Jack Watts

[BigMart]

Yes he has

[battye]

Usually guys with immense talent show something early...

I agree.

When was the last time St Kilda had a player like this?

And don't say Newnes, I just can't believe the hype surrounding him after a handful of average performances. "Not far off A Grade" someone said

[The Redeemer]

Usually guys with immense talent show something early...

I agree.

When was the last time St Kilda had a player like this?

And don't say Newnes, I just can't believe the hype surrounding him after a handful of average performances. "Not far off A Grade" someone said

Newnes has shown 2/5th of bugger all thus far.

He kicked it well against GWS a few times last season though.

[BigMart]

Vs Sydney

18 kicks
16 HB
11 Marks

Not a bad game?

[The Redeemer]

Vs Sydney

18 kicks
16 HB
11 Marks

Not a bad game?

Jack Watts or Jack Newnes?

[Bernard Shakey]

Watts will be a gun. He just needs the right environment. What mentoring has he had at Melbourne?
Can you imagine how good it would be for him to play with Roo and Lenny?

[The Redeemer]

Watts will be a gun. He just needs the right environment. What mentoring has he had at Melbourne?
Can you imagine how good it would be for him to play with Roo and Lenny?

Agreed.

Thanks for the cheap Number 1 pick that has already done the gym stuff and has played 50 games.

We need to be ruthless here and rape and pillage what we can

[I Love Peter Kiel]

I know for a fact that he followed the Saints as a kid. His dad's a great Saints supporter.

[The Redeemer]

I know for a fact that he followed the Saints as a kid. His dad's a great Saints supporter.

BJ was a Carlton supporter growing up

[Scollop]

Watts will be a gun. He just needs the right environment. What mentoring has he had at Melbourne?
Can you imagine how good it would be for him to play with Roo and Lenny?

Agreed.

Thanks for the cheap Number 1 pick that has already done the gym stuff and has played 50 games.

We need to be ruthless here and rape and pillage what we can

We won't be alone and the lure from his ex team mates who also deserted the Demons might be stronger. We need to be smart. Our people need to have a coffee with his people. A St Kilda player needs to sound him out and we need to get in his ear before others do

[I Love Peter Kiel]

I know for a fact that he followed the Saints as a kid. His dad's a great Saints supporter.

BJ was a Carlton supporter growing up

Yes, and he left us for 30 pieces of silver.

[skeptic]

I know for a fact that he followed the Saints as a kid. His dad's a great Saints supporter.

BJ was a Carlton supporter growing up

Yes, and he left us for 30 pieces of silver.

a little more than 30

[gringo]

I would take him but I wouldn't give any thing but a second round pick or similar. He's not shown much. He has had a couple of ok games down back but he looked a bit like Zac Dawson at times down there- more an oversized tagger than a KPB.

[andrewg]

Ferguson..... Yes
Minchington.... Yes
Murdoch...... Yes

Markworth..... Likely
Dunnell........ Perhaps he'll turn out an OK player
Curran........ As above
Ledger......... Doubtful to be honest, he has something, but is missing something
Lee and Hickey ....... Haven't seen enough of them

Lever, Webster, Staley, Shenton..... Not likely... Perhaps there's still an opportunity for them. They need to take another step in 2013

White ...... Perhaps the biggest upside with Markworth. But could flop like Markworth. Both are potential guns.

Ross ....... Will be about as good as Armo/Geary.... Solid B Grade

Newnes..... Not far off A Grade
Wright ...... If he can get his disposal right, as above
Siposs...... All to do with attitude and fitness.... Not the star we are making out.

I think your wrong about Ross. He is a clearance player and can win ball above his head at stoppages. makes good decisions when he gets i and just seems to get it. He will be an A grader..........

[gringo]

Ferguson..... Yes
Minchington.... Yes
Murdoch...... Yes

Markworth..... Likely
Dunnell........ Perhaps he'll turn out an OK player
Curran........ As above
Ledger......... Doubtful to be honest, he has something, but is missing something
Lee and Hickey ....... Haven't seen enough of them

Lever, Webster, Staley, Shenton..... Not likely... Perhaps there's still an opportunity for them. They need to take another step in 2013

White ...... Perhaps the biggest upside with Markworth. But could flop like Markworth. Both are potential guns.

Ross ....... Will be about as good as Armo/Geary.... Solid B Grade

Newnes..... Not far off A Grade
Wright ...... If he can get his disposal right, as above
Siposs...... All to do with attitude and fitness.... Not the star we are making out.

