2008 - 2010 Drafting Worst in History - News Article

[st.byron]

Link below to an article on our drafting during Lyon's reign.

A disaster and it's playing out now with the holes in our list.


http://www.news.com.au/sport/breaking-n ... 6980866631

[saintspremiers]

This article could've and should have been written a year ago. Quite possibly even in 2012 it was evident also.

But typical slack journos only now do their research (or someone maybe trawled through SS where this analysis was done last season).

[thejiggingsaint]

Yes St Byron it makes for awful reading. I'd forgotten about Polo, Gamble and Pattison. It's not always (IMHO) a good thing to rake over old mistakes and to wring one's hands in despair at "what might have been", however, looking back at past events with a constructively critical perspective can also be an important step in any rebuilding process. Ive often heard this quote: "those who ignore history are condemned to repeat it" and with that in mind, I do honestly believe that we will see a gradual improvement in the quality of our squad. Naturally, this is not going to happen in one season, but with the current folk we have at the club, I do believe that a corner has been turned. The article raised some very germane points about the recruiting "talents" of Mr Lyon, and one has to wonder just how Fremantle will go in the next three to five seasons (squad-wise) should they not snare a flag this or next year. Thanks for sharing the article St Byron. Most interesting!

[CURLY]

Check the Swan's drafting out in the mid 2000's a couple of years before their flag its far worse.

[thejiggingsaint]

CURLY you raise an excellent point. Although our recruiting during the period in question was fairly ordinary, I think it's fair to say several other clubs made some shocking decisions at the drafting/trade table. However, that does nothing to help US! Geelong have provided an example to all of how important to a club, quality recruitment is. I have nothing but admiration for the Geelong Football Club in the manner in which they transformed themselves into the powerhouse that they are today. I don't resent or envy them........I'd love to see us EMULATE them, but it is going to take hard work and time.

[CURLY]

CURLY you raise an excellent point. Although our recruiting during the period in question was fairly ordinary, I think it's fair to say several other clubs made some shocking decisions at the drafting/trade table. However, that does nothing to help US! Geelong have provided an example to all of how important to a club, quality recruitment is. I have nothing but admiration for the Geelong Football Club in the manner in which they transformed themselves into the powerhouse that they are today. I don't resent or envy them........I'd love to see us EMULATE them, but it is going to take hard work and time.

Geelong have done well yes but they where also gifted one of the best CHF in the AFL for free basically. They also have had a magnicent run with injury to their star players. From the time both lists where put together they have lost Egan to injury. We have lost Penny Maguire Watts Brooks Clark and Allen. Makes a huge differance when your not trying to replace key players like we have had to.

[stinger]

nothing could be worse than this....years of rejects, walking wounded, hacks and misfits...recrited from other clubs

2001


heath black
trent knobel

2002


barry brooks
luke penny

2003

brent guerra
craig callaghan
alan murray

2004

dylan pfitzer...upgraded rookie
nick stone
aaron fiora
cain ackland
mark mcgough

2005

michael rix
fergus watts


2006

shane briss

2007

matthew clarke
charlie gardiner

2008

colm begley

2009

jesse smith
adam pattison
zac dawson
andrew lovett
brett peake

2010

ryan gamble
dean polo


just think, if we had picked a kid with each of those draft picks....

[Fidelis]

Agree our recruiting during that time was poor but thin it's unfair to lay the whole blame at the feet of the recruiters. Our development of young players in that time left much to be desired. I'm familiar with the family of one player who was recruited in those years who are scathing of Ross Lyon. They say the young player barely had a conversation with the senior coach in his years at the club and even when he broke into the seniors, was given minimal feedback about his performance. Was given every indication that the coach was interested only in the best 22. My view is that some of those players recruited may well have made it in the systems other clubs had in place.

[stinger]

Agree our recruiting during that time was poor but thin it's unfair to lay the whole blame at the feet of the recruiters. Our development of young players in that time left much to be desired. I'm familiar with the family of one player who was recruited in those years who are scathing of Ross Lyon. They say the young player barely had a conversation with the senior coach in his years at the club and even when he broke into the seniors, was given minimal feedback about his performance. Was given every indication that the coach was interested only in the best 22. My view is that some of those players recruited may well have made it in the systems other clubs had in place.

must agree with that.....cripps, lynch and hutchins are all the proof you would need.....and to a lesser extent ...armo and jack...

[plugger66]

nothing could be worse than this....years of rejects, walking wounded, hacks and misfits...recrited from other clubs

2001


heath black
trent knobel

2002


barry brooks
luke penny

2003

brent guerra
craig callaghan
alan murray

2004

dylan pfitzer...upgraded rookie
nick stone
aaron fiora
cain ackland
mark mcgough

2005

michael rix
fergus watts


2006

shane briss

2007

matthew clarke
charlie gardiner

2008

colm begley

2009

jesse smith
adam pattison
zac dawson
andrew lovett
brett peake

2010

ryan gamble
dean polo


just think, if we had picked a kid with each of those draft picks....

No mention of Schneider, gehrig, Dempster and the list goes on. Yep we could have picked a kid like LJ or Sweeney or Howard. You can use names and stats to prove anything you like. Our problem was picking the wrong kids over the last 8 years. No wonder we tried recycled players. Sorry that doesnt include the last 2 years. That certainly looks better.

[st.byron]

Agree our recruiting during that time was poor but thin it's unfair to lay the whole blame at the feet of the recruiters. Our development of young players in that time left much to be desired. I'm familiar with the family of one player who was recruited in those years who are scathing of Ross Lyon. They say the young player barely had a conversation with the senior coach in his years at the club and even when he broke into the seniors, was given minimal feedback about his performance. Was given every indication that the coach was interested only in the best 22. My view is that some of those players recruited may well have made it in the systems other clubs had in place.

