And so it begins

[Teflon]

How do you know the next coach will be any good - maybe they’ll be worse

My grand plan

Add quality to the list

Go hard for two FAs to start with

Draft 3 kids again

Do 1 trade

That’s 6 new players on the list - 4 in the senior team

That will change results more than who is assistant coach

How do you know the 6 players will be any better than the 6 they have replaced.

Replacing players, replacing coaches, it's all a lottery, a lottery this club is not very good at.

I’m trying reverse BM...
Players are overrated...
Coaches win matches...

[Wayne42]

How do you know the next coach will be any good - maybe they’ll be worse

My grand plan

Add quality to the list

Go hard for two FAs to start with

Draft 3 kids again

Do 1 trade

That’s 6 new players on the list - 4 in the senior team

That will change results more than who is assistant coach

How do you know the 6 players will be any better than the 6 they have replaced.

Replacing players, replacing coaches, it's all a lottery, a lottery this club is not very good at.

I’m trying reverse BM...
Players are overrated...
Coaches win matches...

[B.M]

Was Brad Crouch any good?

Was Windhager Owens or Milera any Good?

Players have the greatest impact

You MUST turn

And NO I did not say RELOCATE to Tasmania

Stop speaking s***

I said I would take the ‘Eddie Deal’ in a heartbeat to ensure not only the survival of the club but let me finally see a bit of success!
The deal was that good it’ll never be offered

As far as the name goes
I follow the colours, the jumper, a team based at Moorabbin
I don’t follow a team in the suburb of StKilda or give two fks what they are called

If it were Moorabbin Saints I wouldn’t give a s***

Footscray did NOT win the 2016 AFL premiership
The Western Bulldogs did
Do you think their fans gave a s*** about that??!!

Hang on to a s*** history or move forward

[cwrcyn]

Good time for Lenny Hayes to return

[axcellence]

Good time for Lenny Hayes to return

He did a tree change and isn't coaching anywhere else in AFL.

[Jacks Back]

Seems strange timing. We are, after all, still in the finals race.

[Devilhead]

Was Brad Crouch any good?

Was Windhager Owens or Milera any Good?

Players have the greatest impact

You MUST turn

And NO I did not say RELOCATE to Tasmania

Stop speaking s***

I said I would take the ‘Eddie Deal’ in a heartbeat to ensure not only the survival of the club but let me finally see a bit of success!
The deal was that good it’ll never be offered

As far as the name goes
I follow the colours, the jumper, a team based at Moorabbin
I don’t follow a team in the suburb of StKilda or give two fks what they are called

If it were Moorabbin Saints I wouldn’t give a s***

Footscray did NOT win the 2016 AFL premiership
The Western Bulldogs did
Do you think their fans gave a s*** about that??!!

Hang on to a s*** history or move forward

So if we moved to Timbuktu you wouldn't give a hoot

The Eddie deal is friggin joke .... if you believe that it would stay like that for all time you are an idiot ...... sell your soul for non-guaranteed success

Bulldogs didn't move base .... and they don't play a clutch of home games in another state

Let's face it ..... a large part of your heart resides in Tassie .... on the other hand the majority of Saint fans don't give a flying fk about Tassie ...... as much as you want it ..... it ain't happenin

[saintsRrising]

Oh goody!!!

New assistant coaches

That’ll solve everything!!!!

This is just silly.

You do not just improve coaching

You do not just improve the playing list.


It is not at all the situation that you only improve one facet, or that one facet will be enough.

It is not the case in business.

It is not the case in one's personal life.

And it sure as hell is not the case in AFL.

We need to improve everything, as right here and now we as a team, as a club are not good enough.

And that means everything including player development, admin etc.

[Yorkeys]

Well the 1000 mile journey starts with...

Crouch, Hill, Jones, Steele, Ross, NWM. To put it mildly, a diverse group football-wise. Be a challenge to get them and their various traits on the same page.
Your mission, should you accept it......

[cwrcyn]

Why should we assume that this is a bad thing? It might be a positive.

[older saint]

Couple points not mentioned or i missed:
- In august all assistant coaches must be informed what is happening for next year. Therefore over the next few weeks will see more and more of this
- I read that he was returning to Mildura. In the article it inferred this was a family decision.

