Soft Saints?
Moderators: Saintsational Administrators, Saintsational Moderators
- rodgerfox
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 9059
- Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 9:10am
- Has thanked: 425 times
- Been thanked: 327 times
Soft Saints?
Intriguing insight by Riewoldt last night.
He was asked whether there would have been strong feedback and honesty sessions at the Saints after the s*** they've been serving up.
"Not strong enough" was his response.
Went on to say that basically they are nowhere near hard enough in their feedback. It frustrated him during his last couple of years.
So there it is. Pretty much your answer regarding 'development' and also mediocrity on-field. They're not pushing themselves, and they're not being pushed and challenged.
The question is ... is it Richo that is too soft? Or are the players too soft to cop blunt, honest feedback? Or both?
He was asked whether there would have been strong feedback and honesty sessions at the Saints after the s*** they've been serving up.
"Not strong enough" was his response.
Went on to say that basically they are nowhere near hard enough in their feedback. It frustrated him during his last couple of years.
So there it is. Pretty much your answer regarding 'development' and also mediocrity on-field. They're not pushing themselves, and they're not being pushed and challenged.
The question is ... is it Richo that is too soft? Or are the players too soft to cop blunt, honest feedback? Or both?
- bigred
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 11463
- Joined: Tue 09 Mar 2004 7:39am
- Has thanked: 25 times
- Been thanked: 609 times
Re: Soft Saints?
Did he really say that?
"Now the ball is loose, it gives St. Kilda a rough chance. Black. Good handpass. Voss. Schwarze now, the defender, can run and from a long way".....
- Cairnsman
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 7377
- Joined: Thu 16 Jun 2005 10:38pm
- Location: Everywhere
- Has thanked: 189 times
- Been thanked: 276 times
Re: Soft Saints?
Thier general look I have to agree appears soft, the first quarter against the Swans is your damming evidence. Bruse free I think they call it.
- rodgerfox
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 9059
- Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 9:10am
- Has thanked: 425 times
- Been thanked: 327 times
Re: Soft Saints?
When asked how brutal the review of last weekend’s heavy loss to Sydney would have been, Riewoldt gave an honest view of what would have happened internally.
“It wouldn’t be very brutal at all in my opinion,” he told Fox Footy.
“I’ve got a different view on what brutal looks like compared to the current group and that was probably something that really frustrated me over my last few years at the club.”
“It wouldn’t be very brutal at all in my opinion,” he told Fox Footy.
“I’ve got a different view on what brutal looks like compared to the current group and that was probably something that really frustrated me over my last few years at the club.”
- rodgerfox
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 9059
- Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 9:10am
- Has thanked: 425 times
- Been thanked: 327 times
Re: Soft Saints?
Successful footy teams find that perfect timing of having strong leaders who accept being challenged, and coaches that challenge them.
A coach that challenges players, when the players don't want it - will fail.
Players that want to be challenged but aren't by their coach will face careers of mediocrity.
A team with neither is f***ed.
The question is, what do we have?
A coach that challenges players, when the players don't want it - will fail.
Players that want to be challenged but aren't by their coach will face careers of mediocrity.
A team with neither is f***ed.
The question is, what do we have?
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 9373
- Joined: Wed 03 Aug 2005 10:01pm
- Has thanked: 662 times
- Been thanked: 498 times
Re: Soft Saints?
The answer to THAT question is provided each week on the paddock, Colleague.rodgerfox wrote: ↑Fri 15 Jun 2018 10:41am Successful footy teams find that perfect timing of having strong leaders who accept being challenged, and coaches that challenge them.
A coach that challenges players, when the players don't want it - will fail.
Players that want to be challenged but aren't by their coach will face careers of mediocrity.
A team with neither is f***ed.
The question is, what do we have?
St Kilda forever ( God help me)
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 4981
- Joined: Tue 13 Jun 2017 1:16pm
- Has thanked: 1431 times
- Been thanked: 1465 times
Re: Soft Saints?
An intriguing thing for me in a masochistic aside is how long can this soft rubbish continue. So in the absence of anything other than observed behaviour and Nick's observations its a generally poor culture controlled by mutually dependent people that lack the capacity for needed change and/or there is internal political bastardry at play. Nobody seems to be accountable for the side being currently the worse performing club, which is a rare achievement given how bad a few other clubs are. Whatever AR's role and responsibilities are and those of the various coaches and directors (incl. Board), going four months without a win is apparently not reason to conclude that pretty much the same players and officials in the same positions going through the same motions is going to produce the same results. That assumes the club would like to win some games. Once a franchise loses for say six months can the AFL send in administrators (no not Matt and Simon, real change agents)? As much as the other clubs would enjoy the Saints ineptitude for a while wouldn't it get boring to the point of overall brand damage that needs to fixed. Is the organisational structure so convoluted that no one can demand improvement, the ongoing allusion to review(s) makes review sound like a euphemism for don't do anything just yet. Its a fascinating case study in organisational failure don't you think. So Soft Saints for how long? Players would be taking the lead from the environment set by the managers and coaches but are probably starting to wonder how long their cosy no harsh words gig is going to last because they must see it is well beyond a joke.
