Our Coach......

[The Fireman]

Just watch the post match presser... sad.
He looks a beaten man with little or no ability to explain why we are so terrible.
fumbling for excuses and coming up with the same old chestnuts...we cant play out the 4 qrts , not hard enough at the ball blah blah blah... well heres a news flash for you mate...your the bloke that has to get those things right.

I have lost faith in him and I think the players have as well

we cant come back from that loss, it highlighted some of our glaring lack of personal...Lonie, Dunstan , Billings etc.

Cue must go in the rack and seriously look at the coaching staff.

Another wasted year This is not a knee jerk reaction , I think we all saw this coming

Membership will take a hit. Sad times.

[Scollop]

All is not lost. We can do a reset...

He has been far too forgiving for his first 18 months at St Kilda

The coach needs to stop being soft and just be brutal. Get angry with his players!!

They are making him look like a d**khead.

He's come back from far worse (in his personal life) than a few losses in professional sport

And here is what needs to happen... He played in an era of coaches who ranted and shouted at the top of their lungs!!

He doesn't need to do that, but he needs to take on the mentality of an old fashioned coach.

Forget about their name or their reputation or their salary. You stuff up and you are benched. Full stop!!

Doesn't matter how many games you've played or how old you are. Come off and get a tongue lashing (and if you break team rules you're sent straight to the VFL).

It starts with every player lifting their work rate on the training track. Toughen them up and demand more

[The Peanut]

Being outcoached appeared to be the difference in the end. We were much better prepared for the conditions to begin with, but we were facing a team with master coach who is capable of seeing the big picture. I know I am an old man, but I thought we should had have gone into a less frenzied and cool headed keeping's-off mode during the last quarter and force them to make more mistakes when things looked grim and our players were stuffed, but no, we just kept bombing the ball to nowhere land. Our style of game is always going to be a worry for four quarters. One of the few things I got out of the game was Maxy looking a bit more confident in himself.

[Scollop]

Being outcoached appeared to be the difference in the end. We were much better prepared for the conditions to begin with, but we were facing a team with master coach who is capable of seeing the big picture. I know I am an old man, but I thought we should had have gone into a less frenzied and cool headed keeping's-off mode during the last quarter and force them to make more mistakes when things looked grim and our players were stuffed, but no, we just kept bombing the ball to nowhere land. Our style of game is always going to be a worry for four quarters. One of the few things I got out of the game was Maxy looking a bit more confident in himself.

That's your personal interpretation. They were schooled well!! We started with a bang. I don't think he was outcoached.

If you have a team that has a five goal lead early in the 3rd, he's done his job.

Maybe we have too many individuals and too many selfish players who aren't willing to dig deep. Maybe we have too many passengers each week.

[freely]

Unfortunately the decision to accept mediocrity was made the minute we appointed ratten to the job.

[Scollop]

Unfortunately the decision to accept mediocrity was made the minute we appointed ratten to the job.

Again. That's just your personal opinion

[cwrcyn]

Simple. We are not fit enough to run out games. Couple that with 8 or 9 of our best 22 unavailable and it's hard to grind out a win. The coaching looked great when we had the run in our legs, didn't it? Losing Clark didn't help. Bytel would have had as much impact on the game if he had stayed in his tracksuit. W got absolutely nothing from him when he came onto the ground. Our mismanage pre-season and our injury list is killing us

[Scollop]

Simple. We are not fit enough to run out games. Couple that with 8 or 9 of our best 22 unavailable and it's hard to grind out a win. The coaching looked great when we had the run in our legs, didn't it? Losing Clark didn't help. Bytel would have had as much impact on the game if he had stayed in his tracksuit. W got absolutely nothing from him when he came onto the ground. Our mismanage pre-season and our injury list is killing us

Agreed. You don't need all of Bytel, Crouch, and Dunny in the same team.

We normally have Crouch, Steele, and Seb Ross which is also too many of the same type.

