Dempster in for whom???? Best 22

[saint08]

OK, so now we have depth, the hard questions begin.

Ross has said he sees dempster in his top 22. Really rates him highly as tagger and running rebounder.

So if BJ and Goose are automatic ins when match fit, and Bakes has to come in to the side, who are the 4 who would drop out ?

Raph? Aaron? Geary ? Blake?

If so : best 22 :

B Gilbert Hudgton S.Fisher

HB dempster Maguire BJ

C gram Hayes x Clarke

HF schneider roo dal

FF milne kosi Gherig

Rucks Gardy , Ball, Baker

int : King, Montagna, L fisher, Harvey

[james rose]

http://www.saintsational.com/forum/view ... hp?t=41158

interesting to try and fit in the demp though as well :S

hate to be chairman of selectors

[saintbrat]

DEmpster still rcovering from?? arthroscope- but hasn't been mentioned as being as close as BJ

[saint08]

He is playing at Scorps today Bratty...i'm just thinking ahead to round 26

[Saints Premiers 2008]

noone

[Dan Warna]

yep, can't see dempster in the best 22.

still to return maguire, baker and goddard.

dempster isn't better than any of them and they'll take up 3 slots in the team without a doubt.

hard to find 3 people in the team last night who didnt' contribute.

selectors will have stress in the couple of weeks finding spots for these guys.

also there is the issue of team balance, with maguire and goddard both 190cm plus, and baker taking a tagging/running spot.

[BigMart]

Ross should not play favourites.....his history with Dempster should cloud the fact he is NOT in our best 22 - clearly 22-30....and thats on the last 3 years....

He opposes
Goddard
Blake
L.Fisher
Baker

all of whom have had better careers than Sean to this date

Raph and Gilbo are possibly behind Dempster, but are different players, both more ariel....Dempster is 192cm, but is very poor overhead and is clearly a running negating player....

He does fit into the accountable defensive mould of Lyon, but is the defensive version of C.Gardiner......a handy depth pick up...not a starting player

[Oh When the Saints]

Spot on BigMart ... exactly my thoughts.

Realistically, unless we have a few injuries and a few blokes spectacularly out of form, and Dempster is carving it up in the VFL, he will struggle to get a game this year IMO

[hAyES]

Dempster in for whom? Since when is Dempster an automatic selection?

[Saints Premiers 2008]

we have to see him play first though...because he is one of those players in the league i cant put a name to a face...

[mad saint guy]

Dempster needs to prove that he is a better selection than Ferguson and Allen, let alone automatically displacing Gilbert/Raph/L.Fisher.

He's a long way off the best 22.

[st.byron]

It's a tough enough call to fit BJ, Goose and Bakes back in without thinking about Dempster.
For mine, first to go is Fiora for BJ. After that, it's tough.
Probably Raph for Goose, although I think Raph's doing a solid job so far this year.
Who to drop for Bakes, I'm buggered if I know. Leigh Fish is the obvious choice, but he doesn't deserve it.
Agree that Dempster is a long way off being in the best 22.
He's competing not necessarily for the same role, but for a spot in the team with Armitage, Allen, Jones, Charlie Gardiner and Birss, never mind BJ, Goose and Bakes.
New teritory for us isn't it? Having hot competition for a spot in the senior team.

[Solar]

will be fighting for that shut down midfield role with fish and baker. Nice to have those options, might be a chance to come in for the geelong match if he shows form in the next two weeks as he would be a good shut down option against a ablett, chapman etc.

[meher baba]

Fish, Raph, Dempster, Geary, Gilbert and Gram are all fighting for two spots IMO once Baker, Goose and BJ come back. I think Fiora fulfills a different role than most of these (although perhaps BJ or Gram could do some of what he does).

Fish, Raph and Geary are doing themselves big favours by their efforts in recent weeks. Dempster is a good, hard working player of the type that Lyon likes and we must therefore assume that he is an automatic selection (even though I don't think he should be).

Gilbert and Gram seem to be coasting a bit at the moment and need to lift their intensity, or they will be at some risk.

[bigcarl]

Ross should not play favourites.....his history with Dempster should cloud the fact he is NOT in our best 22 - clearly 22-30....and thats on the last 3 years

agree. make dempster earn his stripes. good form for casey and some injuries and he might get his chance

[fonz_#15]

i would definately not have him in at geary's expense..the kid can play

[Solar]

is he playing today? haven't heard him play today?

[nicola69]

Ross should not play favourites.....his history with Dempster should cloud the fact he is NOT in our best 22 - clearly 22-30....and thats on the last 3 years....

