will G-Train come up for round 1?

[meher baba]

BTW, I think that Lyon won't go with 3 talls up front in any case. If Kosi, Gehrig and Riewoldt are all playing in the same team, then I would expect to see Kosi spending some time in the ruck. Otherwise, the team simply won't be mobile enough to employ the type of defensive tactics that Lyon presumably wants to persist with in 2008.

[bigcarl]

Even if Gehrig is fit, I would be very surprised if Lyon chose to go with the 3 talls playing permanently up front approach that some seem to want on here. It doesn't seem to gel with Lyon's preferred style of play.

from what we saw in the nab cup lyon's preferred style of play has changed, mainly because he recognises that we were the lowest scoring team in the competition last season and we have to do something to break the logjam.

i think you'll find that his new direction is swift and direct delivery to a tall, mobile forward line and that, if fit, all of riewoldt, gehrig, kosi and probably c gardiner will be in it with milne, schneider and occasionally dal santo, ball, montagna, harvey, xman etc picking up the crumbs.

i applaud it. we have the tall forwards to stretch the defences of virtually any backline in the competition and should not miss the chance to show up their mediocre resources.

it could be the aerially dominant forward line that changes the face of the game and i think that is the way we are heading this season.

it is all about playing to our strengths. we have badly lacked having someone down there who is a strong contested mark.

kosi gives us the option of bombing it long rather than always finding riewoldt or gehrig laces up on the chest on the lead.

[Unforgiven]

BTW, I think that Lyon won't go with 3 talls up front in any case. If Kosi, Gehrig and Riewoldt are all playing in the same team, then I would expect to see Kosi spending some time in the ruck. Otherwise, the team simply won't be mobile enough to employ the type of defensive tactics that Lyon presumably wants to persist with in 2008.

I actaully doubt we will be seeing Kosi in the ruck at all. If we are not mobile enough, I think Ross will send Roo to play along the wing, then use Kosi and G up front. Or also use the bench as an option for Fraser. I see little point in putting Kosi into the ruck where he isn't as effective as King or Gardi in the actaul hit out deparments (and if people say Kosi would be good at getting possesions around the ground, then why not put Blake in there).

Though Ross is the boss, and may well be seeing the ruck as an option for Kosi, though I just think sending Roo to a wing is more beneficial to the team in terms of keeping a better ruckman on the ground and giving G and Kosi the forward line.

[meher baba]

Even if Gehrig is fit, I would be very surprised if Lyon chose to go with the 3 talls playing permanently up front approach that some seem to want on here. It doesn't seem to gel with Lyon's preferred style of play.

from what we saw in the nab cup lyon's preferred style of play has changed, mainly because he recognises that we were the lowest scoring team in the competition last season and we have to do something to break the logjam.

i think you'll find that his new direction is swift and direct delivery to a tall, mobile forward line and that, if fit, all of riewoldt, gehrig, kosi and probably c gardiner will be in it with milne, schneider and occasionally dal santo, ball, montagna, harvey, xman etc picking up the crumbs.

i applaud it. we have the tall forwards to stretch the defences of virtually any backline in the competition and should not miss the chance to show up their mediocre resources.

it could be the aerially dominant forward line that changes the face of the game and i think that is the way we are heading this season.

Your view seems to be the consensus on this thread, but - unless it is based on inside information that I don't have access to - then I suspect it is wishful thinking rather than relating in any way to Lyon's actual thinking.

I still don't understand how we can fit the three tall forwards, C Gardiner, one crumber and 2 ruckmen into the same team without leaving ourselves seriously short in the midfield and backline.

If we leave out a specialist crumber, then we are expecting resting midfielders to do the job, leaving us short in the midfield (given that a crumber who spends much of the game outside the forward 50 is a crumber in name only).

If we have a full-time crumber, then we are likely to be light on for midfield rotations.

I think I am right about this.

[Oh When the Saints]

I reckon you are too meher baba.

I don't think Gehrig, Riewoldt, Koschitzke and Charlie Gardiner can operate in the same team, unless one of King or M. Gardiner is dropped and Kosi spends time in the ruck.

We need all the midfielders we can get IMO, and if we go in with 2 ruckmen and those 4 forwards, plus say Goose, Chips and Maxie in the backline, and then some of our other flankers, we will be light-on with midfield rotations.

Selection will be very interest and a difficult balancing act for RL. Glad it's not something I have to do!

[bigcarl]

Your view seems to be the consensus on this thread, but - unless it is based on inside information that I don't have access to - then I suspect it is wishful thinking rather than relating in any way to Lyon's actual thinking.

we'll find out very soon, but from what i've seen RL is deadly keen for his team to actually kick some goals this season.

he's on record at the AGM talking about a new game based on quick and direct ball movement down the "central corridor", which would indicate to me that we've decided to go in tall.

as i said, we'll find out on saturday night

[bigcarl]

I don't think Gehrig, Riewoldt, Koschitzke and Charlie Gardiner can operate in the same team, unless one of King or M. Gardiner is dropped and Kosi spends time in the ruck.

if kosi goes back in the ruck we'll once again have no-one down there who can take a contested mark and it will be back to the kick-it-to-roo-and-fraser scheme that didn't put a score on the board last season.

what would your round 1 team look like, just out of interests sake?

