No hope for a flag next year without Cousins

[JeffDunne]

Now Con, could you please do me a favour and explain how in God's name you read my post as "don't talk about Ben" because it has me stuffed?

[JeffDunne]

The guy is an absolute gun and seemingly on the mend, surely it's understandable if people find the prospect of him grabbing his chance with us as a little tantalizing?

No doubt.

But as tantalizing as it is, let's at least try and keep some sort of perspective.

[joffaboy]

I must admit I'm surprised at the love Ben is getting here of late.

Face it, until he proves otherwise he's a pretty ordinary sort of bloke. There's plenty of evidence to back up that observation and most of it has little to do with drugs.

Do I want him to play for St Kilda?

If he's off the blow and in the right frame of mind then why not?

But for christ sake can we stop blowing wind up his arse until he actually does something worthy of praise?

Agreed however I think most of the"love" as you put it has more to do with a defence against the intolerance shown toward someone who is a recovering addict.

I had just as much fun as anybody with the "run Benny run" issue a few years back. This is before anyone knew he was a full blown addict - just thought he was a rec using d**khead.

Now the bloke has been battling his addiction for 12 months. Has been upfront and seems contrite and want to get his health, both mental and physical back on track and hopefully for life.

the common theme from the anti Cousins group is

1) he will reoffend and this will reflect on our club - I dont see how. Its not as though it was the Saints that sat on its hands while he became an addict -by all accounts the Saints want to actively assist in his rehabilitation and have impressed Cousins manager with the details. Also we took on Gardiner and he has not transgressed.

2) he will be a bad influence on the kids. - If anyone believes that the young men at the Saints have not been exposed to illicit drugs in their lifetimes be it at the Saints or outside the club is kidding themselves. And the inference is that Cousins will drag down the kids to his level of addiction hell, and that he will start dealing to the kids.

I have more faith in the strong leadership of the players and the clubs recent ability to deal with extreme issues (Milne/Montagna, drafting Gardiner etc)

3) That at 30 Cousins is past it - That to me is the only true reservation. Lets look at this in a football sense not a moral crusade that some have made it into.

I have faith in Rossy, the leadership group, and the processes put in place to deal with Ben Cousins. From what the club has shown from the early days of Grant Thomas to now is that a strong off field culture has evolved and worked on. This is the take I have on the Benny "love".

[evertonfc]

Do I want him to play for St Kilda?

Maybe you're undecided, but I'm endorsing that the club get him on board.

[JeffDunne]

JB, the issues I have with Ben and any influence he might have has little to do with drugs.

Drugs are everywhere. Melbourne especially so.

I agree for the most part with what you're saying but I still have my doubts around the whole recovering addict story. No doubt Ben was hitting it hard and got out of control, but sometimes that's more an access issue than it is a sign of a hardcore addict. I've known plenty of people to get into "stuff", hit it hard for 12 months until they are out of control, then essentially go cold turkey and move to another phase of their life.

FWIW, I'm yet to here Ben actually admit to anything.

[JeffDunne]

Do I want him to play for St Kilda?

Maybe you're undecided, but I'm endorsing that the club get him on board.

Based on what information?

Personally, the only endorsements I'm interested in are those of people with all the information at hand.

[joffaboy]

JB, the issues I have with Ben and any influence he might have has little to do with drugs.

Drugs are everywhere. Melbourne especially so.

I agree for the most part with what you're saying but I still have my doubts around the whole recovering addict story. No doubt Ben was hitting it hard and got out of control, but sometimes that's more an access issue than it is a sign of a hardcore addict. I've known plenty of people to get into "stuff", hit it hard for 12 months until they are out of control, then essentially go cold turkey and move to another phase of their life.

FWIW, I'm yet to here Ben actually admit to anything.

yeah fair enough. I am just going on what is public.

[Con Gorozidis]

Now Con, could you please do me a favour and explain how in God's name you read my post as "don't talk about Ben" because it has me stuffed?

dunno. i probably just made it up. how can anyone be expected to read your posts with that avatar. i cant concentrate. i can only see the chick. cant see anything else

but after re-reading your comments - they all seem fair and reasonable. its certainly going to be a prickly one. very risky.

but thats what being a sainter is all about. we always go for the romantic feel good story (ben recovers, wins flag, helps kids get off the junk blah blah ).

we hired malcolm blight ffs.

i for one keep fantasising about him bursting through the centre and putting it down riewoldts throat.....

but it could all be fantasy..



so yeah. i agree it could be a big risk by just creating a media circus and a distraction. just hope he has grown out of it and doesnt wat to go back down that path.... time will tell. the afl have to agree to let him play first. that is no certainty...

[evertonfc]

Do I want him to play for St Kilda?

Maybe you're undecided, but I'm endorsing that the club get him on board.

Based on what information?

The information publicly available and what I've been able to get a hold of otherwise.

After carefully considering it, I'm more than happy to ensorse Ben Cousins joining the club. I don't need to elaborate further.

Needless to say, I'm glad the club has put the steps in place for him to have a successful period with St Kilda.

[markp]

The guy is an absolute gun and seemingly on the mend, surely it's understandable if people find the prospect of him grabbing his chance with us as a little tantalizing?

No doubt.

But as tantalizing as it is, let's at least try and keep some sort of perspective.

If we sign him I don't think there'll be much chance of that....


30 or not, he will be our biggest established player pick-up since Hamill and Gehrig.

[jonesy]

of all the hundreds of afl players that have taken drugs over the last decade, cuz is the only one ever to actually be punished.

So, you know something the rest of don't? Hundreds?

