Eddy & Mini

[SaintWodonga]

I really think we need some fresh legs in this week.

Eddy and mini simply did not do enough and we can not afford to take the same players in.

I think we should replace mini for Steven. Steven has more goals for the year (than mini) yet mini has more than doubled his games.

Steven has proved (against Geelong) that he can kick goals on the G in a big game.

As for Eddy, if we replace him with Geary we are getting more of the same.
With some X Factor, I'd throw Stanley's hat into the ring. Heck he can't do any worse, with pace to burn and height he could be handy.

Thoughts?

[battye]

I don't think the first week of October is the ideal time to make wholesale changes to a team that was one point away from a premiership.

McQualter laid 10 tackles, Eddy has had a good couple of months. They do the job that RL wants them to do, that is why they keep getting selected.

[SaintWodonga]

I think we need a bit more dash and some fresh legs.

We got zero from the other 2, so I don't think we are risking much at all.

[SainterK]

Mini a zero SaintWodonga, truly?

[JohnE]

Mini's been a regular now for the last 2 seasons, team makes 3 grand finals and you want him out? Jeeez that's a bit rough.

[SaintWodonga]

well 10 tackles is great, but 8 goals for the full year playing most of the games as a forward... Come on.. That's Pathetic and you know it..

[JohnE]

You're right, what the hell does Ross Lyon know anyway!? Silly Ross!

[SaintWodonga]

Bottom line is we need to be more offensive and I think Steven can score goals (and get under the radar).

[saint3d]

well 10 tackles is great, but 8 goals for the full year playing most of the games as a forward... Come on.. That's Pathetic and you know it..

Code: Select all

Ross: Nick, Justin, Steven, Adam, Andrew, I want you guys to go out and kick some goals. Ok?
Nick: Right boss!
Justin: Right boss!
Steven: Right boss!
Adam: Right boss!
Andrew: Right boss!

<time passes>

Ross: How'd you go, boys?
Nick: Great boss!
Justin: Great boss!
Steven: Great boss!
Adam: Great boss!
Andrew: Yeah not too good boss.
Ross: No worries, Andrew. Hopefully you'll get it right one day.

Please pardon the sarcasm, but does that scenario have any connection to reality?

If you asked me I'd say it doesn't but what you've been saying suggests you might.

I'm surprised how easily some people seem to forget how much work is required to lay 10 tackles in a match, let alone a Grand Final.

[gringo]

When you look at the forward target stats that keep getting posted on here you can see why he doesn't kick many. He is a DEFENSIVE forward line player, he goes after the defender trying to carry out the ball. When he goes Shaw gets a free run out of defence. Steven is a goal scorer but not as defensive, he doesn't get minis place for that reason.

Mini doesn't need to get many goals to keep his place his tackles justify him his spot.

[IluvHarvey]

well 10 tackles is great, but 8 goals for the full year playing most of the games as a forward... Come on.. That's Pathetic and you know it..

That is such a 1980's mentality. the game has changed and not everything is about goals. Some forwards now are there more to stop a defender and put pressure on the opposition more than kicking goals. If Mini kicks a goal it is nothing more than a bonus. He is not in the team to kick goals!!!!

And I find your post more Pathetic then Mini goal output!!

[SaintPav]

well 10 tackles is great, but 8 goals for the full year playing most of the games as a forward... Come on.. That's Pathetic and you know it..

That is such a 1980's mentality. the game has changed and not everything is about goals. Some forwards now are there more to stop a defender and put pressure on the opposition more than kicking goals. If Mini kicks a goal it is nothing more than a bonus. He is not in the team to kick goals!!!!

And I find your post more Pathetic then Mini goal output!!

I'm not saying that he should be dropped but Mini does need to hit the scorebaord.

[dcstkfc]

He won't be dropped now but clearly he isn't doing everything right because he was dropped after Round 17.

[BAM! (shhhh)]

Sometimes the Mini targetting is a headshaker. Prior to round 1 2009, many on the forum rated him no chance to play... and it's as if 2 years later, people still haven't caught on.

I'd go out on a limb to suggest that come pre-season 2011 the defensive small forward role is one that's up for compitition - i.e. McQualter hasn't covered himself in glory in 2010, and can't consider himself a walkup start. I'd go further and suggest that to beat him, the first thing to do is contribute more goals.

However,

The first thing that needs to be recognised is that if a Steven/Armitage/whomever does not bring a top defensive game, they've no chance. I'm sure Armo can bring this, it would be an area for Steven to improve (I actually think Steven has it in him too, his tackle stats are pretty good).