[bigcarl]

obviously injuries are going to play a big part in round 1 selection. max might not be right, fraser might not be right. bj might be considered ready. goose might be considered ready, so it is difficult.

B: Blake, Hudghton, L. Fisher
HB: Gilbert, Goose, Sam Fisher
C: X. Clarke, Hayes, Gram
HF: C. Gardiner, Riewoldt, Dal Santo (midfield rotation)
F: Milne, Kosi, Gehrig
Foll: King, Ball, Montagna
Int: Schneider, Harvey, BJ, M. Gardiner

Stiff: R. Clarke, Armitage, Geary, Fiora, CJ and probably a few others who have slipped my mind.

you can't play them all and, injuries being what they are, all will get their chance to shine during the gruelling marathon that is the season.

[bigcarl]

I still don't understand how we can fit the three tall forwards, C Gardiner, one crumber and 2 ruckmen into the same team without leaving ourselves seriously short in the midfield and backline.

so how would your team look, just out of interest?

[meher baba]

Assuming Gehrig is in, but Max is out - and noting that the Swans don't have a particularly impressive ruck division - the team I think will be selected for Round 1 is as follows

BACKS
S Fisher
L Fisher
Gilbert
Blake
Goddard
Gram


RUCKS
King
Kosi

MIDFIELD/WING
Harvey
Hayes
Montagna
Dal Santo
Ball
Armitage
Jones
Schneider
X Clarke
Fiora
Birss

FORWARDS
C Gardiner
Riewoldt
Gehrig

There is a slight chance that Raph might get in ahead of Fiora, but I wouldn't. I suppose Milne ahead of Birss is also a chance, but then we need to use Leigh Fisher as a stopper.

If Goose, Max and Baker were available, I would see them coming in ahead of Jones, Fiora and Birss (with Goddard and Blake moving into more midfield roles). Dempster for Leigh Fisher or (less likely) Blake is also a longer term possibility.

M Gardiner would come in for Gehrig when we are playing teams with threatening rucking units.

But what do I know?

[Ralphy]

Assuming Gehrig is in, but Max is out - and noting that the Swans don't have a particularly impressive ruck division - the team I think will be selected for Round 1 is as follows

BACKS
S Fisher
L Fisher
Gilbert
Blake
Goddard
Gram


RUCKS
King
Kosi

MIDFIELD/WING
Harvey
Hayes
Montagna
Dal Santo
Ball
Armitage
Jones
Schneider
X Clarke
Fiora
Birss

FORWARDS
C Gardiner
Riewoldt
Gehrig

There is a slight chance that Raph might get in ahead of Fiora, but I wouldn't. I suppose Milne ahead of Birss is also a chance, but then we need to use Leigh Fisher as a stopper.

If Goose, Max and Baker were available, I would see them coming in ahead of Jones, Fiora and Birss (with Goddard and Blake moving into more midfield roles). Dempster for Leigh Fisher or (less likely) Blake is also a longer term possibility.

M Gardiner would come in for Gehrig when we are playing teams with threatening rucking units.

But what do I know?

i dont agree.
kosi will be next to gehrig in the forward line most likely playing full forward to the ruck combo will be Gardy/King .

and i dont think Goddard will play round one. maybe round 2

[saintsRrising]

3 tall lumberers in the forward line? No too many...

But Roo is no lumberer and is very very mobile.

GTrain also has good mobility, though his tank is not what it was, but patrolling the FP area he does not need to have the biggest tank.

So that only leaves Kosi as a lumberer.


Charlie at 190cm is basically a "medium" rather than a "tall".

He has shown in the NAB that he has an excellent engine and can roam far and wide. I expect him to ease the load on Roo and to roam far and wide as a mini-Roo and in many ways will be playing as an extra roaming midfielder.

Roo to stay a bit closer to goal than he did in 2007.

GTrain to play FP....and Kosi to play out of FF between CHF and FF.


Given these 4 players strengths and weakness and where they will be playing I can see it working well.

Complementing the 3 talls will be two smalls in Milne and a resting mid.
Schneider to play wing running forward.


With Charlie more as floating midfielder it is then a 5 man forward line.

This leaves the forward line open....one for passing to the marking targets (and Milne is a good lead as well)....but also for long shots at goal by Gram and Dal.

BJ will be floating around the backline setting up play with his long kicking to pass to the various markets targets now nicely spread all over the ground.

When BJ kick in from FB not only will he have ruckman to aim at...but Charlie and Roo presently for 60m passes from the kick in.



Now Round 1 GTrain may not yet be fit....but the above is how I see Lyon wanting to structure up.

If GTrain is not available I think RL will go for our next best player, which will be an extra mid, rather than Allen who is not quite ready.

[bigcarl]

well said srr.

agree with virtually everything you wrote there