learning the caper, and we really don't know how they will turn out for another few years.

One of the main reasons for the current ladder position is the lack of senior players from the 2005-10 drafts/trades, and we also lost an important 2 from earlier drafts last year, 3 incl Dempster. Those drafts were not the responsibility of the current recruiting team. Current team not perfect, but I think Linton L has summed it up well.
We have certainly improved over the former regime.

Pass mark for the Saints this year would be a No. 3 pick, let the recruiting team add some more cream.

[SaintPav]

Roo was frustrated with the passes over his head and at his ankles 3/4 times a game, that is why he should have kicked at least 100 more goals in his career and maybe got a flag. I wont support AFL players who cant kick 30-40 metres with reasonable accuracy, one of the current mobs biggest issues and directly related to recruiting bar Goddard and Montagna and a couple of others over the years.

i look back at games from the 90's, and grounds looked worse than Etihad,
but our skiils are worse now than back then.
The grass was wet, muddy etc, but guys could kick better than some of ours now.
Roo and other forwards are getting poor delivery.
And these are professionals.

After reading this and some of your other posts, it just occurred to me that you probably have a mental disability (IQ between 26 - 70).

I'm not laughing at you but feeble minded people like you shouldn't reproduce.

I just thanked you for the post, because you certainly need the kudos.
Also, I have been puzzled since my teens about the origin of my weaknesses.
You have saved me from paying a lot of money to psychologists-
so it's a huge relief to have the support of a fellow sufferer,
a "brother-in-arms" as it were.
A kindred spirit, one who is treading the same path as myself,
one who can guide me through the obstacles on the way to enlightenment.

we should catch up for a beer, unless your medication prohibits the consumption of alcohol.
I will just buy you a cordial for your sippee cup

[chico2001]

1.5 games is a fact. What part of that dont you understand as fact? And your prediction of a pick no 3, thats laughable and a copout . Give us a win/loss scenario seeing that you are praising/supporting the current recruiting team and their selections...most of whom are playing this weekend and last week and most of the year. If you had read some of my posts properly you would have noticed I mentioned recruiting as part of the club not a stand alone group so it doesnt matter what name you throw up it is still a st kilda management problem.

[parkeysainter]

You seem very familiar chico2001...have you been on Saintsational before?

[SaintPav]

Linton, well put together. Only problem is that we have won 1.5 games this year and that blows the thinking of top recruiting right out the window and that's a fact. That stat means more than any other data on the planet. It cannot be disputed. It has been said 100 times on various threads that some of the top recruits have not shone this year there have been a lot who have supported them as well and thats fair . Why wont someone put a pass mark on the saints for this year? should be easy for keyboard warriors such as us.
saintpav ...you reckon posters are feebleminded , give us the advantage of your 135+ IQ and tell us where we will finish on the ladder this year, how many games will we win with these very good players we have?

No. I said one poster was feebleminded, which he is.

We’ll win a few more games if we’re lucky and we’ll finish third last.

Are we still having that beer?

[chico2001]

Third last is a fair summation of the season. I hope we get a few more wins but it is what it is. I will drink anytime and anywhere. I am a stella Artois man these days.


Parkey, I seem to recall I may have been on here eons ago under the nic of "half back frank"

[takeaway]

1.5 games is a fact. What part of that dont you understand as fact? And your prediction of a pick no 3, thats laughable and a copout . Give us a win/loss scenario seeing that you are praising/supporting the current recruiting team and their selections...most of whom are playing this weekend and last week and most of the year. If you had read some of my posts properly you would have noticed I mentioned recruiting as part of the club not a stand alone group so it doesnt matter what name you throw up it is still a st kilda management problem.

"Only problem is that we have won 1.5 games this year and that blows the thinking of top recruiting right out the window and that's a fact".

You need to read your own posts - the sentence you posted above is stating that the FACT is that the thinking of top recruiting is blown out the window. Which I said is not a fact but an opinion. I hope that simple english is not too difficult.
I guess you did not understand my post that was saying the draftees 2013-17 are still developing (most quite well now) and the dearth of senior players drafted before the current recruiting team started (prior to 2011?) is a major issue in our ladder position. I must admit I tend to scan through your posts as they are normally unjustified, negative statements with very little logic.

