Dal & Kosi wanted at club

[jk23]

Today's herald sun.
http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/sport/ ... 42,00.html

[saint66au]

While Saints fans have thrown Justin Koschitzke and Nick Dal Santo up as possible trade bait,

Ahh good morning H-S Journos

Good to see that we arent about to trade away draft picks.

[kaos theory]

As I said before it would be STUPID to trade Dal. He has had 3 to 4 very good seasons, and one bad yr (due manly to illness).

He is a huge talent, and a only needs to work on lifting his work rate - which he can do.

We need more quality mids, not trading away quality mids.

[plugger66]

As I said before it would be STUPID to trade Dal. He has had 3 to 4 very good seasons, and one bad yr (due manly to illness).

He is a huge talent, and a only needs to work on lifting his work rate - which he can do.

We need more quality mids, not trading away quality mids.

Agreed but what of Kosi.

[kaos theory]

Agreed but what of Kosi.

hmmm...This has been his first full season, without any significant interruptions (since 2003/2004), and he has been average. I would be inclined to keep him, because he has significnat upside IF the club is confident it can help him get there.

The issue is, what is the 'probelm' with Kosi?:
1. Is it confidence
2. carrying some injury
3. Issues with with coach and/or his role
4. lack of ability

If its 1 to 3, then the club and Kosi CAN solve this and get him back to being a key contributor. At his best, he is so dangerous because of his versatility he is so hard to match up on.

If its 4, and he just doesn't have the ability to play at the top level in the modern fast-paced game, then you might say we should trade him. BUT if it is 4, then other clubs will be aware of that if we want to trade him, therefore his value will be low. (Unless someone like freo do something stupid again at the trade table and offer quality picks and players for him...).

I believe the problem lies somewhere in 1 to 3. Therefore, he can get significantly better, and be a key contributor to the club.

[gosaints]

hmmm...This has been his first full season, without any significant interruptions (since 2003/2004), and he has been average.

Mate I get where you coming from but Kosi also played 19 of 22 games in 2007 and from memory he missed some through suspension.
He has now played 41 from a possible 47 over the last 2 seasons. He has had more than enough time to get his body and his mind right but things just aren't clicking for him. He still manages to tease us with bits and pieces of great play but just doesn't string it together. Kosi is a great bloke and seems like a good clubman, but i'm sitting on the fence with him.

[Saints Premiers 2008]

will kosi become the new brad ottens???

god i hope not...

hopefully he is stuck with as at 25 he is nowhere near his peak as a ruckman, floater, follower or stay at home forward

[Eastern]

Lets look at this whole "Trade Kosi & Dal"issue in the proper context

Both are still contracted to the club for at least the 2009 season

Both are very well paid (in the top bracket at the club)

If we are to trade them, how much of their salary would WE need to pay whilst they are playing against us?

The club would have invested upwards of $2Mill into each of them so far, what would we get in return?

What Draft picks and/or players would other clubs be prepared to give up for either of them?

IMHO both are of a lot more value to StKFC than anyone else, an opinion shared by the club when they say that both are required players !!

[Solar]

Lets look at this whole "Trade Kosi & Dal"issue in the proper context

Both are still contracted to the club for at least the 2009 season

Both are very well paid (in the top bracket at the club)

If we are to trade them, how much of their salary would WE need to pay whilst they are playing against us?

The club would have invested upwards of $2Mill into each of them so far, what would we get in return?

What Draft picks and/or players would other clubs be prepared to give up for either of them?

IMHO both are of a lot more value to StKFC than anyone else, an opinion shared by the club when they say that both are required players !!

some really good points

when it comes to trades, you look at players who are worth more to other clubs then they are too us. Then you look at getting a good price for them.

Also a draft pick still needs to be developed,

[SENsei]

Nice to see sub editors still have standards.....'i' before 'e' except after 'c'.

I keep see-sawing on Dal & Kosi. I see so much to like when they are on....such as Kosi's mark which was unfortunately out on the full. Dal on the run in full flight.

But I see so many deficiencies when things are not running so smoothly....Dal's refusal to chase and pressure. Kosi being so hot and cold. No in between.

Dal I would keep.

