Ball to nominate for draft today according to The Age

This unofficial St Kilda Saints fan forum is for people of all ages to chat Saints Footy and all posts must be respectful.

Moderators: Saintsational Administrators, Saintsational Moderators

User avatar
MCG-Unit
SS Life Member
Posts: 3136
Joined: Thu 11 Mar 2004 4:04pm
Location: Land of the Giants
Has thanked: 479 times
Been thanked: 19 times

Post: # 856804Post MCG-Unit »

plugger66 wrote:Hope you do well at your new club Bally but the club is bigger than any player. It sounds like there will be a few booing you now and it seems that you were never a better player or person than Judd or Hodge even though I could swear I read you were 6 months ago.

Luckily a few on here seem to know exactly what happened between you and the club and also seem to know what you were offerred money wise or is it just the case that when it suits a discussion we just beleive what is written in the paper.

All the best Bally and like all Saints players that leave our club I hope you do really well just not against us.
This.

If you do go Bally, sorry to see you go and all very the best...

I won't slam you because I don't claim to know all the discussions that took place and salary figures that many quote :shock:


Hold your ground :shock:
joffaboy
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 20200
Joined: Tue 09 Mar 2004 1:57pm
Been thanked: 1 time

Post: # 856805Post joffaboy »

plugger66 wrote:Hope you do well at your new club Bally but the club is bigger than any player.
This is all that needs to be said.

Oh and Ball was NEVER better than Judd - even at his best. May have come close to Hodge at his best.

However his best was years ago.


Lance or James??

There comes a point in every man's life when he has to say, "Enough is enough." For me, that time is now. I have been dealing with claims that I cheated and had an unfair advantage in <redacted>. Over the past three years, I have been subjected to a <redacted>investigation followed by <redacted> witch hunt. The toll this has taken on my family, and my work for <redacted>and on me leads me to where I am today – finished with this nonsense. (Oops just got a spontaneous errection <unredacted>)
fingers
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 4642
Joined: Thu 22 Sep 2005 11:17am
Has thanked: 3 times
Been thanked: 4 times

Post: # 856806Post fingers »

plugger66 wrote:Hope you do well at your new club Bally but the club is bigger than any player.
Correct.


User avatar
super dooper
Club Player
Posts: 858
Joined: Sat 20 Mar 2004 12:24am

Post: # 856808Post super dooper »

He has disrespected the jumper!!!

He is going to be more than ok in life after football and he has been on a good packet for the past couple years earning way above what he should be on.

heartless!

Bakes will crush him like a bug next year, or at least i hope he does!


User avatar
Animal Enclosure
SS Hall of Fame
Posts: 2364
Joined: Mon 04 Apr 2005 2:37pm
Location: Saints Footy Central

Post: # 856810Post Animal Enclosure »

joffaboy wrote:
plugger66 wrote:Hope you do well at your new club Bally but the club is bigger than any player.
This is all that needs to be said.

Oh and Ball was NEVER better than Judd - even at his best. May have come close to Hodge at his best.

However his best was years ago.
Spot on.

Sad to see him go but excited that it opens the door for some younger guys that are chomping at the bit to get a crack.

It also opens up the possibility for a PSD pick or a late ND pick of an experienced player. Hopefully a few other notable delisted players will nominate for the ND too.


joffaboy
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 20200
Joined: Tue 09 Mar 2004 1:57pm
Been thanked: 1 time

Post: # 856811Post joffaboy »

super dooper wrote:He has disrespected the jumper!!!

He is going to be more than ok in life after football and he has been on a good packet for the past couple years earning way above what he should be on.

heartless!

Bakes will crush him like a bug next year, or at least i hope he does!
yeah - OK :roll:


Lance or James??

There comes a point in every man's life when he has to say, "Enough is enough." For me, that time is now. I have been dealing with claims that I cheated and had an unfair advantage in <redacted>. Over the past three years, I have been subjected to a <redacted>investigation followed by <redacted> witch hunt. The toll this has taken on my family, and my work for <redacted>and on me leads me to where I am today – finished with this nonsense. (Oops just got a spontaneous errection <unredacted>)
SainterK
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 21057
Joined: Thu 14 Aug 2008 9:53pm
Location: Melb

Post: # 856813Post SainterK »

I am not annoyed with him for going, he is allowed to leave, and to be fair I am sure he would have liked a deal back in trade week rather than this ongoing saga.

I guess the reason that I get slightly annoyed is with the lip service that he payed in recent times, leading up to and after the grand final.

