Make room for Ben Cousins?

[stinger]

All this talk of offering up some of our highest paid players has got me thinking about what's going to happen to Vanilla Ice next year?

my view on Cousins is probably shared by most- absolute failure of a human being BUT a 100% certified, proven champion footballer.

I think if the St Kilda FC is seriously in the business of winning football games and premierships- we must look at making room in our salary cap to have a crack at Cousins.
I would get over the loss of a Dal or Kosi if it brought us a player of Cousins calibre.

discuss.

flower me ffs.....

[Unforgiven]

Yes, no doubt about it. Will get us closer to a preimership. Would probably be the clubs best gut runner when Harvey goes. Might even let Dal Santo/Hayes run free without a tag. Proven Champion. Would have 3 or 4 years left in him.

If we are serious about having a flag, we can't just sit on our moral high horse and point the finger. Gardiner seems to be fine with us, Cousins would be on a simlar idea that he will have guidelines somewhat (enforced by AFL more so than the club).

[Saints Premiers 2008]

i doubt we would need to get rid of anyone...why would we???

we would surely have the space in the cap, if not i think that we could forgo an extra rookie to assist with it all...however this will not happen surely

wel'l find the dosh

[Dan Warna]

No evidence he's clean, no evidence he's fit, and at his age, no evidence he's match ready.

just because robert harvey played till he's 104 doesn't mean every player can do that. Michael voss, was finished at 30, dermie was finished at 28.

massive risk to waste draft picks on Cousins.

if we are to go after a troublesome player, kerr is 5 years younger than cousins, has been in the drug testing program for years, hasn't refused a drug test (cousins has refused a couple albeit sensationalised) and has far longer term than cousins.

nothing cousins can teach us about premierships, as we already have 3 premiership players at the club, and nothing cousins can teach us about hard work that harvey, burke and andy thomo amongst others can't do better and nothing he can teach us about courage that ball/hayes/harvey/burke can't.

I see only risk in picking up another player at the end of his career with nearly 2 years out from competition.

more likely to soak up time at the st kilda wing at the epworth than contribute on field.

[stinger]

i doubt we would need to get rid of anyone...why would we???

we would surely have the space in the cap, if not i think that we could forgo an extra rookie to assist with it all...however this will not happen surely

wel'l find the dosh

he's not going to be paid top dollar

[joffaboy]

No evidence he's clean, no evidence he's fit, and at his age, no evidence he's match ready.

just because robert harvey played till he's 104 doesn't mean every player can do that. Michael voss, was finished at 30, dermie was finished at 28.

massive risk to waste draft picks on Cousins.

if we are to go after a troublesome player, kerr is 5 years younger than cousins, has been in the drug testing program for years, hasn't refused a drug test (cousins has refused a couple albeit sensationalised) and has far longer term than cousins.

nothing cousins can teach us about premierships, as we already have 3 premiership players at the club, and nothing cousins can teach us about hard work that harvey, burke and andy thomo amongst others can't do better and nothing he can teach us about courage that ball/hayes/harvey/burke can't.

I see only risk in picking up another player at the end of his career with nearly 2 years out from competition.

more likely to soak up time at the st kilda wing at the epworth than contribute on field.

You have got to be joking.

Kerr only looked like a player when Judd and Cousins made him look good.

Cousins is twice the mid Kerr is. And to compare Cousins, an extremely fit midfielder to a KKP in Brereton and a battering ram in Voss is ludicrious in the extreme.

His physical fitness is fine. He needs to have beaten his addiction first before football is a consideration though.

to say he cant teach our mids anything is again ludicrious.

Geez you post some s.hite sometimes

[Dan Warna]

on what evidence do you have that cousins is fit? his word

i can't see what he can teach that harvey king or anyone we currently have a tthe club couldn't.

he' has hardly played in 2 years.

[Unforgiven]

No evidence he's clean, no evidence he's fit, and at his age, no evidence he's match ready.

just because robert harvey played till he's 104 doesn't mean every player can do that. Michael voss, was finished at 30, dermie was finished at 28.

massive risk to waste draft picks on Cousins.

.

You can just as easily say there is no evidence saying he isn't clean. I think it's more like than not, and actaully pretty evident he is fit. Match ready is a debatable topic, no doubt.

I think if he was to play, weather it be at the saints or not, he would have 3 or 4 years in him, I don't think health and fitness is an issue. Never had any ongoing injury issues, fit as a fiddle, still a fine specimen, and at the end of the day I wouldn't think he would go for a draft pick lower than 30-40 or anything.