I think your wrong about Ross. He is a clearance player and can win ball above his head at stoppages. makes good decisions when he gets i and just seems to get it. He will be an A grader..........

i would have thought it's a bit early on Siposs- he isn't Goddard after 2 years in the system so he's not going to be a star? Newnes possibly over rated he's still got a long way for a grade. Webster sounds like his body is letting him play to his potential. Markworth being a flop is harsh- his knee went just when it was time to get picked. I really liked Saunders highlights too, I'm hoping he gets going too.

[BigMart]

I was referring to their potential from what I've seen.... Not where they are now!

Ross is too slow to be an A Grader, he runs on a treadmill.... And not skilled enough. He isn't even assured to make it. But hopefully he makes it.

[gringo]

I was referring to their potential from what I've seen.... Not where they are now!

Ross is too slow to be an A Grader, he runs on a treadmill.... And not skilled enough. He isn't even assured to make it. But hopefully he makes it.

I'm not sure he's slower than Sam Mitchell.

[The Redeemer]

I was referring to their potential from what I've seen.... Not where they are now!

Ross is too slow to be an A Grader, he runs on a treadmill.... And not skilled enough. He isn't even assured to make it. But hopefully he makes it.

I'm not sure he's slower than Sam Mitchell.

That is but one example of a slow, small guy making it.

Just one example.

Therefore there are hundred and thousands of players with similar builds that have not.

[BigMart]

Sam Mitchell is an interesting one

Given all of his pedigree

Something like 9 straight comp best and fairests at every level but still overlooked for being too slow. Then taken by hawthorn at pick 36 after playing VFL and again winning the league B&F.

He then won the Rising Star, Hawthorn B&F 3 times and has been AA and Hawthorn premiership captain. All after not even getting drafted initially, then going one selection before Joey.

I am not sure Seb can be compared to Sam..... When you do have an obvious deficiency, you need to have other attributes to overcome it.... Sam is the diesel Williams of this generation. A freak. Seb is not a freak, he's just a reasonable footballer, with limitations like Armo. Nothing wrong with being a reasonable AFL level footballer.

[plugger66]

Sam Mitchell is an interesting one

Given all of his pedigree

Something like 9 straight comp best and fairests at every level but still overlooked for being too slow. Then taken by hawthorn at pick 36 after playing VFL and again winning the league B&F.

He then won the Rising Star, Hawthorn B&F 3 times and has been AA and Hawthorn premiership captain. All after not even getting drafted initially, then going one selection before Joey.

I am not sure Seb can be compared to Sam..... When you do have an obvious deficiency, you need to have other attributes to overcome it.... Sam is the diesel Williams of this generation. A freak. Seb is not a freak, he's just a reasonable footballer, with limitations like Armo. Nothing wrong with being a reasonable AFL level footballer.

Im unsure why you are so keen to retire lenny after a whole 2 rounds and play a guy you think will be a B grader at best. You do confuse me sometimes.

[BigMart]

I am not keen for Lenny to retire (dread the day), just realistic about where the team and Lenny are at.... I understand that there comes a time when the baton needs to be passed on, and an opportunity given to someone else......

BTW....Do you think Lenny is an A Grade mid still?

He was the best performed at StK in 2012.... That says more about StK 2012 than anything else, and why we are on the nose as a list.........Was he in the best 12 in the comp?

Swan, Ablett, Pendlebury, Dangerfield, Cotchin, Murphy, Judd, Watson, Mitchell, Jack, Fyfe, Kennedy, Selwood, are A grade mids IMO
Beams, A Swallow, Boak, Rockliff are not far behind..

Seb needs to be developed, at the moment he is D grade... Playing consistently in the VFL for two more years will stifle him.

[plugger66]

I am not keen for Lenny to retire (dread the day), just realistic about where the team and Lenny are at.... I understand that there comes a time when the baton needs to be passed on, and an opportunity given to someone else......

BTW....Do you think Lenny is an A Grade mid still?

He was the best performed at StK in 2012.... That says more about StK 2012 than anything else, and why we are on the nose as a list.........Was he in the best 12 in the comp?

Swan, Ablett, Pendlebury, Dangerfield, Cotchin, Murphy, Judd, Watson, Mitchell, Jack, Fyfe, Kennedy, Selwood, are A grade mids IMO
Beams, A Swallow, Boak, Rockliff are not far behind..

Seb needs to be developed, at the moment he is D grade... Playing consistently in the VFL for two more years will stifle him.

I think Lenny was last year very close to an A grade mid. may have still been A grade. Made the top 40 in the AA side so that suggests he was very close. And he was given another year this year which you said you agreed but after 2 games you want him to retire. Can I ask what was the point of giving him another year if 2 games in he should finish at the end of the year? Lets wait until round 12 before we decide he iant good enough. And you said the exact same thing last year so why is it different this year?