We may win a few more this year, but a top 3 draft pick may give us a better boost for 2019-20.

[Spinner]

Since the 2013 Billings, Dunstan and Acres draft, I think most of our picks have been decent to very good selections.
Legit question. Has Trout got it right overall then?

https://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/td- ... ?year=2013

If you go through those years from 2013 and look at each draft, only maybe 2014 was a cross at this point, but I still reckon those top 3 picks can be good players.

Maybe some have been a little harsh on Trout and co. Each to their own though I guess.

[Teflon]

Not sure Lyon was a mastermind or creative enough to come up with anything new in footy. I think the origins were initiated with Terry Wallace when he coached the Bulldogs with the flood against the Bombers in the late 90's and in 2000.

Not sure there have been any other coaches in modern AFL history apart from Roos who have won a flag with a defensive dour game plan

Lyon got most of his IP and ideas working under Paul Roos at the Swans. He believed in that defensive style so much he even recruited Brett Kirke as an assistant coach. If you want the blueprint for coming second, it's the best gameplan by a mile

Most in the football world (who don't have a psycophant hatred for the man like you) acknowledge Lyon took FULL PRESS and made it his own - different to just flooding which Eade and others utilised. Fact is Lyons model worked better than anyone else's at the time and Malthouse borrowed heavily from it a year later.

I don't mind people re writing history but not being able to give credit where it's due is just dumb
Riewoldt and many of the previous players have publicly stated Lyons is the best tactician they played under and that team that won 19-0 (GT couldn't count that high), played for him
Douche bag? He sure is
Was he a good coach at the time? Yep

[samoht]

I agree with Scollop (good post, by the way).
It's all a matter of opinion, Teflon. Fact is there's no facts - and the same coach that won 19-0 with us (when we were the best or second best team going around) lost the first 10 games in 2016 as coach of Freo with their huge home-ground advantage. What about this fact?? Great tactician? I think not.
I think he's underperforming given Freo's star-studded midfield (Fyfe, Mundy, Neale) and running players like Walters, Hill brothers, etc...
If St Kilda had those Freo players, we'd be a top 8 team (with AR as coach) - we'd have the midfield we need and the run and spread we need.

[takeaway]

Results wise Rose Lyon is our second best coach ever, behind Alan Jeans. Results are getting into finals and then Grand Finals. Unlucky to lose in 2009, and nearly pinched 2010, when we were not the best side in the comp, but the coach of the best side had used our game plan, with minor modifications.

[spert]

Results wise Rose Lyon is our second best coach ever, behind Alan Jeans. Results are getting into finals and then Grand Finals. Unlucky to lose in 2009, and nearly pinched 2010, when we were not the best side in the comp, but the coach of the best side had used our game plan, with minor modifications.

It helped that the other mob's star players played top games when the crunch came.

[Scollop]

I watched AFL 60 last night and they showed a clip of Rooy taking a dive from some minor contact from Bryan Lake in front of goal in the 3rd quarter of the 09 prelim. Our guys were smashing teams like The Bulldogs in home and away that year but we were lucky to get over the line when it came to the final against them. If it wasn't for some luck with that goal and another one in the dying seconds that Roo kicked off the ground we may never have made it into the granny.

We run out of gas before the finish line in finals because the driver forgot that even powerful motors and engines need a rest. He didn't utilise the whole list and he didn't plan for a make or break assualt at the finish line. That's not a great tactician in my mind. If you are a lap ahead (as we were in 09) and you continue to thrash your engine at 15-0 then 16-0 then 17-0...well what the f***? You are risking breaking down or running out of gas!! A coach's reputaion is built on finals. Lyon has an average record in finals.

[takeaway]

I watched AFL 60 last night and they showed a clip of Rooy taking a dive from some minor contact from Bryan Lake in front of goal in the 3rd quarter of the 09 prelim. Our guys were smashing teams like The Bulldogs in home and away that year but we were lucky to get over the line when it came to the final against them. If it wasn't for some luck with that goal and another one in the dying seconds that Roo kicked off the ground we may never have made it into the granny.

