Youth Policy, Play the kids, NOW

[rexy]

B4Eva,

Don't you think we can still afford to focus on getting our established players, former AA players, to play well instead of giving up and playing the kids?

Is that just a cop out for when you can't get the best out of what you've got?

2 fantastic, relevant and opposing points of view, I think that we must play some more kids, McEvoy deserves a shot, Geary looks like a good footballer and Jack Steven excites me, he has good hands, pace and mongrel. I also agree though that RL must question why the likes of Gram have gone backwards under his tutilage? Is it the game plan, his motivational powers, loss of form from the individual? Ross's job to find the answers. RL has had a better run with injuries than the previous coach for worse results, he must turn this around or he will become the previous coach IMO.

[saintspremiers]

I'd say Allen and McEvoy look ready, and should have some impact......both players should be able to offer something up forward, clearing up Gehrig's absence and perhaps playing Kosi elsewhere......not sure Kosi is fast enough for CHB given he is a few yards off the required pace to be a mobile tall.....question is, can we carry Gardy, King and Kosi all in the one side?

[barks4eva]

B4Eva,

Don't you think we can still afford to focus on getting our established players, former AA players, to play well instead of giving up and playing the kids?

Is that just a cop out for when you can't get the best out of what you've got?

Who's giving up, dodgy, please direct me to the post where I wrote, it's time to give up,

never said that,

I'm talking about dropping passengers, GOP's, ineffectual, poorly skilled, slow player's and instead replacing them with fresh new talent, raw yes, but fresh nonetheless,

this is the quickest way forward, right now, imho, playing the kids is the best chance we have of playing finals this year and making something meaningful out of the year,

even if it's what we take into next year,

I said nothing about running up a white flag,

but if we don't play the kids, that's as good as running up the white flag, it just takes you a bit longer to figure it out, that's all, but I do make allowances, for you dodgy

[saintsrokk]

Rogerfox, I doubt that Barks4eva had the AA in mind for swapping with the kids.
I also would like to see some of the kids who are doing well get a game. But to my mind there is only Ferguson (no kid), Geary, and McEvoy who are presenting themselves at this stage.
________
Herbal vaporizers

[BAM! (shhhh)]

All well and good for now. I like the plan put forward by everton if that's the path we were to follow. I wonder what the general reaction would be when after a handful of games some of these kids weren't lighting it up and were making fundamental mistakes though.

Especially in negative roles like the one Briss played Friday night, I'd rather see a Jack Steven giving a go to shutting down someone like Shaw.

[cwrcyn]

I'm all for giving the kids a go, but they need to be played against the right type of opponents at this stage so they don't get physically smashed. The Richmond game was ideal, as they are not known for their physical style of game, so that was an opportunity lost, as was the Collingwood game.

I haven't seen McEvoy play, but Allen looks worth a shot, and I'm excited by Jack Steven - a cross between Baker and Ball (pre OP). Geary is stiff not to be playing and has already shown he's up to it.

Allen for Gehrig
Geary for Dempster or R.Clarke

Steven and McEvoy maybe for late 2008 or early 2009

[rodgerfox]

I reckon Chris Judd would look average in our team right now.

I almost think it would be detrimental to have young footballers come in and run around like headless chooks.

What would they learn?

Do we need good footballers to carry out the roles we're seeing our gun players play?

Are they wasted?

[barks4eva]

I reckon Chris Judd would look average in our team right now.

I almost think it would be detrimental to have young footballers come in and run around like headless chooks.

What would they learn?

Do we need good footballers to carry out the roles we're seeing our gun players play?

Are they wasted?

huh, shrugs, so what's your solution dodgy?

keep playing Blake, R.Clarke, L. Fisher, C.Gardiner, Dempster, Fiora, Birss etc...