I'd rather he had said nothing than tell porkies and a heap of empty words, this is probably the part of his character that I am disappointed with :?


fingers
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 4642
Joined: Thu 22 Sep 2005 11:17am
Has thanked: 3 times
Been thanked: 4 times

Post: # 856814Post fingers »

I will say it again.

Thank you Luke. Make the decision either way and live by it. For what it's worth we are all ok with whatever you decide ;)

JUST DECIDE.


User avatar
borderbarry
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 6676
Joined: Mon 19 Apr 2004 11:22pm
Location: Wodonga

Post: # 856816Post borderbarry »

I am in fingers corner on this one.
It is just a p[ity Luke or his management or the club had not made an announcement as to his intentions before this.


User avatar
BAM! (shhhh)
SS Hall of Fame
Posts: 2134
Joined: Thu 24 May 2007 5:23pm
Location: The little voice inside your head

Post: # 856817Post BAM! (shhhh) »

stairwaytoheaven wrote:500k a year over the next two years, no wonder we could not afford him.
My honest opinion is i don't think he is worth that much :shock: :shock:
I know this doesn't fit with the emotional roller-coaster...

however,

Does the article have the rules right? I.e. if he nominates for National Draft v Pre-Season draft, he can want 2 years @ 500k all he wants, is the club that drafts him under any obligation to offer him that contract?

As I understand it, if he goes in the PSD, he can name his price. If drafted, the team pays.

In the ND, for a mature player, once drafted, they negotiate a contract. He doesn't have to play, but the only restriction on the drafting club is the minimum payments as set out in the CBA (which from a quick scan conveniently doesn't break things down to which draft is which, and only refers to players who don't nominate salaries, not ones who do!).

Can anyone clarify?


"Everything comes to he who hustles while he waits"
- Henry Ford
BringBackMadDog
Club Player
Posts: 1960
Joined: Thu 05 Aug 2004 9:29am
Has thanked: 3 times
Been thanked: 132 times

Post: # 856820Post BringBackMadDog »

BAM! (shhhh) wrote:
stairwaytoheaven wrote:500k a year over the next two years, no wonder we could not afford him.
My honest opinion is i don't think he is worth that much :shock: :shock:
I know this doesn't fit with the emotional roller-coaster...

however,

Does the article have the rules right? I.e. if he nominates for National Draft v Pre-Season draft, he can want 2 years @ 500k all he wants, is the club that drafts him under any obligation to offer him that contract?

As I understand it, if he goes in the PSD, he can name his price. If drafted, the team pays.

In the ND, for a mature player, once drafted, they negotiate a contract. He doesn't have to play, but the only restriction on the drafting club is the minimum payments as set out in the CBA (which from a quick scan conveniently doesn't break things down to which draft is which, and only refers to players who don't nominate salaries, not ones who do!).

Can anyone clarify?
You are right, you can only put a price on your head in the PSD. If you go into the ND then you get what you negotiate AFTER you get selected, if you are not happy then stiff


User avatar
samoht
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 5764
Joined: Sun 14 Mar 2004 10:45am
Location: https://www.amazon.com.au/Fugitive-Sold ... B00EO1GCNK
Has thanked: 586 times
Been thanked: 436 times
Contact:

Post: # 856824Post samoht »

So if Ball goes into the ND he's gambling with his future - who knows which loser club he'll end up with and at what salary.

I can't believe he's prepared to gamble his career away and turn his back on the club that has looked after him and still wanted him - I'm not sure if that will hold true if the saga drags on though.

Ball may risk painting himself into a corner and out of the picture all together - he's played in the VFL and he would have noticed even at that level there were some very good players running around and hoping to make it - and to make it is not a given, so the smart thing is not to gamble with your future.

the grass is not always greener on the other side, Ball might find himself in a barren desert.
Last edited by samoht on Tue 10 Nov 2009 11:18am, edited 1 time in total.


Thinline
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 6043
Joined: Mon 21 May 2007 5:31pm
Location: Currumbin, Quoinslairnd

Post: # 856825Post Thinline »

meher baba wrote:Well, unlike the rest of you, I'm sad to see him go.

As Lyon said, he was in our best 22. He isn't quite the player he was 3 years ago, and he is looking for less of a cut in his salary than the club was offering (how many of you would cop it quietly if you were offered a 40% cut in your salary?).

But he's a quality in-and-under player. They don't grow on trees. Letting him go is a gamble based on salary cap considerations. We probably can't replace him 100% but we couldn't afford the 400k or so pa he would have wanted to stay. I doubt that Lyon or the club management will be thinking anything remotely ATM like "good riddance to a distraction" or "you beauty, Armo can step up".

