can someone explain- DreamT and Joey

saintbrat · Post: # 891651Post **saintbrat** » Sun 14 Mar 2010 12:37am

In listening to stats from the game I heard
Gram Most posessions for the game- from either side- 28

But also
Joey most Dreamteam points- How can that be? given we lost and he wasn't highest possession getter?

midas_touch · Sun 14 Mar 2010 12:41am

Perhaps he laid a heap of tackles

degruch · Post: # 891661Post **degruch** » Sun 14 Mar 2010 12:45am

midas_touch wrote:Perhaps he laid a heap of tackles

...or kicks...or goal assists? Handballs get less, free kicks subtract scores, so you can get 30 possessions a game and still score les than someone with 15 possessions. DT is not an indication of true performance, its a game and the scores are based on an algorithym.

Liam_G · Post: # 891664Post **Liam_G** » Sun 14 Mar 2010 12:51am

Joey had 21 possessions (16 kicks, 5 handballs), 7 marks and 7 tackles.
Gram had 28 possessions (16 kicks, 12 handballs), yet only 2 marks and 1 tackle.

Marks and Tackles are worth more in DT than handballs. Gram had 7 more handballs than Joey, but Joey had a combination of 11 more marks/tackles. Therefore Joey picked up more higher scoring stats than Gram.

degruch wrote: DT is not an indication of true performance, its a game and the scores are based on an algorithym.

DT is not based on an algorithm. Dream Team is based on this simple table:

Kicks: 3 points
Handballs: 2 points
Mark: 3 points
Tackles: 4 points
Free kicks for: 1 point
Free kicks against: -3 points
Hitouts: 1 point
Goals: 6 points
Behinds: 1 point

SuperCoach on the other hand, that IS based on an algorithm. It uses Champion Data's official player rankings. That algorithm is a much better judge on a player's performance. DT scoring rewards basic stats. CD Player Rankings is much, much more.

saintbrat · Post: # 891666Post **saintbrat** » Sun 14 Mar 2010 12:52am

Thanks Liam

I sort of figured that- but had missed that he had 21 possesions

I have felt he hasn't been as productive as usual through out the NAB series.

Milan Faletic · Sun 14 Mar 2010 2:09am

Liam_G wrote:Joey had 21 possessions (16 kicks, 5 handballs), 7 marks and 7 tackles.
Gram had 28 possessions (16 kicks, 12 handballs), yet only 2 marks and 1 tackle.

Marks and Tackles are worth more in DT than handballs. Gram had 7 more handballs than Joey, but Joey had a combination of 11 more marks/tackles. Therefore Joey picked up more higher scoring stats than Gram.

degruch wrote: DT is not an indication of true performance, its a game and the scores are based on an algorithym.

DT is not based on an algorithm. Dream Team is based on this simple table:

Kicks: 3 points
Handballs: 2 points
Mark: 3 points
Tackles: 4 points
Free kicks for: 1 point
Free kicks against: -3 points
Hitouts: 1 point
Goals: 6 points
Behinds: 1 point

SuperCoach on the other hand, that IS based on an algorithm. It uses Champion Data's official player rankings. That algorithm is a much better judge on a player's performance. DT scoring rewards basic stats. CD Player Rankings is much, much more.

Good post Liam

degruch · Post: # 891768Post **degruch** » Sun 14 Mar 2010 10:13am

Milan Faletic wrote:
Liam_G wrote:Joey had 21 possessions (16 kicks, 5 handballs), 7 marks and 7 tackles.
Gram had 28 possessions (16 kicks, 12 handballs), yet only 2 marks and 1 tackle.

Marks and Tackles are worth more in DT than handballs. Gram had 7 more handballs than Joey, but Joey had a combination of 11 more marks/tackles. Therefore Joey picked up more higher scoring stats than Gram.

degruch wrote: DT is not an indication of true performance, its a game and the scores are based on an algorithym.

DT is not based on an algorithm. Dream Team is based on this simple table:

Kicks: 3 points
Handballs: 2 points
Mark: 3 points
Tackles: 4 points
Free kicks for: 1 point
Free kicks against: -3 points
Hitouts: 1 point
Goals: 6 points
Behinds: 1 point

SuperCoach on the other hand, that IS based on an algorithm. It uses Champion Data's official player rankings. That algorithm is a much better judge on a player's performance. DT scoring rewards basic stats. CD Player Rankings is much, much more.
Good post Liam

Erm, I'm obviously on this forum to hear my head roar. No probs guys...call me any time you need to know something...

ace · Post: # 891785Post **ace** » Sun 14 Mar 2010 10:38am

Liam_G wrote:Joey had 21 possessions (16 kicks, 5 handballs), 7 marks and 7 tackles.
Gram had 28 possessions (16 kicks, 12 handballs), yet only 2 marks and 1 tackle.

Marks and Tackles are worth more in DT than handballs. Gram had 7 more handballs than Joey, but Joey had a combination of 11 more marks/tackles. Therefore Joey picked up more higher scoring stats than Gram.

degruch wrote: DT is not an indication of true performance, its a game and the scores are based on an algorithym.
DT is not based on an algorithm. Dream Team is based on this simple table:

Kicks: 3 points
Handballs: 2 points
Mark: 3 points
Tackles: 4 points
Free kicks for: 1 point
Free kicks against: -3 points
Hitouts: 1 point
Goals: 6 points
Behinds: 1 point

DT= 3xkicks + 2xhandballs + 3xmarks + 4xtackles + 1xfrees for - 3xfrees against + 1xhitouts + 6xgoals + 1xpoints

That IS a ONE step Algorithm

Sadly it does not penalise clangers, turnovers and missed targets. It does not reward long kicks hitting targets. It rewards uncontested marks and disposal afer uncontested ball gets equally with contested marks and disposal after contested ball gets.
It certainly does not reward team play such as sheperds, pressure, contribution to zones defences, decoy running, and running with the ball.

Put simply, it is only fit for dreamers

Algorithm = problem-solving procedure, a logical step-by-step procedure for solving a mathematical problem in a finite number of steps, often involving repetition of the same basic operation.

perfectionist · Sun 14 Mar 2010 10:54am

The DT calculation is a formula and so comes into the broad category of algorithm. However, most algorthims are more complicated processes, especially in computing. In schools, the most complicated algorithm for most is that of long division, mastered by few and useful to even less.

On the subject of the DT calc, if it does not take into account the quality of the disposal, then it is completely useless. Last week, Leigh had 13 handpasses but only three of them were effective. He is the worst exponent of that skill in the team.

In my view, he was one of the least efficient players last night, in fact, I struggled to see even one quality disposal. For an outside player, his disposal needs to be near faultless. He seems to lack brain power at crucial times eg his decision to initially run to the left of Kosi for a handpass in the last quarter, before realising that he can't kick on his left.

degruch · Post: # 891807Post **degruch** » Sun 14 Mar 2010 11:09am

perfectionist wrote:The DT calculation is a formula and so comes into the broad category of algorithm. However, most algorthims are more complicated processes, especially in computing. In schools, the most complicated algorithm for most is that of long division, mastered by few and useful to even less.

Trying to explain what an algorithim is to someone who thinks DT scoring = player performance, now that's an exercise in futility.

ace · Post: # 891811Post **ace** » Sun 14 Mar 2010 11:11am

perfectionist wrote: In schools, the most complicated algorithm for most is that of long division, mastered by few and useful to even less.

Understanding the algorithm used to determine the price in the stock market's closing single price auction is definitely more important.

Long division - A simple task once mastered by all in primary school.
But in todays socialist brainwashing it is more important to learn to say sorry for something somebody else did but which you did not do.