Kosi would have to be a chance to go if the right offer came up. The Bulldogs would be in the market and could make a good play. What if they came up with a first round pick and a player such as Harbrow?

We'd have to be mad not to consider it.

[Saints Premiers 2008]

Nice to see sub editors still have standards.....'i' before 'e' except after 'c'.

I keep see-sawing on Dal & Kosi. I see so much to like when they are on....such as Kosi's mark which was unfortunately out on the full. Dal on the run in full flight.

But I see so many deficiencies when things are not running so smoothly....Dal's refusal to chase and pressure. Kosi being so hot and cold. No in between.

Dal I would keep.

Kosi would have to be a chance to go if the right offer came up. The Bulldogs would be in the market and could make a good play. What if they came up with a first round pick and a player such as Harbrow?

We'd have to be mad not to consider it.

harbrow is average...he didnt get any attention as the cats were busy manning up the somewhat decent dogs...

[makemytime]

"Those under heat to retain their spots would likely include Aaron Fiora, James Gwilt, Leigh Fisher, Michael Gardiner and Michael Rix.

While Saints fans have thrown Justin Koschitzke and Nick Dal Santo up as possible trade bait, the club has assured them they are wanted.

The Saints have picks 13 and 31 and will not trade them, but have not ruled out swapping listed players for rival players or draft picks. "


I would have thought jimmy did his jobs in the recent weeks

[SENsei]

Nice to see sub editors still have standards.....'i' before 'e' except after 'c'.

I keep see-sawing on Dal & Kosi. I see so much to like when they are on....such as Kosi's mark which was unfortunately out on the full. Dal on the run in full flight.

But I see so many deficiencies when things are not running so smoothly....Dal's refusal to chase and pressure. Kosi being so hot and cold. No in between.

Dal I would keep.

Kosi would have to be a chance to go if the right offer came up. The Bulldogs would be in the market and could make a good play. What if they came up with a first round pick and a player such as Harbrow?

We'd have to be mad not to consider it.

harbrow is average...he didnt get any attention as the cats were busy manning up the somewhat decent dogs...

I was just throwing a young player up as an example, not necessary him specifically. Chuck Callan Ward in his place.

I'm saying that St Kilda would have to consider it, not just dismiss the notion totally prior to hearing all offers.

There are untouchables, but I don't think Kosi is one any more.

Untouchables in my view are: Riewoldt, Goddard, S Fisher, Hudghton, Hayes and Ball.

[BigMart]

My thoughts from another thread

A trade would be very risky.....and it could hurt more than anything...

Trade him to a rival club for a DP....the kid does not live up to expectation (Armo - at same stage Dal had played 31 games) and he goes to essendon and dominates and they go past us>>>>that would be very silly....

Trade him for Kerr......what is the benefit.....is Kerr any better???? Ling held Kerr to 12 possesions this season, he can be tagged, and has struggled as a frontline mid......how have his stats been since Judd and Cuz hav moved on????
How would Dal go with Judd and Cousins in their prime in the same midfield??????
Kerr is a moron of a bloke, can seriously play, has discipline issues...
He would be great....at what cost?????

Stats are just that - stats....and can be interpereted a couple of ways....his numbers in our losses can also mean that....
he is that important, if you control him we lose.....Lenny on the other hand can play well, but it does not necissarily mean we win.....
Look at his ranking points.....even with 20 touches, he outperforms players with 25+......why????

Defensive side/Toughness......he ranks top 4 in tackles/Hardball gets at the club....

does not stand up in big game?????
Hawthorn in R16 springs to mind (he turned the game).......Collingwood in the Semi (was that not a big game)....just off the top of my head....
Question.....why doe Dal get the #1 tag......and not Joey, Hayes, Harves, Ball....

When looking at a player - do you look at only ONE season to gather their worth to the team?????........what if they had an off year, or were carrying some injury????.....if we took a top 20 DP for Dal in 2007 would you be happy........What about 2005 when he was an AA and finished three in the Brownlow....would we have taken a top 20 then......point is, he can seriously play......you trade good players at your peril....

Last point
The reason a group stays loyal is this.....they become good mates and grow to love the organisation that are at.....if a mate is dumped by the organisation.....the players realise they are dispensible and start thinking of themselves, not the group......trust is gone if loyaly is not shown.....both ways....

actually one more point......his numbers are far from poor.....

is he a scapegoat????