I'd rather play some new fresh talent even if some of them are raw

Ferguson deserves a go at HFF
McEvoy and Allen into the forwardline
Kossie to reinvent himself at CHB
Geary, Eddy, Steven, etc... just play them

afterall it's not like Blake, R.Clarke, L. Fisher, C.Gardiner, Dempster, Fiora, Birss etc... are going to be part of some stellar premiership combination

we need to build for the future and do it now

things are going to get tough with the draft, when the GC come in

no more pussyfooting and shuffling deckchairs, the time to restructure with young kids is now

without any further delay

the continued selection rotation of GOP's is frustrating in that it only delays the inevitable and holds us back even longer

it's so obvious, as it was last year

bring in some kids + 24yo Ferguson

FAIR DINKUM

[tweedaletomanning]

Can we LTI Gehrig?

No we cannot

?

He isnt injured.

We can lodge any one of Gehrig's existing long-term ailments as a long-term injury.

100% correct Everton.....Plugger is wrong! Gherig CAN be on the LTI.

[plugger66]

Can we LTI Gehrig?

No we cannot

?

He isnt injured.

We can lodge any one of Gehrig's existing long-term ailments as a long-term injury.

100% correct Everton.....Plugger is wrong! Gherig CAN be on the LTI.

Can you explain how.

[jill]

The young blokes who are doing well at Casey deserve to take the place of players not up to form eg Gram. Hasn't hurt Hawks playing kids!

[snippa]

[
I'm talking about dropping passengers, GOP's, ineffectual, poorly skilled, slow player's and instead replacing them with fresh new talent, raw yes, but fresh nonetheless,

No trying to be smart but isn't this what Essendon have done?

Football matches are won with players with hard bodies. Are our youngsters physically developed enough. I agree we must try them out soon or later, but wholesale changes in quick succession will lead to heavier defeats IMO.

[rodgerfox]

I reckon Chris Judd would look average in our team right now.

I almost think it would be detrimental to have young footballers come in and run around like headless chooks.

What would they learn?

Do we need good footballers to carry out the roles we're seeing our gun players play?

Are they wasted?

huh, shrugs, so what's your solution dodgy?

keep playing Blake, R.Clarke, L. Fisher, C.Gardiner, Dempster, Fiora, Birss etc...

I'd rather play some new fresh talent even if some of them are raw

Ferguson deserves a go at HFF
McEvoy and Allen into the forwardline
Kossie to reinvent himself at CHB
Geary, Eddy, Steven, etc... just play them

afterall it's not like Blake, R.Clarke, L. Fisher, C.Gardiner, Dempster, Fiora, Birss etc... are going to be part of some stellar premiership combination

we need to build for the future and do it now

things are going to get tough with the draft, when the GC come in

no more pussyfooting and shuffling deckchairs, the time to restructure with young kids is now

without any further delay

the continued selection rotation of GOP's is frustrating in that it only delays the inevitable and holds us back even longer

it's so obvious, as it was last year

bring in some kids + 24yo Ferguson

FAIR DINKUM

I agree we need to make a call as to whether or not the types of players you've mentioned are going to be part of a premiership team. I think there are a few more high profilers that need to be added to the list too.

However, right now I don't think playing the 'kids' will do anything at all. Blooding kids, if possible, needs to be gradual. One or two at a time, and ensure they're playing alongside good experienced players.

ie. Armitage playing now is ideal with Lenny and Bally playing well, and Harves still going around.

However, throwing a bunch of them in at once won't help them develop. They won't be learning from anyone - certainly not the coach at this stage. If senior players can't play to the plan and/or improve their game, why would you expect a kid to come in show something?

My solution?

Tweak our game plan.

We can't completely change it - me may as well change coach if we do that. (We also need to change assistant coaches, but that's for another thread.)

It needs to allow instinct football, and allow our incredibly talented list to actually play to their strengths.

Give a bit of license. Infact in some - demand it.


And, at the same time start putting some games into some young guys who are genuinely considered good prospects.

I don't know why you keep talking about Ferguson. I'd say he's in exactly the same boat as the others you've already mentioned.

[BAM! (shhhh)]

Ferguson deserves a go at HFF
McEvoy and Allen into the forwardline
Kossie to reinvent himself at CHB
Geary, Eddy, Steven, etc... just play them

A lot of people seem to want to see McEvoy in the forward line. Why? The kid is supposed to be our ruck of the future, and rucking at AFL level is a huge step up from any other. If we've got an opponent and opening that suits blooding a young ruckman, then by all means, play him... but lets not put him into the forwardline to wait for delivery that never comes unless we see that as where he's going to be played.

