St Kilda 2007 List + Rookies + Departures - Recruiting Story

[GrumpyOne]

Great post Bot.

Whilst some individuals will argue about Blake McQualter etc., I think your summaries are right on the money.

Hindsight will show that there may have been better picks available, but you can only go on the knowledge that you have at the time. Overall its a good list that should be performing better than 9th.

[sunsaint]

Great post Saintbot, I admire people who base their posts with a touch of reality.
As an addendum to the Ball Vs Judd debate, I think I am right in saying that there were some big doubts over Judds shoulders when he was drafted.

PS meant to add I have a used crystal ball going cheap if anyone is interested...

[Solar]

Great post Saintbot, I admire people base their posts with a touch of reality.
As an addendum to the Ball Vs Judd debate, I think I am right in saying that there were some big doubts over Judds shoulders when he was drafted.

didn't he have two reco's already before he was drafted?

[SaintBot]

Great post Saintbot, I admire people base their posts with a touch of reality.
As an addendum to the Ball Vs Judd debate, I think I am right in saying that there were some big doubts over Judds shoulders when he was drafted.

didn't he have two reco's already before he was drafted?

pretty sure that was the case...and i think Ball's groin only became a problem after he was drafted

[Saints43]

You cannot be serious about Jason Blake. Rate it as a terrible pick and he has played about 100 games. Dont worry who was picked after him. Did all the guys before play as many as Blakey. I doubt it very much. Not very nice to a loyal Saints player who puts in every week even if he is no star.

Just in case anyone missed it....


100 games of AFL football.

Selected by Blight, Watson, Alves, Thomas & Lyon.

[Riewoldting]

Bryon Schammer

His name's Byron.

I also think you are a bit over-critical of the Blake selection - bear in mind that Hawthorn picked Brett Johnson (dead-set dud) the very next pick and Port picked Ackland and Guerra ahead of Chapman, who tore them a new one yesterday.

Also I'm not sure how you can criticise a selection where the player has not performed but, by your own admission, there was not too much else about. Paying a base salary is not that much of an imposition. Look at some of the excellent AFL players that have been taken at pick 50+ in drafts over the years.

Otherwise good post.

[Teflon]

Great effort and excellent read but I afil to see how a Michael Gardiner can eb a great trade when he hasnt played a gane yet?

Hmmmm.....Xavier Clarke?......Bartel......hhhmm
Raymond......
and is true when you throw in Guerra, Mcgough, Ackland plus guys like Murray....our project player...I dont reckon weve been as brilliant as some make out.

Hamill?......yeah I know you cant predict injury BUT on the whole youd have to say in the end what we got from him was avg at best (his best was great and I loved Hamill)O but we simply didnt get it enough.

Not sure how weve won on Fergus Watts yet - I reckon hes on-tradeable right now as Kos should hold down FF with Roo at CHF rotating and Im not sure hes got a spot......

[devil saint]

Great post...thanks! Disappointing that we didn't take Goldsack when we had two chances to do so. Also, it is clearly evident that it was a romantic decision to take raph clarke when we could have had beau waters or brent stanton who could possibly be a brownlow medallist one day.

[ausfatcat]

Great effort and excellent read but I afil to see how a Michael Gardiner can eb a great trade when he hasnt played a gane yet?

Hmmmm.....Xavier Clarke?......Bartel......hhhmm
Raymond......
and is true when you throw in Guerra, Mcgough, Ackland plus guys like Murray....our project player...I dont reckon weve been as brilliant as some make out.

Hamill?......yeah I know you cant predict injury BUT on the whole youd have to say in the end what we got from him was avg at best (his best was great and I loved Hamill)O but we simply didnt get it enough.

Not sure how weve won on Fergus Watts yet - I reckon hes on-tradeable right now as Kos should hold down FF with Roo at CHF rotating and Im not sure hes got a spot......

We got a hell of a lot more out of hamil than carlton got out of livingston and cranage............

[plugger66]

Great post...thanks! Disappointing that we didn't take Goldsack when we had two chances to do so. Also, it is clearly evident that it was a romantic decision to take raph clarke when we could have had beau waters or brent stanton who could possibly be a brownlow medallist one day.