The second thing is to recognise McQualter is actually a very good, and very smart user of the ball in the toughest area to use it well. While he doesn't personally hit the scoreboard near enough, he has the ability to set up teammates... this is where he has been able to edge Armo - Mini gives an assist per game on average, meanign he's impacting the scoreboard every week. Armo would need to deliver more in this area.

Finally (and most obviously...), it needs to be realised that Lyon is not at all likely to experiment here in GF II after Mini put up 10 tackles in GF I...

[gringo]

When Ross got us putting on our full court press style defence that started the "frontal pressure" mantra last year, it was Mini that really took the opposition back line runner out of the game.

If they run off him he kicks goals, if they mind him too close they lose run from defence.

Teams now need 2 backline line breakers to counter this. It means that we still take a Shaw etc. out of the game even if he doesn't get much of it.

Add to that the fact that he clears out to the flanks to take the congestion from Roo and Kosi. They know if they leave him he can score, he blocks, tackles and shepherds as well.

[ace]

I really think we need some fresh legs in this week.

Eddy and mini simply did not do enough and we can not afford to take the same players in.

I think we should replace mini for Steven. Steven has more goals for the year (than mini) yet mini has more than doubled his games.

Steven has proved (against Geelong) that he can kick goals on the G in a big game.

As for Eddy, if we replace him with Geary we are getting more of the same.
With some X Factor, I'd throw Stanley's hat into the ring. Heck he can't do any worse, with pace to burn and height he could be handy.

Thoughts?

Forget about Stanley, he does NOT go hard enough in a home and away game.
In a grand final you really have to want to take a mark a la Goddard.
The opponents seriously want the ball.
No one is going to give you a soft possession.

Mini and Eddy don't pose a big enough threat to stop Maxwell zoning off them.
Only when Dal Santo went forward did Maxwell sense enough threat to stay with his direct opponent.

[perfectionist]

Both will play. If neither makes a mistake, we will win.

[mad saint guy]

Mini was solid, Eddy had a down week after being in good form. Bringing in kids is not the way to go.

[saintsRrising]

Mini had been out of form.

However the GF was one of his better games this year.

Lately his tackle count has been on the rise, which it needs to be as that us what he is in the team for.

10
5
5
7

But yes his disposals remain down on last year....but 10 tackles is apretty fair team contribution.


On Eddy. GF was poor. But Lyon does not tend to judge players on just one game.

However his spot may be up for grabs depending on how Lyon wants to structure up in GF2.

What may count against Eddy is that he is agood tackler, but has only landed 3, 2 and 2 tackles in his last 3 games. So if his tackling got him back in theam, it may now not be enough to keep him in given those numbers.


Keeping them both in is the conservative bet.

Swapping Eddy for Geary would be conservative too, but aiming at different set-ups.


Luke Miles for Eddy could be a wildcard (not at alla conservative selection and so hence a bit un-Lyon like...though he has gone for horses for courses before)..BUT has only the 2 senior games (but is almost 24). But geeze he olooked good in those games...and if Lyon wants to keep Gilbert forward Miles could be a running half back with pace. Maybe Miles could run with Daisy too with his pace giving him an edge, along with an extra 2 cms in height.

[degruch]

Again with Mini? Weren't people watching this game? Mini was very good, if he'd nailed a goal, excellent. Can't see him going anywhere.

[Con Gorozidis]

Such a hard one with these two. I'm really in two minds. I actually thought Mini was our best player in the first quarter on Saturday. But sheesh he can go missing and doesnt get enough of it or read the play terribly well at all.

And Eddy - his attack on the footy and endurance are admirable. But his lack of clean hands, poor disposal (he loves handballing at guys feet or to noone) and poor decision making often have me pulling my hair out.

So while their good and bad attributes are plain for us to see - we have to ask the question - who replaces them and why?

A case has to be made for Armo, Jack and Geary. I see them all as fairly similar at this stage of their careers. All have pluses and minuses.

[StPeter]

I couldn't concur more. These two are just not good enough. Both given so many more chances than other fringe players. Both have very poor finals form in the past 2 years.

[gringo]

Miles looked like potential to me. His sprint was good but quite a risk seeing he has no team experience other than two games. Not the time to play the kids IMO.

[saintsRrising]

Miles looked like potential to me. His sprint was good but quite a risk seeing he has no team experience other than two games. Not the time to play the kids IMO.

Miles is just about to turn 24.

[Con Gorozidis]

Miles looked like potential to me. His sprint was good but quite a risk seeing he has no team experience other than two games. Not the time to play the kids IMO.

Miles is just about to turn 24.

Miles tempts me a bit because of the Pies run and carry. But I thonk Miles playes the same posi as Peakey/Grammy. So we really need more from Peakey and Grammy. But if grammy really has a dodgy groin which looks to be the case its tempting...