I hope our recruiting of Crouch is the last inside mid we target for quite a while

[flack]

Sadly, everything that needs to be fixed is in the coaches hands. Match fitness, team discipline, Plan A and Plan B, team first mentality. Last night the Head coach was busily looking at a computer screen while the disaster was unfolding on the paddock. He needs to be accountable, not look for excuses in everybody else's area. Usually assistants look at the computers and feed data to the head coach who is keeping track of what is happening on the field so he can make adjustments. Last night the other coach did that and reaped the rewards.

[The Peanut]

Being outcoached appeared to be the difference in the end. We were much better prepared for the conditions to begin with, but we were facing a team with master coach who is capable of seeing the big picture. I know I am an old man, but I thought we should had have gone into a less frenzied and cool headed keeping's-off mode during the last quarter and force them to make more mistakes when things looked grim and our players were stuffed, but no, we just kept bombing the ball to nowhere land. Our style of game is always going to be a worry for four quarters. One of the few things I got out of the game was Maxy looking a bit more confident in himself.

That's your personal interpretation. They were schooled well!! We started with a bang. I don't think he was outcoached.

If you have a team that has a five goal lead early in the 3rd, he's done his job.

Maybe we have too many individuals and too many selfish players who aren't willing to dig deep. Maybe we have too many passengers each week.

...and that is your personal interpretation!

[Banger9798]

He looks exasperated
There is a systemic lack of belief in the side
What he got happening last year has collapsed this year

Very tough caper

But he should get another year IMO

The players need to be accountable for their effort ...how do you go from 36-0 and lose....that is criminal.....no side will believe they are out of the contest against us now for years...

[seano1]

Yes we have injuries yes so do other teams . Our fitness looks terrible , we have no sheer desire to win the ball when it counts.
Forwards should be dragged after failing to kick a simple straight shot at goals by using the checkside method when a drop punt would have done ffs it’s worked for a lot of passed great forwards.
A fullback kicking out should be told to mix it up a bit , stop kicking it to the same crowded wing when we need to score , our fastest player should be trusted to every now and again break away from the crowded wing and head to the vacant one .
Our forwards should be instructed to stop standing near each other and spread out and lead if not come and sit in the crowd there will be plenty of room if we keep this up

[spert]

Ratts looks and sounds like a defeated man- no ideas and clearly can't communicate what ideas he may have.

[The Fireman]

Let's see how the club reacts to this, this final outrage is surely a point in time where something needs to drastically happen.
This is where the Pres comes out and makes a statement to the members and supporter base with some sort of plan moving forward or at least an apology for the ineptitude right across the board.
This is the fork in the road moment and there is no way to gloss it over.
The supporters have had enough and will walk away in droves
and if they aren't having a crisis meeting as we speak...then.......sayonara

[older saint]

Not the coaching , tried different things - Coffiled as defensive forward- stopped Smith but took too much away from his game. Dunstan as a tagger has been solid while finding his own ball.

Hamstrung by injuries - 8 of best 22 out ( i don't include Hannebry in this as he doesn't play anymore).

Questions can be asked re Fitness base although ran over Sydney last week so makes no sense.
Questions regarding recruitment in the last few years- although Highmore, Higgins, Butler, Howard, Crouch have been wins IMO

Attitude of players and lack of guys to get tough against the tide. When the opposition gets a run on i see Steele, Howard , membrey and few others dig in. Too many downhill skiers.

[samoht]

Ratts is not good at developing players.

Coffield, Clark, Battle, Long, erc... have all stalled and/or have lost confidence and gone backwards.
Meanwhile Hind etc ... have taken their games to a new level, elsewhere.

And our kicking remains atrocious.

Looking past the coach:
We need to add midfield run and classy playmakers ... hopefully Ratts will at least get our recruiters 100% focussed on this.

[Moods]

Unfortunately the decision to accept mediocrity was made the minute we appointed ratten to the job.

Again. That's just your personal opinion

I think that’s a given. You don’t need to reiterate it every time someone disagrees with your own opinion.

Just my personal opinion

[saynta]

All is not lost. We can do a reset...

He has been far too forgiving for his first 18 months at St Kilda

The coach needs to stop being soft and just be brutal. Get angry with his players!!

They are making him look like a d**khead.

He's come back from far worse (in his personal life) than a few losses in professional sport

And here is what needs to happen... He played in an era of coaches who ranted and shouted at the top of their lungs!!