Similarly to King, or Gardiner, I think the risk it worth it. Why pick up King if we arn't going to have an attempt at the flag. King still looks like he has another year or 2 in him, or untill we have another ruckman come through. I strongle beleive the time is now. I think cousins is ready, if we are gonna have a crack at a flag in the next few years, he is too good a player to pass up, worth the risk.

[Dan Warna]

No evidence he's clean, no evidence he's fit, and at his age, no evidence he's match ready.

just because robert harvey played till he's 104 doesn't mean every player can do that. Michael voss, was finished at 30, dermie was finished at 28.

massive risk to waste draft picks on Cousins.

.

You can just as easily say there is no evidence saying he isn't clean. I think it's more like than not, and actaully pretty evident he is fit. Match ready is a debatable topic, no doubt.

I think if he was to play, weather it be at the saints or not, he would have 3 or 4 years in him, I don't think health and fitness is an issue. Never had any ongoing injury issues, fit as a fiddle, still a fine specimen, and at the end of the day I wouldn't think he would go for a draft pick lower than 30-40 or anything.

Similarly to King, or Gardiner, I think the risk it worth it. Why pick up King if we arn't going to have an attempt at the flag. King still looks like he has another year or 2 in him, or untill we have another ruckman come through. I strongle beleive the time is now. I think cousins is ready, if we are gonna have a crack at a flag in the next few years, he is too good a player to pass up, worth the risk.

the onus is on him to prove he's clean, not for us to prove he's still addicted. and only a fool would take him on his word given he's lied before.

as for fitness, well what evidence is there that he's fit? has he done preseason training? is he training? how does that compare to match fitness?

MG has done nothing at st kilda, King came from winning a premiership at Geelong to st kilda and did most of the preseason, and is 2 years younger than Cousins.

[joffaboy]

You can just as easily say there MG has done nothing at st kilda, King came from winning a premiership at Geelong to st kilda and did most of the preseason, and is 2 years younger than Cousins.

Now you are comparing ruckmen to Cousins

Have you got even the tiniest clue of what you are talking about?

Your arguments are totally non sensicle.

Couldn't care less about him as a human, can he contribute to the club? As the best midfielder besides Judd in the league, as a premiership midfielder, as a quick skilled experienced midfielder, as a replacement for Rob Harvey, rotating off the bench for 60% of games???????

All a big fat tick.

Add to that the fact that he will cost SFA in dps and $$$$ and he would be a great pickup.

Anybody who cant see the benifits of the trade and wants to moralise and cast stones really doesn't know s.hite from clay about football.

[casey scorp]

massive risk to waste draft picks on Cousins.

I've never known of a draft where a club had to give up multiple picks for one selection.

He must be some player this B Cousins.

[Saint Mik]

With the way our current group of players are just going we need someone like Cousins.

Said it all before he would be a HUGE improvement to our onfield performances, shyte he would be in with a shot of the clubs B&F if he played 15 to 20 games.

Just get him Ross if you think it will help the club, would rather have him than not.

The risk is very well worth it, and as for Dan well he only likes players that are clean and drug free

How many players tested positive again this year???

[casey scorp]

massive risk to waste draft picks on Cousins.

I've never known of a draft where a club had to give up multiple picks for one selection.

He must be some player this B Cousins.

Unless we're going to get a couple of those ubiquitous Cousins (you've got your Cousins, your Kerrs etc)

[vacuous space]

In the US baseball, the Texas Rangers have a guy on staff who's job is to know where Josh Hamilton is at all times. I'm not saying that we have to go to that kind of measure with Cousins, but if we decide to bring him aboard, we need to look at every possible measure to make sure he stays clean and sober. We can't just take him at his word.

I'm not sure how much to believe of Hutchy's report. I wouldn't bet my house that Benny's coming here and I'm not sure the AFL will force him into the national draft (that's a pretty bizarre punishment). I'm pretty sure that once Ben nominates a club, the others will let him go. There's not much point in bringing aboard a malcontent with his kind of history.

I hope he gets back to full health and to the best of his ability. I'd love him to be able to do that here. He's a great player at his best and would be a great addition to our midfield.

