Key defenders and player development.

[Otiman]

Going on this year and last years draft, and out need for a key defender, many are wondering why we are picking midfielders in the draft.

It's quite simple. Defensive talent can be taught a lot more easily than offensive flair and ball magnetism. You don't see many midfielders picked on pure athleticism and then taught how to play the game, irishmen aside. This is why (in my opinion), Brad Howard will not be a success.

If you can take a guy like Jimmy Gwilt, and turn him from the bumbling wreck (anyone who was at the intra-club game in 2007 can attest to this) into a player who can beat Barry Hall and score a Brownlow Vote at full back, then you can surely take a rookie with the required body type (Rutten is the prime example, who was rookie listed by the crows in 2002) and turn him into one of the best full backs in the league.

If you want a rebounding Full Back, then you have to look toward the draft, guys like Scarlett (F/S Selection, 1997) and Glass (Pick 11, 1999) are there for the taking. This is where someone like Alex Rance will most likely end up, as a good stopper who can provide some rebound. As we already have the rebound in Raph, BJ, Gram, and co. we can concentrate on developing a rookie for this purpose.

For some reason, the club decided to persevere with Wall, despite his few years on the Swans rookie list, and not putting on any weight or muscle as required. We should ideally take two guys in the rookie draft, 194-198cm with the required athletic attributes (quick off the line, 20m sprint under 2.9sec) and hope that their bodies can develop as required to play AFL football.

Alternatively, we have Sam Gilbert developing nicely, who can be developed anywhere from a line-breaking outside mid, to a full back. Some say he would be wasted at full back, but if we have no other option, why the hell not!

[saintsRrising]

I am hoping that we rookie someone like Gourdis to train them up as our future FB

[LTN16]

I agree Otiman good post

I think we will take 2 Key Position Defenders in the Rookie draft.

Maybe one Mature and one Young. I would be happy with that.

[SaintBot]

Maybe one Mature and one Young. I would be happy with that.

anyone know who is the next best vfl/sanfl/wafl/qldfl/nswfl/tfl/ntfl/etc key defender behind scott thompson? pehaps he should be given a look.
disagree that we should take two defenders though


i believe that a semi-common trend with the best defenders is that they seemed to have played as key forwards in their junior years

rutten very clearly comes to mind.

thats why gourdis could be a good pickup...even though he is a forward at the moment he could develop into an exciting defender

[Otiman]

Nothing wrong with grooming Jarryd Allen as a KP Defender either, he was recruited as one who could play either end.

[SaintBot]

Nothing wrong with grooming Jarryd Allen as a KP Defender either, he was recruited as one who could play either end.

i reckon he has shown more up forward but worth a shot down back for sure

[skeptic]

also have to remember that we're not going to plug all our list's holes in 1 trade period and draft.

better to get more midfielders and rucks than subpar KPP coz we have a shortage

[St.M]

Allen has not the speed for a KPP deep defender......

Sam Gilbert, whilst now is playing as a runner due to his lack of size will definitly end up a KPdef.....when he adds strength....his run is good, but his skill below his knees and kicking will stop him from being a pure mid.
Sam's development was as a CHB at U18 level, and Full Back for two years at Casey.....

Sam is
194cm, very attcking, good speed, and plays his best footy with the game in front of him where he can take it on....

[Otiman]

Agreed on Gilbert, there's no reason he can't be our next full back, other than perhaps being outmuscled in one on one situations. He can break the lines in the defensive 50, meaning we can clear against teams with high forward pressure.

Allen looks a likely forward, but if he's needed in defense, whether it be due to Goose's ongoing injuries or something else, he is able to do the job well.

[plugger66]

Agreed on Gilbert, there's no reason he can't be our next full back, other than perhaps being outmuscled in one on one situations. He can break the lines in the defensive 50, meaning we can clear against teams with high forward pressure.

Allen looks a likely forward, but if he's needed in defense, whether it be due to Goose's ongoing injuries or something else, he is able to do the job well.

I think you will find that they have intention on Gilbert ever being more that the third tall. He will be used as a running player because that is what he does best. He is not and never will be KPP.

[Otiman]

I think you will find that they have intention on Gilbert ever being more that the third tall. He will be used as a running player because that is what he does best. He is not and never will be KPP.

If we don't recruit and develop someone soon, it may fall to him by default.

[St.M]

Why could he not play KP?????