Sheedy kept himself fresh and his group fresh at Essendon for over 20 + years by changing assistant coaches every 4 -5 years. Surely things aren't that different now

[nobhead]

Imo be good if dal ,joey, or roo could come back and give saints a chop out as an assistant coach .

[D.B.Cooper]

I attended a lunch many years ago where Barassi was a key speaker.

On coaching he said something along the lines of a great coach can’t turn a poor team into a premiership team.

But plenty of great teams don’t win a flag and that’s where the coach can make a difference.

The best list I have seen at StKilda was 04 & 05 and we couldn’t make a GF. The next best group was 09 & 10 and we couldn’t win it.

Would a great coach have made a difference?

Whilst I think B.M slightly under values the coach, there is no doubt a great coach in invaluable as long as you have the list, board, club, fitness department & everything else working in harmony.

[wally]

I think in regard to timing there is a rule made that all assistants have to be told if they are staying next year, so that they can make future decisions and not be dumped when all the jobs are gone.

[WellardSaint]

I attended a lunch many years ago where Barassi was a key speaker.

On coaching he said something along the lines of a great coach can’t turn a poor team into a premiership team.

But plenty of great teams don’t win a flag and that’s where the coach can make a difference.

The best list I have seen at StKilda was 04 & 05 and we couldn’t make a GF. The next best group was 09 & 10 and we couldn’t win it.

Would a great coach have made a difference?

Whilst I think B.M slightly under values the coach, there is no doubt a great coach in invaluable as long as you have the list, board, club, fitness department & everything else working in harmony.

40 yrs ago, technology, sports science, psychology, medical science were all very different.
Can't compare that era to our current era.

Would be like comparing pre-WW1 economy to our current economy

[Vortex]

How do you know the next coach will be any good - maybe they’ll be worse

My grand plan

Add quality to the list

Go hard for two FAs to start with

Draft 3 kids again

Do 1 trade

That’s 6 new players on the list - 4 in the senior team

That will change results more than who is assistant coach

How do you know the 6 players will be any better than the 6 they have replaced.

Replacing players, replacing coaches, it's all a lottery, a lottery this club is not very good at.

I’m trying reverse BM...
Players are overrated...
Coaches win matches...

There is no doubt the coach is important to player development and credit where its due with regards to Sharman. Sharman really looked way off the pace a few weeks ago but Ratts showed his genius by turning him into a backline player in just 3 games and is another genuine swingman now.

How do you think Sharman will go against Hawkins and Cameron or do think if he struggles on those two will Ratts swing him up forward and see what he learnt as backline player?

[older saint]

I attended a lunch many years ago where Barassi was a key speaker.

On coaching he said something along the lines of a great coach can’t turn a poor team into a premiership team.

But plenty of great teams don’t win a flag and that’s where the coach can make a difference.

The best list I have seen at StKilda was 04 & 05 and we couldn’t make a GF. The next best group was 09 & 10 and we couldn’t win it.

Would a great coach have made a difference?

Whilst I think B.M slightly under values the coach, there is no doubt a great coach in invaluable as long as you have the list, board, club, fitness department & everything else working in harmony.

09 if players kick straight we win does that then mean Lyon a better coach? NO IMO.
Many don't like him due to how he left however took 2 historical basket case clubs to 3 GF's (plus a draw), - Nealry over achieved in 2010 and 09 and 13 ran into dynasty teams

[meher baba]

How do you know the next coach will be any good - maybe they’ll be worse

My grand plan

Add quality to the list

Go hard for two FAs to start with

Draft 3 kids again

Do 1 trade

That’s 6 new players on the list - 4 in the senior team

That will change results more than who is assistant coach

How do you know the 6 players will be any better than the 6 they have replaced.

Replacing players, replacing coaches, it's all a lottery, a lottery this club is not very good at.

I’m trying reverse BM...
Players are overrated...
Coaches win matches...

There is no doubt the coach is important to player development and credit where its due with regards to Sharman. Sharman really looked way off the pace a few weeks ago but Ratts showed his genius by turning him into a backline player in just 3 games and is another genuine swingman now.