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 882
- Joined: Tue 04 Oct 2011 10:58pm
- Location: qld
- Has thanked: 17 times
- Been thanked: 48 times
- Enrico_Misso
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 11662
- Joined: Tue 13 Jun 2006 12:11am
- Location: Moorabbin Chapter of The Royal Society of Hagiographers
- Has thanked: 315 times
- Been thanked: 720 times
Re: Soft Saints?
What sort of honest brutal feedback does Richo give to Mav Weller?
The rest of Australia can wander mask-free, socialise, eat out, no curfews, no zoning, no police rings of steel, no illogical inconsistent rules.
They can even WATCH LIVE FOOTY!
They can even WATCH LIVE FOOTY!
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 91
- Joined: Fri 09 May 2014 11:41pm
- Has thanked: 4 times
- Been thanked: 25 times
Re: Soft Saints?
First of all congratulations to BackfromUSA with getting this board back on track. The new software is great.
I detested posting on that other website forum.... a weird mix of propaganda, bullies, negativity and over the top advertising.
Is this a false dawn or is change finally coming to our Saints?
I detested posting on that other website forum.... a weird mix of propaganda, bullies, negativity and over the top advertising.
Is this a false dawn or is change finally coming to our Saints?
- MC Gusto
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 6078
- Joined: Tue 09 Mar 2004 8:29am
- Has thanked: 2 times
- Been thanked: 372 times
Re: Soft Saints?
To y74 brought this to the table a while back
Essentially the players like Richo....and I think some are confusing that like with the players ‘playing’ for Richo
Tony essentially said there is too much ‘mr nice guy’ and not enough c-unt
This is a big problem. I think under our ‘modern business management’ regime we’ve lost the concept of the importance of authority and in some instances a bit of mongrel and fear. We have to tread on eggshells around our precious generation Z players. It’s bulls***!!
Let me tell you the people at the top of most orgs eg the big CEOs are still feared today and that is a big part of how they got to where they are
Essentially the players like Richo....and I think some are confusing that like with the players ‘playing’ for Richo
Tony essentially said there is too much ‘mr nice guy’ and not enough c-unt
This is a big problem. I think under our ‘modern business management’ regime we’ve lost the concept of the importance of authority and in some instances a bit of mongrel and fear. We have to tread on eggshells around our precious generation Z players. It’s bulls***!!
Let me tell you the people at the top of most orgs eg the big CEOs are still feared today and that is a big part of how they got to where they are
#1 Ryder fan
- Con Gorozidis
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 23532
- Joined: Thu 19 Jun 2008 4:04pm
- Has thanked: 100 times
- Been thanked: 78 times
Re: Soft Saints?
'Looking buff bro'.Enrico_Misso wrote: ↑Fri 15 Jun 2018 10:56am What sort of honest brutal feedback does Richo give to Mav Weller?
Followed by a gentle but meaningful tap on the bottocks.
Last edited by Con Gorozidis on Fri 15 Jun 2018 11:48am, edited 1 time in total.
- Con Gorozidis
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 23532
- Joined: Thu 19 Jun 2008 4:04pm
- Has thanked: 100 times
- Been thanked: 78 times
Re: Soft Saints?
Spot on.MC Gusto wrote: ↑Fri 15 Jun 2018 11:29am To y74 brought this to the table a while back
Essentially the players like Richo....and I think some are confusing that like with the players ‘playing’ for Richo
Tony essentially said there is too much ‘mr nice guy’ and not enough c-unt
This is a big problem. I think under our ‘modern business management’ regime we’ve lost the concept of the importance of authority and in some instances a bit of mongrel and fear. We have to tread on eggshells around our precious generation Z players. It’s bulls***!!
Let me tell you the people at the top of most orgs eg the big CEOs are still feared today and that is a big part of how they got to where they are
The players like Richo..
They probably like the tea lady as well.
Same kind of 'like'.
- rodgerfox
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 9059
- Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 9:10am
- Has thanked: 425 times
- Been thanked: 327 times
Re: Soft Saints?
No it's not.thejiggingsaint wrote: ↑Fri 15 Jun 2018 10:48amThe answer to THAT question is provided each week on the paddock, Colleague.rodgerfox wrote: ↑Fri 15 Jun 2018 10:41am Successful footy teams find that perfect timing of having strong leaders who accept being challenged, and coaches that challenge them.
A coach that challenges players, when the players don't want it - will fail.