He doesn't need to do that, but he needs to take on the mentality of an old fashioned coach.

Forget about their name or their reputation or their salary. You stuff up and you are benched. Full stop!!

Doesn't matter how many games you've played or how old you are. Come off and get a tongue lashing (and if you break team rules you're sent straight to the VFL).

It starts with every player lifting their work rate on the training track. Toughen them up and demand more

Fair comments

[saynta]

Unfortunately the decision to accept mediocrity was made the minute we appointed ratten to the job.

Again. That's just your personal opinion

Yep and he is wrong....dead wrong.

[Sanctorum]

All is not lost. We can do a reset...

He has been far too forgiving for his first 18 months at St Kilda

The coach needs to stop being soft and just be brutal. Get angry with his players!!

They are making him look like a d**khead.

He's come back from far worse (in his personal life) than a few losses in professional sport

And here is what needs to happen... He played in an era of coaches who ranted and shouted at the top of their lungs!!

He doesn't need to do that, but he needs to take on the mentality of an old fashioned coach.

Forget about their name or their reputation or their salary. You stuff up and you are benched. Full stop!!

Doesn't matter how many games you've played or how old you are. Come off and get a tongue lashing (and if you break team rules you're sent straight to the VFL).

It starts with every player lifting their work rate on the training track. Toughen them up and demand more

Brett Ratten is certainly showing the strains of coaching St Kilda - it has to be rated as one of the toughest gigs in the AFL, a club that is most famous for winning the most wooden spoons!

I agree with you Scollop that the problem is not simply inadequate coaching - it did surprise me that all the commentators tipped St Kilda to beat Adelaide when they were missing at least 7 "best 22" players out with injuries, plus Membrey and Ross unavailable, that's almost half the team! Losing Hunter Clark before 1/2 time just compounded the problem.

No coach should be condemned in the full context of the circumstances faced by Ratten....

That said, it does not excuse the players for making some terrible decisions on the night - Ben Long heading into the 50 with 2 players in clear space close to goals and taking a shot that scores a behind; Jack Lonie likewise had a shocker, Jack Higgins rushing his set shot in the last quarter was dreadful - God knows what got into him to not calmly take his time. The players were totally responsible for this disappointing loss, and Ratten MUST hold them to account and give them a swift kick up the proverbials!

Last night's loss. and given that the injury list remains a major problem, should put an end to St Kilda's chances to play finals this year. I believe the club should immediately set up an independent (not internal) investigation/review of the football department, with special focus on the adequacy of the playing list, and reset for 2022. I retain confidence in Ratten to be head coach (and there are no better prospects out there) but think that he needs much better support and maybe network with some of his mentors to examine how he can improve. They would do really well to offer a bucket of money to lure Mark "Choco" Williams in a senior asssistant role.

[samuraisaint]

Let's see how the club reacts to this, this final outrage is surely a point in time where something needs to drastically happen.
This is where the Pres comes out and makes a statement to the members and supporter base with some sort of plan moving forward or at least an apology for the ineptitude right across the board.
This is the fork in the road moment and there is no way to gloss it over.
The supporters have had enough and will walk away in droves
and if they aren't having a crisis meeting as we speak...then.......sayonara

He's already done that after the Footscray fiasco. Since then what has really changed?
Nothing - we have played three teams widely tipped to finish bottom four includng last year's wooden spooner and this year's wooden spooner, and we have only won one of them, and that was by only three goals.

It isn't what you say that counts, it's what you do.

I am going to sound merenecery here, but I really believe some of our leaders and experienced players burned us this week.

The members have been played for mugs as have the sponsors when our team dishes up a second half like that. We looked like Auskickers chasing the footy.

Well, they have the bye now and they better enjoy it because after the bye we play Richmond again, Brisbane at the Gabba, Port Adelaide, West Coast Eagles in Perth and Geelong at Geelong, and I believe that three of those five games will end in 100 point hidings the way we are playing and with the personnell we have out.

[The Fireman]

Brett Ratten is certainly showing the strains of coaching St Kilda - it has to be rated as one of the toughest gigs in the AFL, a club that is most famous for winning the most wooden spoons!