And Seb can play if he is good enough. If Lenny doesnt play the next 5 weeks it doesnt even mean Seb plays because you say he is D grade. Doesnt sound like someone close to playing.

[BigMart]

There comes a time when a tough management decision needs to be made. Blight made one in 1996.

Watters and Pelchin in 2012... Although they had little choice probably.
Hall and Everitt were big calls

Great leaders make tough decisions

A year is a long time in footy, players go to the next level (eg Armo) or fall off the perch....

Plugger called it quits in 1999 at 33yo having kicked 80 goals..... Not because his season prior was ordinary, but because he knew his next season was going to be harder to maintain that level....

If Lenny wins the B&F this year.... Nick Dal and Joey should be traded.... Because it will be an indictment on them.... Armo, Jack and Ben to a lesser degree.... And I for one would be disappointed.

Not sure the benefit of having a 34yo running around competing hard and keeping somewhat competitive in games whilst being in the bottom 4. We need to search for the players who are going to help us climb up the ladder, and provide them with development opportunity.... Lenny ain't gonna improve, that's for sure....

Little story
I showed the door to my best player in 2003 because he was Ill disciplined.... The players said, you can't do that he's the club champion..... And I said, we lost with him, we can lose without him... And we weren't going to improve as a team whilst we relied on players anyway (like the Peter Everitt scenario) ... Following season we played in the GF (lost) three players stepped up to the next level. From then on, the team knew it wasn't about individuals... It's about the collective.

The link has nothing to do with the reason he left, but what the rest of the group did to compensate.... They improved.

[CURLY]

There comes a time when a tough management decision needs to be made. Blight made one in 1996.

Watters and Pelchin in 2012... Although they had little choice probably.
Hall and Everitt were big calls

Great leaders make tough decisions

A year is a long time in footy, players go to the next level (eg Armo) or fall off the perch....

Plugger called it quits in 1999 at 33yo having kicked 80 goals..... Not because his season prior was ordinary, but because he knew his next season was going to be harder to maintain that level....

If Lenny wins the B&F this year.... Nick Dal and Joey should be traded.... Because it will be an indictment on them.... Armo, Jack and Ben to a lesser degree.... And I for one would be disappointed.

Not sure the benefit of having a 34yo running around competing hard and keeping somewhat competitive in games whilst being in the bottom 4. We need to search for the players who are going to help us climb up the ladder, and provide them with development opportunity.... Lenny ain't gonna improve, that's for sure....

Little story
I showed the door to my best player in 2003 because he was Ill disciplined.... The players said, you can't do that he's the club champion..... And I said, we lost with him, we can lose without him... And we weren't going to improve as a team whilst we relied on players anyway (like the Peter Everitt scenario) ... Following season we played in the GF (lost) three players stepped up to the next level. From then on, the team knew it wasn't about individuals... It's about the collective.

The link has nothing to do with the reason he left, but what the rest of the group did to compensate.... They improved.

Fantastic Under 12's are very responsive though arent they.

[plugger66]

There comes a time when a tough management decision needs to be made. Blight made one in 1996.

Watters and Pelchin in 2012... Although they had little choice probably.
Hall and Everitt were big calls

Great leaders make tough decisions

A year is a long time in footy, players go to the next level (eg Armo) or fall off the perch....

Plugger called it quits in 1999 at 33yo having kicked 80 goals..... Not because his season prior was ordinary, but because he knew his next season was going to be harder to maintain that level....

If Lenny wins the B&F this year.... Nick Dal and Joey should be traded.... Because it will be an indictment on them.... Armo, Jack and Ben to a lesser degree.... And I for one would be disappointed.

Not sure the benefit of having a 34yo running around competing hard and keeping somewhat competitive in games whilst being in the bottom 4. We need to search for the players who are going to help us climb up the ladder, and provide them with development opportunity.... Lenny ain't gonna improve, that's for sure....

Little story
I showed the door to my best player in 2003 because he was Ill disciplined.... The players said, you can't do that he's the club champion..... And I said, we lost with him, we can lose without him... And we weren't going to improve as a team whilst we relied on players anyway (like the Peter Everitt scenario) ... Following season we played in the GF (lost) three players stepped up to the next level. From then on, the team knew it wasn't about individuals... It's about the collective.

The link has nothing to do with the reason he left, but what the rest of the group did to compensate.... They improved.

So all this occurred in 2 games. And why do Dal and Joey get traded this year but not last year? Is there some magical age where someone can not be better than someone else?

And can I say I have never heard a local footballer been shown the door unless they basically murder someone. You are a really tough coach. Have no idea what the story has to do with Lenny unless you know he has been undisciplined but thanks for telling us.