Players that want to be challenged but aren't by their coach will face careers of mediocrity.
A team with neither is f***ed.
The question is, what do we have?
The sympton is - but the cause remains unknown. To us, anyway.
Is it a weak coach? Is it mentally fragile players? It it both?
- rodgerfox
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 9059
- Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 9:10am
- Has thanked: 425 times
- Been thanked: 327 times
Re: Soft Saints?
Not really. I'd replace feared with respected.
The rule with fear approach started dying out when Gen Y arrived on the scene.
And that takes me back to the original post - is it a coaching issue in that the players are not being pushed? And that doesn't mean abused - that s*** doesn't work anymore, it means blunt, honest and respectful feedback with the right intention.
Or are the player not prepared to be challenged by the Coach? Are they too precious? Or is it both?
- WellardSaint
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 8326
- Joined: Sat 26 May 2012 11:25am
- Location: Perth- the best weather in Oz, but the worst rednecks.
- Has thanked: 1889 times
- Been thanked: 878 times
Re: Soft Saints?
Reiwoldt pushed himself harder than any other player in the league, for years.
He set the tone, the standard, and demanded others
try to reach some level of excellence.
A true champion.
Remember Maddie's Match last year?
I reckon he pushed all the right buttons in that one.
He gets MY vote.
A real Sainter will pledge allegiance to the ❤ and despise the Pies, the Blues, and the Injectors.
Remember one of the 10 Commandments : Thou shalt have no other team before thee
Remember one of the 10 Commandments : Thou shalt have no other team before thee
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 635
- Joined: Sat 20 Apr 2013 10:51pm
- Has thanked: 28 times
- Been thanked: 125 times
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 6656
- Joined: Tue 09 Mar 2004 12:24pm
- Location: Hotel Bastardos
- Has thanked: 198 times
- Been thanked: 166 times
- Contact:
Re: Soft Saints?
Pat the tail, kick the dog.
*Allegedly.
Bring back Lucky Burgers, and nobody gets hurt.
You can't un-fry things.
Last Post
Bring back Lucky Burgers, and nobody gets hurt.
You can't un-fry things.
Last Post
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 10598
- Joined: Tue 14 Jun 2005 7:04pm
- Location: North
- Has thanked: 1011 times
- Been thanked: 1055 times
Re: Soft Saints?
I don’t understand the debate about where responsibility lies. It is clearly, fairly and squarely at the door of Richardson. He is the senior coach, the leader of the club with regards to their on-field performance and responsible for the culture of the team. From our on-field performances and from feedback I have from people who worked with him at the Saints, he doesn’t have integrity to stand firm in the fire of tough decisions. The players can see that and whether they like him as a person or not, they know he’s not a warrior leader, a leader to trust when it gets tough. We will go nowhere whilst he remains at the helm, unless he finds it within himself to grow a pair.rodgerfox wrote: ↑Fri 15 Jun 2018 12:14pmNo it's not.thejiggingsaint wrote: ↑Fri 15 Jun 2018 10:48amThe answer to THAT question is provided each week on the paddock, Colleague.rodgerfox wrote: ↑Fri 15 Jun 2018 10:41am Successful footy teams find that perfect timing of having strong leaders who accept being challenged, and coaches that challenge them.
A coach that challenges players, when the players don't want it - will fail.
Players that want to be challenged but aren't by their coach will face careers of mediocrity.
A team with neither is f***ed.
The question is, what do we have?
The sympton is - but the cause remains unknown. To us, anyway.
Is it a weak coach? Is it mentally fragile players? It it both?
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 23068
- Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 3:53pm
- Has thanked: 9001 times
- Been thanked: 3913 times
- Con Gorozidis
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 23532
- Joined: Thu 19 Jun 2008 4:04pm
- Has thanked: 100 times
- Been thanked: 78 times
Re: Soft Saints?
Do people really need Nick to point this out for them to acknowledge it. It is plain obvious.
Do some peole even watch our games?
Do they watch the good sides play for comparison?
Chalk and cheese.
Do some peole even watch our games?
Do they watch the good sides play for comparison?
Chalk and cheese.
-
- Saintsational Legend
- Posts: 23068
- Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 3:53pm
- Has thanked: 9001 times
- Been thanked: 3913 times
-
- Club Player
- Posts: 1392
- Joined: Wed 10 Mar 2004 5:15pm
- Location: Melbourne
- Has thanked: 29 times
- Been thanked: 27 times
Re: Soft Saints?
It hold more weight coming from someone who not only played under the current regime, but absolutely bled for the red white and black.Con Gorozidis wrote: ↑Fri 15 Jun 2018 3:31pm Do people really need Nick to point this out for them to acknowledge it. It is plain obvious.
Do some peole even watch our games?
Do they watch the good sides play for comparison?
Chalk and cheese.