He opposes
Goddard
Blake
L.Fisher
Baker

all of whom have had better careers than Sean to this date

Raph and Gilbo are possibly behind Dempster, but are different players, both more ariel....Dempster is 192cm, but is very poor overhead and is clearly a running negating player....

He does fit into the accountable defensive mould of Lyon, but is the defensive version of C.Gardiner......a handy depth pick up...not a starting player

There are usually injuries - many players will get their chance during the year. The added depth in the playing list is a real improvement over a couple of years ago. We'll probably need them all at some stage.

[mad saint guy]

Current best 22 IMO

B: Gilbert, Hudghton, R.Clarke
HB: Gram, S.Fisher, Goddard
C: X.Clarke, Hayes, Montagna
HF: Schneider, Riewoldt, Harvey
F: Koschitzke, Gehrig, Milne

Foll: M.Gardiner, Ball, Dal Santo
Int: Baker, Blake, Fiora, Geary

Emg: King, Maguire, L.Fisher

AFL quality depth: C.Gardiner, Armitage, Birss, Gwilt, Dempster

[fonz_#15]

surely king plays msg?

[matrix]

geary should stay.
i think fiora and leigh fisher will go for goddard and baker.
not my choice, i just think thats what'll happen.
im hanging for baker to come back, all the talk is on BJ, but baker is great for us and a deff 22 start up imo

[mad saint guy]

surely king plays msg?

I'm really not sure. The team just seems too top heavy with Roo, G, Kosi, King and Gardiner. Gards has definitely moved ahead of King as number one ruckman and I'd like to see how Kosi goes as a ruck/forward (as I believe he always should be).

[fonz_#15]

surely king plays msg?

I'm really not sure. The team just seems too top heavy with Roo, G, Kosi, King and Gardiner. Gards has definitely moved ahead of King as number one ruckman and I'd like to see how Kosi goes as a ruck/forward (as I believe he always should be).

i agree we have maybe 1 too many talls, but by using kosi soley as a forward he takes a class defender , stretching defences that have to match up on roo kosi and g.

[bigcarl]

I'd like to see how Kosi goes as a ruck/forward (as I believe he always should be).

and go back to the kick-it-to-roo-and-fraser plan of last year when we were the lowest scoring team in the competition?

biggest mistake we could make, imo

i know kosi didn't exactly set the world on fire last night (neither did roo) but despite it we kicked 125 points and had a really good spread of goal-kickers.

having kosi there just means we aren't so reluctant to go long, quick and direct to a contest in our forward line and takes enormous pressure of riewoldt and gehrig.

last night the three talls allowed milne, schneider and xavier to completely fly under carlton's radar, so obsessed were they with stopping our gun talls.

anyway, it's all been covered pretty well in other threads like "what's wrong with kosi".

just my opinion msg

[BAM! (shhhh)]

I'd like to see how Kosi goes as a ruck/forward (as I believe he always should be).

and go back to the kick-it-to-roo-and-fraser plan of last year when we were the lowest scoring team in the competition?

biggest mistake we could make, imo

i know kosi didn't exactly set the world on fire last night (neither did roo) but despite it we kicked 125 points and had a really good spread of goal-kickers.

having kosi there just means we aren't so reluctant to go long, quick and direct to a contest in our forward line and takes enormous pressure of riewoldt and gehrig.

last night the three talls allowed milne, schneider and xavier to completely fly under carlton's radar, so obsessed were they with stopping our gun talls.

anyway, it's all been covered pretty well in other threads like "what's wrong with kosi".

just my opinion msg

125 points last night had nothing to do with having Kosi up front. He was rarely a target, and he didn't kick goals.

The low scoring forward line last year was not a result of having 2 forward targets instead of 3.

Both last night, AND the results of last year are based around the midfields ability to GET the ball into the forward line, and then the forward lines ability to finish their work by kicking the goal. The '07 Saints were woeful in both categories.

This is why Kosi is a good option in the ruck. King struggles with his marking, Gardiner struggles with his disposal... both are miles ahead of Rix, Ackland, Knobel, but these are Kosi's strengths. Both Gardiner and King are better at the hitout than Kosi.

This is also why it's important to have Dal behind centre, have Goddard in the halfback line... but on topic, you've got to wonder if Kosi would not be of better use working on his hitouts against 2nd ruckmen - and then smashing them in the middle.

For all that, given 2 wins, I think our best approach is to persist with the setup we've got and try and get it peaking, because the Saints can play a lot better than they are - and the glimpses we've seen leave me wanting more.