Kosi

[wallbanger]

I have only skimmed thourhg most of the discussion on this thread, but there definitely seems to be a stroong for or against Kosi split amongst the St Kilda supporter base in general.

I try to remain calm and not post things or here too much in the heat of the moment, and I like to think I don't just blaze away with comments that others would perceive as rash or just plain stupid - however I could be wrong there!

In my opinion, having watched Kosi his entire career, I honestly believe the head knocks he received, together with and the pace of the current game, means that a player of his style has been passed by. My major concern with Kosi is, and always has been, that he fails to have any impact at all on the match when he is "struggling". As John Kennedy famously said, "give me SOMETHING". Kosi fails in this area time and again - he gets knocked out of the contest, the ball is simply swept away and he trudges behind like he doesn't give a stuff, which I'm sure ISN'T the case.

The argument that he takes the "next best" defender to me is ridiculous - how long can the club afford to have a player doing very, very little and justify it by saying "at least that Matty Scarlett bloke had to PLAY on him". Hellooooo??? He is playing at full forward - the position where players are required to KICK GOALS. It is not even remotely acceptable in my book to fall for the 'taking the defender' line - Roo usually gets the best defender everey week and look at the effort he expends and the way he plays. Different players, yes, absolutely, but I tend to think even Kosi himself now thinks "well I just have to stand here and get beaten by Brian Lake so that Roo can run around doing what he does best". Ridiculous.

Had any other high calbire player other than Roo or Lenny (Dal, Monty, Fish, Gram) been so poor throughout the NAB Cup to the point of being almost embaressing, they would surely be under the pump big time. For some reason we always want to make excuses for Kosi - I never really know why. Oh, that's right, he played four good games in a row in 2008 or whenever it was.

In my opinion the club missed it's chance to trade him this off season, while he still had a bit of value left in him. Given his NAB Cup lack of form, if he was to struggle for this year he will be of little value trade wise next off season, and the club will have missed the boat.

Maybe I'm being harsh, but I've just reached the end of my tether with him - it is too frustrating to see so many blokes put in the hard yards to get the ball into the goals square only to see if turned over so easily.

Maybe a stint in the magoos would help, but I really don't think so. So they'll keep him in, he'll take 12 strong pack marks for the year and kick a few bags of 4 or 5 gaols against Richmond or Carlton, and everyone will be singing his praises again. I'd rather someone who put in an even effort across the board against all opposition - pity Fish got injured, I would love to see Goddard play at full-forward all year. At least you know you'd get a contest.

[BAM! (shhhh)]

Played a shocker... due mainly to dropping simple marks. Didn't think he was lazy or anything that would lead me to drop him for round 1 - I wouldn't expect to see him drop 3/4 easy marks in a game again in his career.

Based on preseason for though, if I'm Rhys Stanley, I'm looking to target Kosi's spot.

For some reason Kosi is a divisive player, not really sure why this is the case by this point in his career (he's a viable option at forward or ruck, has proven to be great at neither). At this stage Kosi's the most likely guy we have to take apart opposition fullbacks, so he's going to play full forward.

[wallbanger]

But is he ever going to do it - and how long do we persist?

[Superboot]

Lost count of the number of times in 2009 Kosi dropped the first easy marking chance he had in the game, especially in the 2nd half of the season, often on the lead with no-one near him. You could pretty well guarantee it. But generally, having got the first one out of the way, he would go on to be relatively safe. Difference on Saturday was that he just kept on dropping them.

My main worry is that he appears to lack awareness of what's going on around him. Often looks like he has no footy smarts and doesn't know that opposition players are near him. Almost appears slightly concussed. I'm not sure that this can be worked on at this stage of his career. I'm not bagging him, but this stuff is a real concern.

[BAM! (shhhh)]

But is he ever going to do it - and how long do we persist?

Until someone does it better?

i.e Roo > Kosi at CHF.
Gardiner, King, (possibly) McEvoy > Kosi at ruck.
who is hand's down the better FF?

Much as people want it to be, it's not Stanley yet. Throwing Stanley out there at this stage would be a great way to get people to turn on him quickly (witness how much Raph is loved right now - tune in again after his first clanger for 2010) in the way we do when the next great hope doesn't immediately deliver.

Unless he lifts his game, Kosi's pretty vulnerable compared to a lot of guys, but we don't have anyone at a stage of development to drop him on the basis of clumsy preseason games - unless we're convinced that was as good as it gets from him.

[Dr Spaceman]

But is he ever going to do it - and how long do we persist?

Until someone does it better?

i.e Roo > Kosi at CHF.
Gardiner, King, (possibly) McEvoy > Kosi at ruck.
who is hand's down the better FF?

Much as people want it to be, it's not Stanley yet. Throwing Stanley out there at this stage would be a great way to get people to turn on him quickly (witness how much Raph is loved right now - tune in again after his first clanger for 2010) in the way we do when the next great hope doesn't immediately deliver.

Unless he lifts his game, Kosi's pretty vulnerable compared to a lot of guys, but we don't have anyone at a stage of development to drop him on the basis of clumsy preseason games - unless we're convinced that was as good as it gets from him.

Agree.