We run out of gas before the finish line in finals because the driver forgot that even powerful motors and engines need a rest. He didn't utilise the whole list and he didn't plan for a make or break assualt at the finish line. That's not a great tactician in my mind. If you are a lap ahead (as we were in 09) and you continue to thrash your engine at 15-0 then 16-0 then 17-0...well what the f***? You are risking breaking down or running out of gas!! A coach's reputaion is built on finals. Lyon has an average record in finals.

Luck always plays a part in finals. I would dispute we ran out of gas in 2009. Didn't we have a spell after 19-0? Eased off in the run to finals and lost the next 2? Not saying I liked the style that Roos & Lyon used, but Lyon was certainly effective.

[Scollop]

If you're going to take a pit stop, don't do it with the finishing line in sight. That's why any coach worth his salt would'nt have cared if we lost the McLelland trophy and would have risked losses for the sake of the big prize in September. He should have demaded to rest some of his key playmakers in rounds 16/17/18 and 19. Give them 2 weeks off and it didn't have to be all in the same games. Then....you build back momentum and perhaps even give some of the young guys on your list more opportunities to show whether they can add a different edge or some surprises to your team. The competition for spots and the doubt that it would have created in some of the players minds might have had them playing out of their skins in the finals.

We had a great team. We had great leaders. We were a strong club when Lyon arrived as we'd already played deep into September in 2004 and 2005 and were finalists in 2006. Yes he was good...but Lyon was like Andrew Mcqualter or Robert Eddy. He needed to play his role and help the team achieve it's full potential. He failed.

[chico2001]

I will back Teflons words here, he has kept the "hatred" thing out of it. Lyon is the saint's second best coach ever over 127 years and thats a FACT. Easy to say that he did this wrong or that wrong leading up to or in the finals and he probably did make tactical errors on occasion...I agree he didnt blood anyone in that year ..for sure. Look at something that no one has bought up and that is that Kosi, Milne and Rewoldt didnt bother the scoreboard attendant much in the big matches....A bag from any one of those three would have got us home. ....None of our star 3 forwards were injured or worn out.

[takeaway]

If you're going to take a pit stop, don't do it with the finishing line in sight. That's why any coach worth his salt would'nt have cared if we lost the McLelland trophy and would have risked losses for the sake of the big prize in September. He should have demaded to rest some of his key playmakers in rounds 16/17/18 and 19. Give them 2 weeks off and it didn't have to be all in the same games. Then....you build back momentum and perhaps even give some of the young guys on your list more opportunities to show whether they can add a different edge or some surprises to your team. The competition for spots and the doubt that it would have created in some of the players minds might have had them playing out of their skins in the finals.

We had a great team. We had great leaders. We were a strong club when Lyon arrived as we'd already played deep into September in 2004 and 2005 and were finalists in 2006. Yes he was good...but Lyon was like Andrew Mcqualter or Robert Eddy. He needed to play his role and help the team achieve it's full potential. He failed.

OK coach. You obviously know the way to win a GF. I certainly disagree with your strategy outlined in the first para. A lot would argue that the worst thing you could do would be to give players a couple of weeks off before the finals. Who knows either way? Certainly not us.

The saint's coach with the highest win/loss record for the club was like Mcqualter or Eddy? Play his role? Nuff said.

[saynta]

I watched AFL 60 last night and they showed a clip of Rooy taking a dive from some minor contact from Bryan Lake in front of goal in the 3rd quarter of the 09 prelim. Our guys were smashing teams like The Bulldogs in home and away that year but we were lucky to get over the line when it came to the final against them. If it wasn't for some luck with that goal and another one in the dying seconds that Roo kicked off the ground we may never have made it into the granny.

We run out of gas before the finish line in finals because the driver forgot that even powerful motors and engines need a rest. He didn't utilise the whole list and he didn't plan for a make or break assualt at the finish line. That's not a great tactician in my mind. If you are a lap ahead (as we were in 09) and you continue to thrash your engine at 15-0 then 16-0 then 17-0...well what the f***? You are risking breaking down or running out of gas!! A coach's reputaion is built on finals. Lyon has an average record in finals.