I'll give you a 1000 to one right now.

[ausfatcat]

Great post...thanks! Disappointing that we didn't take Goldsack when we had two chances to do so. Also, it is clearly evident that it was a romantic decision to take raph clarke when we could have had beau waters or brent stanton who could possibly be a brownlow medallist one day.

rubbish Ralph was touted as the number one pick 9 months before the draft..... He then got injured and told every club he wasn't interested in playing for them hense we got him at 9, when if he didn't go all out to get to the saints he would've gone 5 to 8. St Mart your our draft expert.... can you clarify?

[devil saint]

Take that bet any day! PM your credit card details and i'll put my $1 on that for my big $1000 return!

[plugger66]

Great post...thanks! Disappointing that we didn't take Goldsack when we had two chances to do so. Also, it is clearly evident that it was a romantic decision to take raph clarke when we could have had beau waters or brent stanton who could possibly be a brownlow medallist one day.

rubbish Ralph was touted as the number one pick 9 months before the draft..... He then got injured and told every club he wasn't interested in playing for them hense we got him at 9, when if he didn't go all out to get to the saints he would've gone 5 to 8. St Mart your our draft expert.... can you clarify?

He was never ever going to be number one. He was always about where he was drafted.

[SaintBot]

Great effort and excellent read but I fail to see how a Michael Gardiner can be a great trade when he hasnt played a game yet?

Not sure how weve won on Fergus Watts yet - I reckon hes on-tradeable right now as Kos should hold down FF with Roo at CHF rotating and Im not sure hes got a spot......

what did we lose getting gardiner? we lost 16 places with our third pick...i think that is clever trading, is it not? yes gardiner hasnt turned out how we mightve wished yet but the risk was/is worth it for sure


I think we have won with the Watts trade as i dont think we wouldve recieved many better players around where he was selected...if we can work on his legspeed he has the potential to be an excellent long term fullforward for us

[Teflon]

Great effort and excellent read but I afil to see how a Michael Gardiner can eb a great trade when he hasnt played a gane yet?

Hmmmm.....Xavier Clarke?......Bartel......hhhmm
Raymond......
and is true when you throw in Guerra, Mcgough, Ackland plus guys like Murray....our project player...I dont reckon weve been as brilliant as some make out.

Hamill?......yeah I know you cant predict injury BUT on the whole youd have to say in the end what we got from him was avg at best (his best was great and I loved Hamill)O but we simply didnt get it enough.

Not sure how weve won on Fergus Watts yet - I reckon hes on-tradeable right now as Kos should hold down FF with Roo at CHF rotating and Im not sure hes got a spot......

We got a hell of a lot more out of hamil than carlton got out of livingston and cranage............

I had no idea Carlton were our benchmark?

[SaintBot]

Great post...thanks! Disappointing that we didn't take Goldsack when we had two chances to do so. Also, it is clearly evident that it was a romantic decision to take raph clarke when we could have had beau waters or brent stanton who could possibly be a brownlow medallist one day.

rubbish Ralph was touted as the number one pick 9 months before the draft..... He then got injured and told every club he wasn't interested in playing for them hense we got him at 9, when if he didn't go all out to get to the saints he would've gone 5 to 8. St Mart your our draft expert.... can you clarify?

He was never ever going to be number one. He was always about where he was drafted.

i was just looking at a few phantom drafts by journalist from 2003 and Raph Clarke was set to join the saints with pick 8 or essendon with pick 6 in every single one


doubt whether he wouldve ever been predicted number 1, even if early in the year - cooney, walker and sylvia were very highly rated

[Teflon]

Great effort and excellent read but I fail to see how a Michael Gardiner can be a great trade when he hasnt played a game yet?

Not sure how weve won on Fergus Watts yet - I reckon hes on-tradeable right now as Kos should hold down FF with Roo at CHF rotating and Im not sure hes got a spot......

what did we lose getting gardiner? we lost 16 places with our third pick...i think that is clever trading, is it not? yes gardiner hasnt turned out how we mightve wished yet but the risk was/is worth it for sure


I think we have won with the Watts trade as i dont think we wouldve recieved many better players around where he was selected...if we can work on his legspeed he has the potential to be an excellent long term fullforward for us

Im not sure of the logic that judges a trades success/failure yet when the player in question hasnt played 1 game - and still may not???????...hows that a "good trade" yet?