From other posts, he's been a great player, but is still adjusting to rucking against men instead of boys in the VFL. Once he gets the weight and won't be a lamb to the slaughter, by all means, get him in... but otherwise, even if we do focus on the kids, focus on putting them in positions they can play for 10 years or develop in.

[ausfatcat]

Ferguson deserves a go at HFF
McEvoy and Allen into the forwardline
Kossie to reinvent himself at CHB
Geary, Eddy, Steven, etc... just play them

A lot of people seem to want to see McEvoy in the forward line. Why? The kid is supposed to be our ruck of the future, and rucking at AFL level is a huge step up from any other. If we've got an opponent and opening that suits blooding a young ruckman, then by all means, play him... but lets not put him into the forwardline to wait for delivery that never comes unless we see that as where he's going to be played.

From other posts, he's been a great player, but is still adjusting to rucking against men instead of boys in the VFL. Once he gets the weight and won't be a lamb to the slaughter, by all means, get him in... but otherwise, even if we do focus on the kids, focus on putting them in positions they can play for 10 years or develop in.

Because thats what lyon and archie said when/if he came in would be as a forward, yes he will be a ruckman going down the track but right now with Gardiner and king in there is no room for him as a ruckman... but there is a forward.

[barks4eva]

I don't know why you keep talking about Ferguson. I'd say he's in exactly the same boat as the others you've already mentioned.

The difference being dodgy, the other's have had countless opportunities time and time again, whilst Ferguson has NEVER ONCE been played in the forwardline in a position where he played all of his junior football and a position that he apparently played well enough in to be drafted.

At the end of the day he might not be up to it, it might be another wasted selection, but FAIR DINKUM the kid deserves at the very least an opportunity in the position he played all his junior football in.

The fact that he has been on our list for what > 5 or 6 years and has never played one game in the forwardline is outrageous and imho a strong case for dereliction of duty can be made against all of those who are guilty of never having selected him there up until this point in time.


Personally I believe that Ferguson is capable of being twice the player L.Fisher is for example, but how the **** would we know if the kid never gets a game.

Just give the kid a go and see what happens, it's not like we are travelling like Geelong with it being too hard to find a spot in the team for fornication's sake.

FAIR DINKUM

[barks4eva]

Ferguson deserves a go at HFF
McEvoy and Allen into the forwardline
Kossie to reinvent himself at CHB
Geary, Eddy, Steven, etc... just play them

A lot of people seem to want to see McEvoy in the forward line. Why? The kid is supposed to be our ruck of the future, and rucking at AFL level is a huge step up from any other. If we've got an opponent and opening that suits blooding a young ruckman, then by all means, play him... but lets not put him into the forwardline to wait for delivery that never comes unless we see that as where he's going to be played.

From other posts, he's been a great player, but is still adjusting to rucking against men instead of boys in the VFL. Once he gets the weight and won't be a lamb to the slaughter, by all means, get him in... but otherwise, even if we do focus on the kids, focus on putting them in positions they can play for 10 years or develop in.

McEvoy deserves an opportunity in the big time, it can also be detrimental leaving players in the VFL, without giving them a taste.

Why not play him in the forwardline, his body might be a couple of years away before he's competitive in the ruck, so should we just wait a few years before he gets a game, by that time he might have gone stale running around in the VFL.

Some players start there careers in defence and end up being forwards, so your last point is very flawed and particularly in the modern game players need to be flexible and who's not to say that even if he is a ruckman, he still might play forward at times anyway.

We need to play the kids, otherwise we are doomed to another midtable finish.

We still might finish midtable if we play the kids but at least we are starting to be proactive for the future and giving valuable experince to the players we hop can take us to the next level at some stage.

Persisting with players such as Blake, Fiora, L.Fisher, C.Gardiner, Dempster, Birss etc... is a recipe for disaster

McEvoy, Allen and Ferguson can come in for Gehrig, C.Gardiner and Birss from last friday's forwardline, just for starters