It wasn't minor contact. It was off the ball and unexpected. Lake was a thug and hit Roo hard. I was there, and saw it first hand.

Murphy was having a shot at Rooy and his response was good natured.

[saynta]

I will back Teflons words here, he has kept the "hatred" thing out of it. Lyon is the saint's second best coach ever over 127 years and thats a FACT. Easy to say that he did this wrong or that wrong leading up to or in the finals and he probably did make tactical errors on occasion...I agree he didnt blood anyone in that year ..for sure. Look at something that no one has bought up and that is that Kosi, Milne and Rewoldt didnt bother the scoreboard attendant much in the big matches....A bag from any one of those three would have got us home. ....None of our star 3 forwards were injured or worn out.

Yeah, he did wrong, made tactical errors and walked out of the club in circumstances that left a bad taste in everyone's mouth.

Good coach? Not for mine .He had the best list in the competition but failed to bring home the cups.

Also AFAIC, he sucks as a human being.

Nothing you say will change any of that.

[Scollop]

If you're going to take a pit stop, don't do it with the finishing line in sight. That's why any coach worth his salt would'nt have cared if we lost the McLelland trophy and would have risked losses for the sake of the big prize in September. He should have demaded to rest some of his key playmakers in rounds 16/17/18 and 19. Give them 2 weeks off and it didn't have to be all in the same games. Then....you build back momentum and perhaps even give some of the young guys on your list more opportunities to show whether they can add a different edge or some surprises to your team. The competition for spots and the doubt that it would have created in some of the players minds might have had them playing out of their skins in the finals.

We had a great team. We had great leaders. We were a strong club when Lyon arrived as we'd already played deep into September in 2004 and 2005 and were finalists in 2006. Yes he was good...but Lyon was like Andrew Mcqualter or Robert Eddy. He needed to play his role and help the team achieve it's full potential. He failed.

OK coach. You obviously know the way to win a GF. I certainly disagree with your strategy outlined in the first para. A lot would argue that the worst thing you could do would be to give players a couple of weeks off before the finals. Who knows either way? Certainly not us.

The saint's coach with the highest win/loss record for the club was like Mcqualter or Eddy? Play his role? Nuff said.

Can you read? Can you comprehend and retain more than 1-2 ideas? I know it's difficult if twitter is your go to for news and analysis but my first sentence said: "If you're going to take a pit stop, don't do it with the finishing line in sight."

[barneyboyz]

I watched AFL 60 last night and they showed a clip of Rooy taking a dive from some minor contact from Bryan Lake in front of goal in the 3rd quarter of the 09 prelim. Our guys were smashing teams like The Bulldogs in home and away that year but we were lucky to get over the line when it came to the final against them. If it wasn't for some luck with that goal and another one in the dying seconds that Roo kicked off the ground we may never have made it into the granny.

We run out of gas before the finish line in finals because the driver forgot that even powerful motors and engines need a rest. He didn't utilise the whole list and he didn't plan for a make or break assualt at the finish line. That's not a great tactician in my mind. If you are a lap ahead (as we were in 09) and you continue to thrash your engine at 15-0 then 16-0 then 17-0...well what the f***? You are risking breaking down or running out of gas!! A coach's reputaion is built on finals. Lyon has an average record in finals.

Was that the year we took a bunch of kids to Tassie to play Hawthorn? Might have tried to have that rest on this occasion and couldn't lose to save ourselves (ironic?) Anyhoo, history smacked the goalpost and bounced at 40 degrees, then a simple toe-poke put the icing on it the week after, pity.

Someone here mentioned the colours of our jumper recently??? I've been thinking for years that this is a big issue. They need an exorcism, cause for a team called the saints, we sure have to have buckets of 'faith'...but it's not working. Anyone know a priest?

[Scollop]

It's bad luck if you get 2nd once or twice but Lyon did it 4 times. There are reasons.

It's good luck if you win 1 grand final but Clarko did it 4 times. There are reasons.