The whole Ball saga has not been a good one for the club. I'm not making any judgements: Ball himself and his management played a major part in the situation. But it's also a bad day for our club.

Jeer at Ball all you like, but keep it real....
With the greatest of respect, the bloke has little grip on reality if he thinks - based on output over recentyears - that he was worth any more than we were offering.

The bloke is confirmned as a mercenary in my book.

I think the fact that his effort in the GF was lauded says plenty - he could turn it on when he wanted. Fact is, though, he turned it on, what, maybe five times in four seasons?

Sentiment counts for little.

Don't care what colours he's in. Game's passed him, he'll get found out even more when other clubs expect him to play for 70% plus of game time, and injury will see them ruing their overpriced investment.

Well done ST K for NOT kowtowing to a private school princess.

Ta ta Bally. We'll always have 2004.


"The inches we need are everywhere around us. They're in every break in the game. Every minute, every second. On this team we fight for that inch. On this team we tear ourselves and everyone around us to pieces for that inch. We claw with our fingernails for that inch. Because we know when we add up all those inches that's gonna make the f***in' difference between winning and losing! Between living and dying!'
saint66au
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 17003
Joined: Tue 09 Mar 2004 9:03pm
Contact:

Post: # 856826Post saint66au »

So..has he actually nominated as yet today?? Or are we just all assuming based on Caro's speculation


Image

THE BUBBLE HAS BURST

2011 player sponsor
User avatar
Moccha
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 4528
Joined: Tue 09 Mar 2004 3:33pm
Location: Two Pronged Attack
Contact:

Post: # 856827Post Moccha »

It was a pity that he never lived up to his reputation as a number 2 draft pick. Saints fans were always waiting for him to come good and he never did. It will be interesting to see how well he plays at another club without the rose coloured glasses.


Another opportunity awaits!
fingers
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 4642
Joined: Thu 22 Sep 2005 11:17am
Has thanked: 3 times
Been thanked: 4 times

Post: # 856829Post fingers »

saint66au wrote:So..has he actually nominated as yet today?? Or are we just all assuming based on Caro's speculation
Not yet


User avatar
BAM! (shhhh)
SS Hall of Fame
Posts: 2134
Joined: Thu 24 May 2007 5:23pm
Location: The little voice inside your head

Post: # 856830Post BAM! (shhhh) »

saint66au wrote:So..has he actually nominated as yet today?? Or are we just all assuming based on Caro's speculation
At this stage, I'm thinking it's a Caro fishing expedition. No sources, a bit of speculation based on other reports (i.e. Ball looking to get from StK to Coll, rumoured current salary). If Ball nominates for ND, the Age gets to say they broke the story, the details will be forgotten by round 1. If he doesn't, then everyone's forgotten by round 1 anyway.

Personally, I'm expecting Ball to go - I have zero sources, I'm just guessing - but would assume it will be via PSD where he gets more control of his future.

This would be the moment in pre/post season where I get frustrated that the AFL & AFLPA don't publish a nice succinct set of rule around Player movement and acquisition, to remove the shades of grey (for instance I've been told so many times that a 3rd year rookie was under consideration but not allowed. Clearly if it wasn't in the past it now is, as a number of players are being retained that way... and I've got no idea how long this has been possible).


"Everything comes to he who hustles while he waits"
- Henry Ford
SainterK
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 21057
Joined: Thu 14 Aug 2008 9:53pm
Location: Melb

Post: # 856832Post SainterK »

BAM! (shhhh) wrote:
saint66au wrote:So..has he actually nominated as yet today?? Or are we just all assuming based on Caro's speculation
At this stage, I'm thinking it's a Caro fishing expedition. No sources, a bit of speculation based on other reports (i.e. Ball looking to get from StK to Coll, rumoured current salary). If Ball nominates for ND, the Age gets to say they broke the story, the details will be forgotten by round 1. If he doesn't, then everyone's forgotten by round 1 anyway.

Personally, I'm expecting Ball to go - I have zero sources, I'm just guessing - but would assume it will be via PSD where he gets more control of his future.

This would be the moment in pre/post season where I get frustrated that the AFL & AFLPA don't publish a nice succinct set of rule around Player movement and acquisition, to remove the shades of grey (for instance I've been told so many times that a 3rd year rookie was under consideration but not allowed. Clearly if it wasn't in the past it now is, as a number of players are being retained that way... and I've got no idea how long this has been possible).
I'm with you on this one, I find it a bit odd that the Herald Sun hasn't run with the story. Maybe it's just an assumption on Caro's part, or she maybe has a work associate that may know Luke on a personal basis? :wink:

However I do believe he is going, he did afterall request to be traded which is a fair indication that he doesn't want to stick around. I see no reason to suggest that he has changed his mind since and now wants to stay...