194cm, played there in Brisbane before he was drafted, played CHB for the allies vs Victoria in an U21 game, was drafted with the Bio of being a CHB, played at FB at Casey since he has arrived. Obviously he cannot play ther ATM due to strength, but plays his best footy running off Key fwds and setting up play with dash.....not the skills to do enough damage as a third/rebound defender.....not that we don't have enough 190+ who are Pocket/Flankers/Utilities

Goddard
R.Clarke
S.Fisher
Dempster
Gilbert
Blake
Ferguson
Gwilt

One of those will need to step up as a Key Defender by 2010......only one has the speed/height combination to do so...

[vacuous space]

Why could he not play KP?????

He might be able to play KP, but I'd much rather see him bursting through packs with the ball than trying to keep the ball away from opposition forwards.

[plugger66]

Why could he not play KP?????

194cm, played there in Brisbane before he was drafted, played CHB for the allies vs Victoria in an U21 game, was drafted with the Bio of being a CHB, played at FB at Casey since he has arrived. Obviously he cannot play ther ATM due to strength, but plays his best footy running off Key fwds and setting up play with dash.....not the skills to do enough damage as a third/rebound defender.....not that we don't have enough 190+ who are Pocket/Flankers/Utilities

Goddard
R.Clarke
S.Fisher
Dempster
Gilbert
Blake
Ferguson
Gwilt

One of those will need to step up as a Key Defender by 2010......only one has the speed/height combination to do so...

He is best used as a runnning defender and as for where he played in lower grades of footy, I wouldnt think that is comparable to AFL. Also he has been told not to increase his weight as they want to use him as a third tall or a running HB.

[SaintBot]

dont forget our nsw rookie, Khan Haretuku.

very big, fairly new to the game.

could be similar to Harry O'Brien of Collingwood.

[sunsaint]

Heaven forbid that our list management and recruiting requires Gilbert to be groomed for fullback.
I disagree that key position defenders are groomed into the role.
Every kid that kicks a footy wants to be the goal kicking hero, or the always in the action onballer. But to be in the backline where you are on a hiding to nothing 9 times out of ten, takes a particular type of person.
Flair cant be taught in the same way that the defenders dourness is a genetic trait.
Matty Scarlett went from the TAC to one of the leagues best fullbacks in three seasons.
Im happy with our draft, but would love to have seen a player like Alex Rance thrown in to boost our defence.

[LennyBoy]

Andrew Mcintrye - NAFC - former crows rookie.

Could always recruit Ben Hart.

[Armoooo]

Dempster...
I hope we do not use him as a tagging player like he was used at Sydney, that would make him j8ust another Blake, I believe that he has all the attributes to be a fullback, i see a lot of similarities between him and Max, I do not like him there as a long term option but I definitely do until we can get another fullback up and running....

[St.M]

I wish we could re-visit this post in two years....

[Otiman]

I wish we could re-visit this post in two years....

I don't think we will need to wait much longer than the Rookie draft to see what the future will hold.

[Armoooo]

So Dec 11th we will find out what our future holds how exciting

Is there any reason why there is so long between the national and rookie drafts, I don't understand why they can't knock them both off in one day, or maybe over two weeks....

[SaintBot]

So Dec 11th we will find out what our future holds how exciting

Is there any reason why there is so long between the national and rookie drafts, I don't understand why they can't knock them both off in one day, or maybe over two weeks....

creates another occasion = more money

[Otiman]

creates another occasion = more money

I wouldn't expect it would make much from a media point of view, there is a live webcast, SEN, and the delayed broadcast on Foxtel for the National Draft, but no-one really cares too much about the rookie and reject drafts.

However, the cost of getting all of the personnel together in the one room, equipment and room set up on two separate days makes it pretty silly not to have them all on the same day from an economic standpoint.

The only thing I can think of is that it allows teams to concentrate on the National Draft up until that day, and then from there assess the remaining candidates for rookie and PSD selection.

[LTN16]

Andrew Mcintrye - NAFC - former crows rookie.

Not tall enough for a KPP.

Adelaide would have kept him if he was any good.

[n1ck]

Andrew Mcintrye - NAFC - former crows rookie.

Not tall enough for a KPP.

Adelaide would have kept him if he was any good.

http://www.nafc.com.au/players/amcintyre.aspx

LennyBoy only likes him coz he wears Travisty.