Kids like Stanley & Lynch have enormous potential but they're not ready to do battle against the big boys in 2010. If they do end up playing seniors this year, particularly in key posts, it will be a sure indication that we're in panic mode.

As such, Kosi will be there until such time as:

a) He has a prolonged period of bad form, and
b) The team is struggling, and
c) A suitable replacement at the Zebs is breaking the door down.

I for one certainly haven't lost faith. And if and when I finally do, it will be on the back of sustained poor performances in the H & A season, not a couple of NAB games.

[IluvHarvey]

My Question is "Is Stanley better than Kosi?" If the answer is yes then for goodness sake put him in.
If the answer is no (Which is what I believe) Why would you play Stanley.
Surely you would put your best team out there.

[saints66]

Kosi has always frustrated me he is like a round of golf 80 bad shots and one good one. You know he can play but can not string it together for a full game let alone two or three .I think he should be trialled down back at Sandy lets face it no one is 100% sure when he lines up for goal. hope he comes good!

[Milan Faletic]

Lost count of the number of times in 2009 Kosi dropped the first easy marking chance he had in the game, especially in the 2nd half of the season, often on the lead with no-one near him. You could pretty well guarantee it. But generally, having got the first one out of the way, he would go on to be relatively safe. Difference on Saturday was that he just kept on dropping them.

My main worry is that he appears to lack awareness of what's going on around him. Often looks like he has no footy smarts and doesn't know that opposition players are near him. Almost appears slightly concussed. I'm not sure that this can be worked on at this stage of his career. I'm not bagging him, but this stuff is a real concern.

Good post. Sometimes he is actually in the prime spot to mark but then creates a contest with his opponent. Barry Hall showed how to get prime position and hold it. Hand injury or not, I agree that he doesn't have the football smarts to find space. I've said it before but when Roo plays high, he needs to drop back and vice versa.

[rogerwa]

didnt say milne took a dive in the g/f.kossie drop a custard tart,zac pulled out ...last yrs history its what you do now

theafl brought in new rules re taking a dive & milne was one of the star attractions in their video distributed to clubs

i'm happy with milnes efforts to cover for his fellow forwards when the opposition have the ball..he does run to help out ...playing the role he does small forward aint easy & ya only going to get a handfull of opportunitys 10 yds from goal...ya dont blow one of em by taking a dive be it now or later in the season

kossies only going to get a handfull of opportunities to grab a custard tart 20 yrds from goal dont waste one of em by waiting for the ball to fall into your lap

zacs only going to get a handfull of opportunities to lay a tackle during a game when that opportunity arrives do it ...if the opponent being twice your size breaks the tackle so be it atleast you made the effort

not body on the line ,life & death stuff just your run of the mill contests that happen 100 times during a game

i picked out milnes example as being the worst not cause i dont like him...
in fact reckon he's a good bloke & the only plarer i've bothered to spend 10 minutes with & have a chat

his name with the umpires is mud re diving

when your a small forward & the balls 10 yrds from goal one of 3 things are gunna happen
ya gunna break clear=goal
cop one in the back=goal
cause a ball up=opportunity for a goal

take a dive & you'll get nothing,zilth,zero apart from running the risk of getting pinged for pulling the ball in...that aint asking ya to die for the cause just bend over & try & get the footy

[rogerwa]

ment to be under 9.5

[SainterK]

I feel the need to remind some that Kosi is an equal leader in contested marks for 2009 for the entire competition, he is not just about making a contest, he is capable of winning them.

[plugger66]

I feel the need to remind some that Kosi is an equal leader in contested marks for 2009 for the entire competition, he is not just about making a contest, he is capable of winning them.

Pretty sure people are looking at his 2010 form.

[SainterK]

I feel the need to remind some that Kosi is an equal leader in contested marks for 2009 for the entire competition, he is not just about making a contest, he is capable of winning them.

Pretty sure people are looking at his 2010 form.

If you read the thread, I am not so sure....I wouldn't have said it otherwise.

[IluvHarvey]

I feel the need to remind some that Kosi is an equal leader in contested marks for 2009 for the entire competition, he is not just about making a contest, he is capable of winning them.

Pretty sure people are looking at his 2010 form.

Well lets wait until the 2010 season starts before we pass judgement.

[Dr Spaceman]

I feel the need to remind some that Kosi is an equal leader in contested marks for 2009 for the entire competition, he is not just about making a contest, he is capable of winning them.

Pretty sure people are looking at his 2010 form.

Well on 2010 form looks like Lenny will miss out for R1 even if fit (simply hasn't shown enough!)

Gee it's been a long season

[rogerwa]

against syd he went for the marks got few but WE scored about 3 or 4 gls through spillages which was good for the team

when he waited for the ball to fall into his lap on sat & spilled it the dogs were away

your not expected to take everything that comes your way but when it does dont wait for it to be served up on a platter

[Halo]

Kosi is just about past his use by date !!!

Time to sent him to Sandy & get some game time into Rhys Stanley
he is now our future !!

[Bernard Shakey]

Kosi is just about past his use by date !!!

Time to sent him to Sandy & get some game time into Rhys Stanley
he is now our future !!

Not at full forward. Paul Cahill would be ahead of Stanley at full forward.

Also our present is more important than our future.