I agree with you Scollop that the problem is not simply inadequate coaching - it did surprise me that all the commentators tipped St Kilda to beat Adelaide when they were missing at least 7 "best 22" players out with injuries, plus Membrey and Ross unavailable, that's almost half the team! Losing Hunter Clark before 1/2 time just compounded the problem.

No coach should be condemned in the full context of the circumstances faced by Ratten....

That said, it does not excuse the players for making some terrible decisions on the night - Ben Long heading into the 50 with 2 players in clear space close to goals and taking a shot that scores a behind; Jack Lonie likewise had a shocker, Jack Higgins rushing his set shot in the last quarter was dreadful - God knows what got into him to not calmly take his time. The players were totally responsible for this disappointing loss, and Ratten MUST hold them to account and give them a swift kick up the proverbials!

Last night's loss. and given that the injury list remains a major problem, should put an end to St Kilda's chances to play finals this year. I believe the club should immediately set up an independent (not internal) investigation/review of the football department, with special focus on the adequacy of the playing list, and reset for 2022. I retain confidence in Ratten to be head coach (and there are no better prospects out there) but think that he needs much better support and maybe network with some of his mentors to examine how he can improve. They would do really well to offer a bucket of money to lure Mark "Choco" Williams in a senior asssistant role.

some good points there.



for the record I tipped the Adelaide win.

[samuraisaint]

Brett Ratten is certainly showing the strains of coaching St Kilda - it has to be rated as one of the toughest gigs in the AFL, a club that is most famous for winning the most wooden spoons!

I agree with you Scollop that the problem is not simply inadequate coaching - it did surprise me that all the commentators tipped St Kilda to beat Adelaide when they were missing at least 7 "best 22" players out with injuries, plus Membrey and Ross unavailable, that's almost half the team! Losing Hunter Clark before 1/2 time just compounded the problem.

No coach should be condemned in the full context of the circumstances faced by Ratten....

That said, it does not excuse the players for making some terrible decisions on the night - Ben Long heading into the 50 with 2 players in clear space close to goals and taking a shot that scores a behind; Jack Lonie likewise had a shocker, Jack Higgins rushing his set shot in the last quarter was dreadful - God knows what got into him to not calmly take his time. The players were totally responsible for this disappointing loss, and Ratten MUST hold them to account and give them a swift kick up the proverbials!

Last night's loss. and given that the injury list remains a major problem, should put an end to St Kilda's chances to play finals this year. I believe the club should immediately set up an independent (not internal) investigation/review of the football department, with special focus on the adequacy of the playing list, and reset for 2022. I retain confidence in Ratten to be head coach (and there are no better prospects out there) but think that he needs much better support and maybe network with some of his mentors to examine how he can improve. They would do really well to offer a bucket of money to lure Mark "Choco" Williams in a senior asssistant role.

some good points there.



for the record I tipped the Adelaide win.

As did I, and it was not all about our injuries either, because Adelaide have their fair share, it was about St Kilda playing to the script and they certainly didn't let me down there.

We need a massive shift in what we accept and what we don't - Geelong did it after 2006, Richmond did it, Adelaide did it too when Blight came in and got rid of players he believed not to be the type to bring the right results, both on and off the field.

I still think a lot of it is player development and the lack of a dedicated reserves team.

[saynta]

Let's see how the club reacts to this, this final outrage is surely a point in time where something needs to drastically happen.
This is where the Pres comes out and makes a statement to the members and supporter base with some sort of plan moving forward or at least an apology for the ineptitude right across the board.
This is the fork in the road moment and there is no way to gloss it over.
The supporters have had enough and will walk away in droves
and if they aren't having a crisis meeting as we speak...then.......sayonara

I am going to sound merenecery here, but I really believe some of our leaders and experienced players burned us this week.

You should name them, if that is what you truly believe.

[Yorkeys]

How do you present after the schedule they had to put up with, losing Clark to a broken jaw, on a wet humid night when several players you begged for efforts simply did not put in and you get done in a train wreck of circumstance beyond your control. Scrub up like Hugh Jackman?

Ratts wears his heart on his sleeve and his physical and mental exhaustion showed. He is genuine and a good coach. Our list depth is awful.