Im also not convinced of the logic of trade assessments when the trade is considered in isoltaioj of what the club requires - Id argue we didnt need Watts (much the same the Dogs didnt need Akermanis - they need talls......we need mids with some dash). Surely any trade assessment has a modicum of requirement attached - shouldnt that not be part of the assessment criteria?

[SaintBot]

Im not sure of the logic that judges a trades success/failure yet when the player in question hasnt played 1 game - and still may not???????...hows that a "good trade" yet?

Im also not convinced of the logic of trade assessments when the trade is considered in isoltaioj of what the club requires - Id argue we didnt need Watts (much the same the Dogs didnt need Akermanis - they need talls......we need mids with some dash). Surely any trade assessment has a modicum of requirement attached - shouldnt that not be part of the assessment criteria?

If Gardiner hadnt of had the injury the trade wouldve been one of the best ever seen. If Gardiner never plays, we didnt lose anything for him so it acctually won't matter. Therefor the trade in itself is very good imo.

Im convinced that at the time Gehrig was close to giving the game away and Watts was brought in to replace him once he did retire. Yes we need more good midfielders but not really anymore backup, as we have plenty. Watts was worth the pick and i hope he can show his worth now that the player he was picked to replace has retired.

[SaintBot]

rookie list now included at the end of the opening post.

recent departures (guerra, ackland, etc) will be up sometime in the next few hours

[my les foote]

Great effort SaintBot. Nobody will ever agree 100% with it but to look at every player in that detail was a great effort.

However, for a proper appraisal on our draft performance, you can't just look at the players who are there now. You are then excluding all the players that have been delisted.

I suggest you look at every trade and every draft pick in each off season.

eg. 2000 - 2001
Riewoldt, good
Kosi, good
Robert Powell, Mark Gale, bad
Daniel Wulf OK

Darryl Wakelin for No. 4 (Hard to say because we never used the pick)
No. 4 and Cranage for Hamill (Good if you compare to Livingstone, but who would we have picked?)

Capuano (how did we get him?)
Brett Voss pre season draft?
Gehrig trade (Siera and 18 for Gehrig)?

[plugger66]

rookie list now included at the end of the opening post.

recent departures (guerra, ackland, etc) will be up sometime in the next few hours

Wall was delisted 2 weeks a go. Not sure that any of the rookies are good or bad picks unless they get put on lists and end up playing.

[Sam23]

fwiw....i'd would've rathered Daniel Kerr than Fraser Gehrig.....

[SaintBot]

rookie list now included at the end of the opening post.

recent departures (guerra, ackland, etc) will be up sometime in the next few hours

Wall was delisted 2 weeks a go. Not sure that any of the rookies are good or bad picks unless they get put on lists and end up playing.

thats why originally didnt do them but someone asked for them

as for Wall being delisted...thats news to me!


and my les foote - im working on the recently departed now

[plugger66]

rookie list now included at the end of the opening post.

recent departures (guerra, ackland, etc) will be up sometime in the next few hours

Wall was delisted 2 weeks a go. Not sure that any of the rookies are good or bad picks unless they get put on lists and end up playing.

thats why originally didnt do them but someone asked for them

as for Wall being delisted...thats news to me!

Found out today. Had no idea but fair enough I would think. At least one more rookie to go if not 2 IMO.

[SaintBot]

rookie list now included at the end of the opening post.

recent departures (guerra, ackland, etc) will be up sometime in the next few hours

Wall was delisted 2 weeks a go. Not sure that any of the rookies are good or bad picks unless they get put on lists and end up playing.

thats why originally didnt do them but someone asked for them

as for Wall being delisted...thats news to me!

Found out today. Had no idea but fair enough I would think. At least one more rookie to go if not 2 IMO.

interesting, thanks for that - who else do you think will be told to go?

i think Jones is the only other rookie who has shown that he wont make it...