How do you think Sharman will go against Hawkins and Cameron or do think if he struggles on those two will Ratts swing him up forward and see what he learnt as backline player?

I am assuming that Howard and Wilkie will be taking care of Hawkins and Cameron. Assuming Battle also plays down back, it's not entirely clear what role Sharman will be expected to play, given that Stanley is the only other tall likely to play forward for much of the game. So perhaps Sharman will be swung forward at times.

Personally, I would rather have seen Jones play ahead of Sharman, but I am going to assume the coaching staff know what they are doing.

[D.B.Cooper]

I attended a lunch many years ago where Barassi was a key speaker.

On coaching he said something along the lines of a great coach can’t turn a poor team into a premiership team.

But plenty of great teams don’t win a flag and that’s where the coach can make a difference.

The best list I have seen at StKilda was 04 & 05 and we couldn’t make a GF. The next best group was 09 & 10 and we couldn’t win it.

Would a great coach have made a difference?

Whilst I think B.M slightly under values the coach, there is no doubt a great coach in invaluable as long as you have the list, board, club, fitness department & everything else working in harmony.

09 if players kick straight we win does that then mean Lyon a better coach? NO IMO.
Many don't like him due to how he left however took 2 historical basket case clubs to 3 GF's (plus a draw), - Nealry over achieved in 2010 and 09 and 13 ran into dynasty teams

I believe Ross was an innovator in 09.
We were the best team that year and that was the one that got away IMO.

[D.B.Cooper]

I attended a lunch many years ago where Barassi was a key speaker.

On coaching he said something along the lines of a great coach can’t turn a poor team into a premiership team.

But plenty of great teams don’t win a flag and that’s where the coach can make a difference.

The best list I have seen at StKilda was 04 & 05 and we couldn’t make a GF. The next best group was 09 & 10 and we couldn’t win it.

Would a great coach have made a difference?

Whilst I think B.M slightly under values the coach, there is no doubt a great coach in invaluable as long as you have the list, board, club, fitness department & everything else working in harmony.

40 yrs ago, technology, sports science, psychology, medical science were all very different.
Can't compare that era to our current era.

Would be like comparing pre-WW1 economy to our current economy

I’m confused, could you elaborate please?

Is your comment…

Coaches make little or no impact on the success of a team?

Barrassi doesn’t know what he’s talking about because he hasn’t coached in the modern era?

Coaches impact has been reduced due to technology?

Something else?

[Sanctorum]

Bring in a Chocco so the coaching mates club has someone to challenge the “nice family culture “
Time to get professional set standards and stop cuddling

I totally agree with the above excerpt in your post Teflon. While I have the utmost respect and admiration for Robert Harvey, I don't think his genteel nature will do anything to improve the players, so hope he doesn't get a gig back at Moorabbin.

Overall, I've never thought much a "nice guy" coach at any level, and for all the mud that's been slung at Brett Ratten for the severe slump after the bye round, he is anything but "soft and cuddly" with his players. He is, after all, a graduate of the Clarkson Coaching Academy. What the club media department sends out is not in any way indicative of what goes on behind closed doors.

As for another hard nut like Chocco, I can't think of anyone off the top of my head, they must be out there, maybe Luke Hodge. Both Jordan Roughead and Corey Enright have the necessary hard edges in their personalities to instil some mongrel in players, but apart from Long and Jones, I've seen very little mongrel in the current group.

There's no question that the current list badly needs an enforcer type with elite skills, which is a good reason to bring De Goey into the squad. I wouldn't mind betting Simon Lethlean & Co feel the same because it has been confirmed by the club they are looking at him.

[meher baba]

There's no question that the current list badly needs an enforcer type with elite skills, which is a good reason to bring De Goey into the squad. I wouldn't mind betting Simon Lethlean & Co feel the same because it has been confirmed by the club they are looking at him.

We don't need an "enforcer" type: the concept is archaic in an era in which any gratuitously violent act will be picked up from one or more camera angles. Clubs no longer seek such players and the concept only lives on in the minds of older commentators and fans who yearn for retaliation : "flying the flag" or whatever it is they like to call it. It's dumb football, as it can only lead to umpires giving certain shots on goal to your opponents and the tribunal dishing out harsh penalties. In contemporary footy, the most dangerous players are those who can draw free kicks, not those who continually give them away.