[matrix]

if he was going to get picked up in the national im sure the team who gets he's services will be demanding him to prove he is clean (as would the afl) which would mean that he would have to have been off any illegal substances from about 3 months ago...if not longer.
any amphetamine stays in the system for quite a while.

so he would be clean now, prob has been since his last 'incident'....
he will come back and dominate.

its whether he can keep himself clean once he gets back into the swing of the afl routine....it wouldnt surprise me if he stayed clean as much as it wouldnt surprise me if he didnt.

[casey scorp]

I'm not sure the AFL will force him into the national draft (that's a pretty bizarre punishment).

There's no other way.

Correction - I now remember the Troy Broadbridge replacement (no draft)

[joffaboy]

I say let him take drugs.

Look it won us 14 gold medals last week, won the Brits 19, and suddenly everyone in Jamacia can sprint.

Couldn't care less if he was clean or not. As long as he plays well and doesn't get caught.

[matrix]

WTF????

so our medals are drug tainted??

somehow i dont think so.

[vacuous space]

I'm not sure the AFL will force him into the national draft (that's a pretty bizarre punishment).

There's no other way.

There is. He could be allowed to train with his nominated club and then enter into the PSD. That would mean the club taking him on could sign him up to agreed terms rather than a fixed two-year contract.

[casey scorp]

I'm not sure the AFL will force him into the national draft (that's a pretty bizarre punishment).

There's no other way.

There is. He could be allowed to train with his nominated club and then enter into the PSD. That would mean the club taking him on could sign him up to agreed terms rather than a fixed two-year contract.

He would still has to go through the draft process, and a club with an earlier pick can meet his terms and draft him.

[vacuous space]

He would still has to go through the draft process, and a club with an earlier pick can meet his terms and draft him.

They could. But if Benny's been training for a couple of months with his nominated team, do you think somebody's going to swoop in and grab him against his will? I don't think they would. It's special circumstances, and I reckon once he chooses his team, everyone will get out his way. I don't think it's in anybody's interests to make this any messier than it has to be.

[Red]

The guy is an absolute star. Has had his problems but is getting over them.

Contrary to what Dan Warna has said earlier he has being tested by the AFL

this year as well as psyche tests and the rest on his own coin. He wants to

leave the game as someone who did more than screw up his life.

I would take him in a second. I would rather take a player who I know can

play, than someone who might be able to. The draft isn't all what it is made

up top be.

[ausfatcat]

The guy is an absolute star. Has had his problems but is getting over them.

Contrary to what Dan Warna has said earlier he has being tested by the AFL

this year as well as psyche tests and the rest on his own coin. He wants to

leave the game as someone who did more than screw up his life.

I would take him in a second. I would rather take a player who I know can

play, than someone who might be able to. The draft isn't all what it is made

up top be.

I thin the point is he's been getting "over" these problem for several years now.

Just think about some of the strange things he has done this year.


Boxing bout to beat drugs - withdrew at the last minute
Didn't attend rehab as was organised
Agreed to train with Port Melbourne - pulled out at the last minute
Partying with teenages in front of camera's


Does this sound like a person getting over his problems?

Where did you get this "he's being test by the AFL" from?

As stated be others in this thread you can't take him at his word that has been proven at his previous club, what it comes down to is no one knows if he is life sort or not.

[markp]

massive risk to waste draft picks on Cousins.

I've never known of a draft where a club had to give up multiple picks for one selection.

He must be some player this B Cousins.

One pick for him, one for his ego, and another for all his baggage maybe?!

[WayneJudson42]

I'll leave it up to the coaching panel to make the call. They are in the best place to pass judgement, and I have no doubt that they will do their due dilligence accordingly.

As for BC... should he decide to play, I'm sure that it will be because he wants to redeem himself and prove something to himself. Therefore, if he does, I reckon he'll be 100% fired up... the money won't be a factor coz he won't demand much.

He's copped a lot of shyte and ridicule... justifiably so. BUT everyone deserves a 2nd crack in life (no pun intended). Look at MG.

I also wonder if MG had a hand in this given his experience at the club??

Fact is that with 35 retiring, we have no one ready to fill his shoes atm. Armo is still a year or two away... and Kerr is beyond our capacity given what WCE will want for him.

We seem to have a good core atm, and should still be in the hunt over the next 3 years. Problem that I see is that even if we draft all kids this year, the top 6 in our team may be too old when the kids are ready.

Picking up BC for little cost would be worth the risk IMO. Very handy until we can develop the kids.

To simply draft kids and play them will result in a short term slide / rebuild, and players such as Roo and Dal will become the next Loewe and Burke.