Do we bag him because of unrealistic expectations.......and admire Lenny/Ball who have similar numbers......because they appear to tougher????......I have a theory..

Kosi was injured this season......has anyone considered that....he barely trained and moved like a man with a sore knee and zero fitness.....and still took some grabs (which is all he could do)

[BigMart]

Strong bodies are back in vogue......FFS

Do we just copy what's in vogue......Brisbane and Sydney we have modelled on over the years....now Geelong...FFS

Do you know what wins games.....good players....regardless.....and it's as simple as that

Michael Rix has a strong body.....so does Leigh Fisher.....so what...

Be trendsetters....not followers....

[stinger]

only a fool or a nuff nuff forum lurker......probably an opposition supporter to boot.....would consider trading dal or kossi...thankfully ross and the boys are neither...........

[stinger]

will kosi become the new brad ottens???

god i hope not...

hopefully he is stuck with as at 25 he is nowhere near his peak as a ruckman, floater, follower or stay at home forward

well...not in all respects....gawd ..i hope not.....

[makemytime]

Interesting, was at Herald Sun, reading the sports and i looked at the poll:

Poll Results
Thanks for voting, here are the results so far:

Should St Kilda look to trade Justin Koschitzke and Nick Dal Santo?

Yes 79% (798 votes) No 20% (201 votes) Total votes Total of 999 votes

That is incredible, most likely because they are still highly sought after but NO DEAL

[stinger]

would be all bummer supporters hoping to pick up dal ...and carscum supporters hoping to grab kossi......filth supportes can't read.......

[st.byron]

Nice to see sub editors still have standards.....'i' before 'e' except after 'c'.

I keep see-sawing on Dal & Kosi. I see so much to like when they are on....such as Kosi's mark which was unfortunately out on the full. Dal on the run in full flight.

But I see so many deficiencies when things are not running so smoothly....Dal's refusal to chase and pressure. Kosi being so hot and cold. No in between.

Dal I would keep.

Kosi would have to be a chance to go if the right offer came up. The Bulldogs would be in the market and could make a good play. What if they came up with a first round pick and a player such as Harbrow?

We'd have to be mad not to consider it.

harbrow is average...he didnt get any attention as the cats were busy manning up the somewhat decent dogs...

I was just throwing a young player up as an example, not necessary him specifically. Chuck Callan Ward in his place.

I'm saying that St Kilda would have to consider it, not just dismiss the notion totally prior to hearing all offers.

There are untouchables, but I don't think Kosi is one any more.

Untouchables in my view are: Riewoldt, Goddard, S Fisher, Hudghton, Hayes and Ball.

Agree with this. Mad to trade Dal, must keep him.
Kosi - not untouchable. If the right deal came up - like the one in your post Sensaintsational then yes take it.

[saint66au]

will kosi become the new brad ottens???

A Premiership ruckman?? Id like to think so

[joffaboy]

Why has nobody mwentioned the proposed contract extension for Ross Lyon?

IMO this is a tad premature. He still has a season to run on his contract, and while we came fourth we didn't set the world on fire.

The club is "thrilled" by Lyons efforts this year??????

Well they have a higher thrill tolerance than me.

I thought he went OK with the cattle we had, but it wasn't a really strong performance.

A contract extention may prove to be a millstone around our necks.

[BigMart]

Would the Bulldogs like Kosi???

Would the Pies Like Dal????

Should we improve our competitors right now by trading them.....our window is still open....trade some players for a couple of kids and we wind the clock back a little...

[st.byron]

Would the Bulldogs like Kosi???

Would the Pies Like Dal????

Should we improve our competitors right now by trading them.....our window is still open....trade some players for a couple of kids and we wind the clock back a little...

I think the point of the debate around Kosi is that we would trade for someone of higher value to us than he currently is. If he can lift his game at another club good luck to him. He's pretty ordinary in a STKFC jumper.

[stinger]

only a fool or a nuff nuff forum lurker......probably an opposition supporter to boot.....would consider trading dal or kossi...thankfully ross and the boys are neither...........

see...i was right.... ...as usual...