User avatar
Moccha
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 4528
Joined: Tue 09 Mar 2004 3:33pm
Location: Two Pronged Attack
Contact:

Post: # 856837Post Moccha »

Caro is pretty spot on with these things


Another opportunity awaits!
User avatar
Spinner
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 8502
Joined: Sat 02 Dec 2006 3:40pm
Location: Victoria
Has thanked: 185 times
Been thanked: 133 times

Post: # 856840Post Spinner »

My heart rules over my head on this one.

Former captain, best and fairest winner and one of the highest paid....leaving for nothing.

So unworkable, he wants to play his chances in the draft and turn his back on a fair three year contract, his mates and his club of eight years.


Too unworkable or too proud? I've been tending to think the later.


User avatar
samoht
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 5764
Joined: Sun 14 Mar 2004 10:45am
Location: https://www.amazon.com.au/Fugitive-Sold ... B00EO1GCNK
Has thanked: 586 times
Been thanked: 436 times
Contact:

Post: # 856841Post samoht »

If Ball goes - he would have turned his back on the club that looked after him !

He might realise that too late and the hard way !

If he goes , I remain proud and supportive of the club - and only sad in the fact that we could have/ should have chosen Judd instead.


User avatar
Milton66
SS Life Member
Posts: 3521
Joined: Tue 19 May 2009 9:53pm
Location: None of your goddam business

Post: # 856843Post Milton66 »

I have been a big fan of Ball. he's never been anywhere as good as Judd or Hodge.

I still think his career was cut to shreds by playing him with OP.

If he chooses to go, then all the best and thanks for your years of service.

All this "former Captain" hype... well if it wasn't for GT's policy, then I doubt Ball would have got the gig, and even when he got it under RL (yes, that nasty coach did make him co capt IIRC), he gave it away to focus on improving his game.

Will we lose him for nothing? Probably yes. But then again, in the big scheme of things,it's a minor setback when you consider the bargains we've had over the last few years.

Something smells fishy in all of this. Is it Luke? The club? or Connors?

Either way, it's best that he moves on, the club moves on... we move on.


Hotel De Los Muertos: Your room is ready... Care to step inside?
User avatar
avid
Club Player
Posts: 1600
Joined: Tue 11 Mar 2008 1:54am
Location: St Kilda
Has thanked: 17 times
Been thanked: 84 times

Post: # 856844Post avid »

BringBackMadDog wrote:
BAM! (shhhh) wrote:
stairwaytoheaven wrote:500k a year over the next two years, no wonder we could not afford him.
My honest opinion is i don't think he is worth that much :shock: :shock:
I know this doesn't fit with the emotional roller-coaster...

however,

Does the article have the rules right? I.e. if he nominates for National Draft v Pre-Season draft, he can want 2 years @ 500k all he wants, is the club that drafts him under any obligation to offer him that contract?

As I understand it, if he goes in the PSD, he can name his price. If drafted, the team pays.

In the ND, for a mature player, once drafted, they negotiate a contract. He doesn't have to play, but the only restriction on the drafting club is the minimum payments as set out in the CBA (which from a quick scan conveniently doesn't break things down to which draft is which, and only refers to players who don't nominate salaries, not ones who do!).

Can anyone clarify?
You are right, you can only put a price on your head in the PSD. If you go into the ND then you get what you negotiate AFTER you get selected, if you are not happy then stiff
I thought you used to be able to nominate a price in the National Draft too. Maybe not.
In any case, if LB nominates for the PSD, but does it today, it might have a real impact on the careers of some other players on the list. I can't think it through properly, but mightn't it affect whether the club decides to delist someone else or not, or whether another player decides to nominate for the ND or not?
There are people on this forum with far better brains than me for this sort of thing -- any ideas?


User avatar
avid
Club Player
Posts: 1600
Joined: Tue 11 Mar 2008 1:54am
Location: St Kilda
Has thanked: 17 times
Been thanked: 84 times

Post: # 856846Post avid »

Also, does this now mean that we can redraft the Goose as a veteran rookie or something??

Can't see why that would happen.
But that's what I really really want to happen!


User avatar
samoht
Saintsational Legend
Posts: 5764
Joined: Sun 14 Mar 2004 10:45am
Location: https://www.amazon.com.au/Fugitive-Sold ... B00EO1GCNK
Has thanked: 586 times
Been thanked: 436 times
Contact:

Post: # 856847Post samoht »

Ball's done alright for himself - I actually feel for the club.


Post Reply