Some of the TV commentators seem to have singled out Steven May as being the sort of no-nonsense tough style of footballer that they want to see more of in the game. But I think his periodic undisciplined acts detract from his impact rather than enhance it. The AFL is acutely aware of its growing legal risks in relation to work health and safety and also of the potential for on-field violence to prompt parents to take their kids out of AFL and push them towards soccer or tiddleywinks or whatever. So they are becoming increasingly intolerant of on-field violence in any form: even minor acts of so-called "enforcement."

De Goey's potential benefit to our club comes from his strength and ball skills, which would make him a potentially game-breaking force in our forward half of the field in the way that Petracca and the Bont operate for their clubs. Managing his off-field activities will be enough of a handful without him getting involved in too much on-field trouble.

[Scollop]

Bring in a Chocco so the coaching mates club has someone to challenge the “nice family culture “
Time to get professional set standards and stop cuddling

I totally agree with the above excerpt in your post Teflon. While I have the utmost respect and admiration for Robert Harvey, I don't think his genteel nature will do anything to improve the players, so hope he doesn't get a gig back at Moorabbin.

Overall, I've never thought much a "nice guy" coach at any level, and for all the mud that's been slung at Brett Ratten for the severe slump after the bye round, he is anything but "soft and cuddly" with his players. He is, after all, a graduate of the Clarkson Coaching Academy. What the club media department sends out is not in any way indicative of what goes on behind closed doors.

As for another hard nut like Chocco, I can't think of anyone off the top of my head, they must be out there, maybe Luke Hodge. Both Jordan Roughead and Corey Enright have the necessary hard edges in their personalities to instil some mongrel in players, but apart from Long and Jones, I've seen very little mongrel in the current group.

There's no question that the current list badly needs an enforcer type with elite skills, which is a good reason to bring De Goey into the squad. I wouldn't mind betting Simon Lethlean & Co feel the same because it has been confirmed by the club they are looking at him.

We have a coaching squad and football department with a Hawthorn flavour and it makes sense when they have been the most successful football club this century. In some ways I feel like we need someone with St Kilda in their blood, but I can’t think of a player from our 2004-2011 era apart from Lenny Hayes that I’d have at the club…who has some coaching credentials

You mentioned Hodge and he would be ideal however I don’t think he’s gettable because his family has settled in Queensland. A guy that perhaps is gettable might be Jordan Lewis. Not sure if he has any desire to coach.

I am always impressed with Lewis’s insight and his thoughts as a media presenter and I reckon he could be a an astute asset as assistant coach. He fits the bill too as someone with mongrel and he was integral in the midfield with the Hawks premierships and he is a natural leader.

I agree with you re Ratts. The dropping of Billings and Jones and the way he handled Ben Long’s discipline issues is evidence enough for me that he’s no Richo. Long spent more time than was necessary out of the senior side early this year, but it will benefit him and the team in the future. Billings and Jones and all senior players realise that Ratts won’t hesitate to drop them again if they coast through matches and don’t give 100%.

[B.M]

How much impact did Barassi have in Melbourne and Sydney?

Jeans at Richmond

Pagan at Carlton

Malthouse at Carlton

Was Tony Jewel a good coach

Was Robert Walls a good coach

Alex Jesalenko?

Or conversely was Alan Joyce a GREAT coach?

I think coaches are important

But not the reason for good or bad performance

That comes down to the playing groups ability

Norm Smith stated the he thought Len was a better coach than him. He was just lucky that he was at Melbourne at the time!

[Yorkeys]

How much impact did Barassi have in Melbourne and Sydney?

Jeans at Richmond

Pagan at Carlton

Malthouse at Carlton

Was Tony Jewel a good coach

Was Robert Walls a good coach

Alex Jesalenko?

Or conversely was Alan Joyce a GREAT coach?

I think coaches are important

But not the reason for good or bad performance

That comes down to the playing groups ability

Norm Smith stated the he thought Len was a better coach than him. He was just lucky that he was at Melbourne at the time!

Name a poorly coached team that's gone top