Hundreds is correct on the law of averages from what I've seen,so yes...hundreds

[maverick]

I agree with some of the reservations on here, and as JD says, I like many others may be romancing a little on how good he is.

I for one couldn't care less what the bloke is like, just that he plays footy and I suppose the club is strong enough to control him.

What i do believe however, is that without him, we will not make the top 4, let alone stand a chance next year, without someone of his perceived calibre. Harvs finished top 5 B&F this year we need someone to replace him to maintain our spot, which was proven to be short of premiership material.

I want him to believe we are a chance.

[St DAC]

Hundreds is correct on the law of averages from what I've seen, so yes...hundreds

Law of averages huh? Average as to who? Professional athletes? The great unwashed? Social workers? Teachers? Collingwood supporters?

Sounds like you're plucking that number out of your exit hole to me. How many have actually tested positive that are known about? It's less than 20 isn't it? With all the peer review, leadership groups. testing, coaches and the fact the players' bodies are their tool of trade, claiming hundreds without any corroborating evidence is bulltish.

IMO of course.

[jonesy]

agree to disagree

[markp]

FWIW, I'm yet to here Ben actually admit to anything.

http://www.realfooty.com.au/news/news/s ... 94876.html

"I would like to address the fact that I am overcoming drug addiction. It is an ongoing process," he said. "Contrary to media reports, I am a lot further down the track in my rehabilitation than has been reported."

For the first time, he made a full apology for his dramatic behaviour over the past year. In March, Cousins spent a month in a drug rehabilitation clinic in California and he missed the first half of the AFL season despite making a mid-season comeback for the Eagles. He was sacked by the club last month after being arrested by West Australian police over drug-related charges. Those charges have since been dropped.

"I would like to apologise to the AFL, the players and supporters for the embarrassment my conduct has brought to the game," Cousins said.

[saintbob]

And if Jack Steven was the great white hope that many posters on here think he is, he would have played by now...

While we've got blokes like Eddy and Geary... even Jones, in the mix for selection, we are going nowhere fast. They really do look like pretty ordinary players from what I've seen. In fact, I can't think of any decent new recruits since Sam Fisher...

Jack Steven should have played his first game in the Preliminary Final against the Hawks.
He's hard at it and knows where to go to get the ball, but for reasons unknow to all football supporters RL decided to play Marshmellow Man (Aaron Fiora) against one of the hardest teams in '08.

Steven's will play from round one next year, barring injury of course.

Benny will be a great fit in our midfield, with the loss of Harvs.

[RodKeoghsLoveChild]

I must admit I'm surprised at the love Ben is getting here of late.

Face it, until he proves otherwise he's a pretty ordinary sort of bloke. There's plenty of evidence to back up that observation and most of it has little to do with drugs.

Do I want him to play for St Kilda?

If he's off the blow and in the right frame of mind then why not?

But for christ sake can we stop blowing wind up his arse until he actually does something worthy of praise?

yeah. spot on. lets top talking about this bloke. lets wait until he does something worthy . im not going to even say a word until he wins a flag, gets all australian, wins the b + f, and wins a brownlow....

until he does all those things - hes a dud! useless!

The bums not even going to win the coleman medal?? Useless!!

[mightysainters]

i actually totally agree, we lack a gun in the midfield... with hayes, ball, cousins, dal santo, montagna, goddard and gram in the middle we look like one of the best midfield teams in the country

[saintspremiers]

And if Jack Steven was the great white hope that many posters on here think he is, he would have played by now...

While we've got blokes like Eddy and Geary... even Jones, in the mix for selection, we are going nowhere fast. They really do look like pretty ordinary players from what I've seen. In fact, I can't think of any decent new recruits since Sam Fisher...

Jack Steven should have played his first game in the Preliminary Final against the Hawks.
He's hard at it and knows where to go to get the ball, but for reasons unknow to all football supporters RL decided to play Marshmellow Man (Aaron Fiora) against one of the hardest teams in '08.

Steven's will play from round one next year, barring injury of course.

Benny will be a great fit in our midfield, with the loss of Harvs.

whatever.

So you play Steven in his FIRST game of footy in a Prelim?

FFS it's not 1983 or whenever when a bloke called Dermie debuted for the Hawks in a final!

I'm not a Fiora fan, but I'd far prefer an established player coming in than a newbie teenager for a big final.

Get a grip!

[saintbob]

And if Jack Steven was the great white hope that many posters on here think he is, he would have played by now...

While we've got blokes like Eddy and Geary... even Jones, in the mix for selection, we are going nowhere fast. They really do look like pretty ordinary players from what I've seen. In fact, I can't think of any decent new recruits since Sam Fisher...

Jack Steven should have played his first game in the Preliminary Final against the Hawks.
He's hard at it and knows where to go to get the ball, but for reasons unknow to all football supporters RL decided to play Marshmellow Man (Aaron Fiora) against one of the hardest teams in '08.

Steven's will play from round one next year, barring injury of course.

Benny will be a great fit in our midfield, with the loss of Harvs.

whatever.

So you play Steven in his FIRST game of footy in a Prelim?

FFS it's not 1983 or whenever when a bloke called Dermie debuted for the Hawks in a final!

I'm not a Fiora fan, but I'd far prefer an established player coming in than a newbie teenager for a big final.

Get a grip!

I would play YOU ahead of Fiora as you'd probably sleep with the light on, just like him!!!

The fact that it was a final shouldn't matter, the kid is ready to play.

Where as FIORA would have struggled to get a game at Melbourne this year, and it was the worst selection going into a final since 1983.