Agree that Lyon must bear the brunt of the blame. Good defensive coach but rigid and inflexible IMO. And the years of rubbish recruiting falls at his feet.

[CURLY]

Why the hell are Black Brooks Penny and Watts on the above list?

[st.byron]

Just spotted Semper's "The Lost Years" thread and have realised I've doubled up. If no-one objects, will merge this thread into the original by Semper.

[stinger]

Why the hell are Black Brooks Penny and Watts on the above list?

cripples, walking wounded ...and in one case a real head case....self admitted no less...

[plugger66]

Agree our recruiting during that time was poor but thin it's unfair to lay the whole blame at the feet of the recruiters. Our development of young players in that time left much to be desired. I'm familiar with the family of one player who was recruited in those years who are scathing of Ross Lyon. They say the young player barely had a conversation with the senior coach in his years at the club and even when he broke into the seniors, was given minimal feedback about his performance. Was given every indication that the coach was interested only in the best 22. My view is that some of those players recruited may well have made it in the systems other clubs had in place.

Agree that Lyon must bear the brunt of the blame. Good defensive coach but rigid and inflexible IMO. And the years of rubbish recruiting falls at his feet.

Surely he isnt responsible for the drafting of young kids and second in GT's time when he also had the higher numbered picks the recruiting was no better. Have a look and see there isnt much difference at all.

[sunsaint]

Check the Swan's drafting out in the mid 2000's a couple of years before their flag its far worse.

Unless you have some other agenda regarding swans - Im not sure how you could point to them in the 2000's and claim their drafting was poor
A flag in 2005 and again in 2012 only dropped out of the 8 twice and both times rose up the ladder rapidly for a flag, shows they only needed a rejig to the list not even close to a full rebuild. AND and this is a big AND will probably win it again this year - you would have to say that is admirable club management.

[sunsaint]

Sorry that doesnt include the last 2 years. That certainly looks better.

thats because RLyon has left

[st.byron]

Agree that Lyon must bear the brunt of the blame. Good defensive coach but rigid and inflexible IMO. And the years of rubbish recruiting falls at his feet.

Surely he isnt responsible for the drafting of young kids and second in GT's time when he also had the higher numbered picks the recruiting was no better. Have a look and see there isnt much difference at all.[/quote]

No of course not responsible for what went before he arrived. But in the drafting from his years, the cupboard is now bare. He tried to top-up with re-cycled blokes who had sfa impact. Really damaged our list balance.

[Hemi Baxter]

nothing could be worse than this....years of rejects, walking wounded, hacks and misfits...recrited from other clubs

2001


heath black
trent knobel

2002


barry brooks
luke penny

2003

brent guerra
craig callaghan
alan murray

2004

dylan pfitzer...upgraded rookie
nick stone
aaron fiora
cain ackland
mark mcgough

2005

michael rix
fergus watts


2006

shane briss

2007

matthew clarke
charlie gardiner

2008

colm begley

2009

jesse smith
adam pattison
zac dawson
andrew lovett
brett peake

2010

ryan gamble
dean polo


just think, if we had picked a kid with each of those draft picks....

Or at least retained Black and Guerra.

[CURLY]

Check the Swan's drafting out in the mid 2000's a couple of years before their flag its far worse.

Unless you have some other agenda regarding swans - Im not sure how you could point to them in the 2000's and claim their drafting was poor
A flag in 2005 and again in 2012 only dropped out of the 8 twice and both times rose up the ladder rapidly for a flag, shows they only needed a rejig to the list not even close to a full rebuild. AND and this is a big AND will probably win it again this year - you would have to say that is admirable club management.

Have a look at their drafting it was putrid for a two year block.

[CURLY]

Why the hell are Black Brooks Penny and Watts on the above list?

cripples, walking wounded ...and in one case a real head case....self admitted no less...

Not when we traded for them they weren't. Recruiting Watts was a massive signing at the time.

[sunsaint]

Check the Swan's drafting out in the mid 2000's a couple of years before their flag its far worse.

Unless you have some other agenda regarding swans - Im not sure how you could point to them in the 2000's and claim their drafting was poor
A flag in 2005 and again in 2012 only dropped out of the 8 twice and both times rose up the ladder rapidly for a flag, shows they only needed a rejig to the list not even close to a full rebuild. AND and this is a big AND will probably win it again this year - you would have to say that is admirable club management.

Have a look at their drafting it was putrid for a two year block.

but its petty to think they got it wrong in two years - when in the whole the got it very right for that period and beyond
its just not a comparison to us, now if you picked WB or Rich then maybe

[CURLY]

but its petty to think they got it wrong in two years - when in the whole the got it very right for that period and beyond
its just not a comparison to us, now if you picked WB or Rich then maybe

2003 Willoughby (0) Schmidt (17) Ericksen (0) Davis (0)
2004 Moore (68) Spriggs (5) James (0)
2005 Laidlaw (1) Thornton (8) Brabazon (3)
2006 O'Keefe (0) Currie (0) Faulks (0) White (71)
2007 Veszpremi (11) Meredith (16) Bird (123)


Now I understand they won the flag but that above is five years of putrid drafting that never gets a mention.

[Jaz]

Whilst our recruiting was poor during that period the article is a bit misleading.

2 players listed as "gone" were traded.

For Tom Lynch we got Newnes and for Jamie Cripps (and Brent Colledge via draft pick) we got Murdoch and Saunders.

So that adds another 3 players that were an indirect result from that draft period.

We can't blame the recruiters for players that want to leave a few years later.

Also Tommy Walsh was recruited in that period for which we received Markworth and Maister another 2 players still on our list. Yes he was not drafted but still should be counted.

[Freebird]

nothing could be worse than this....years of rejects, walking wounded, hacks and misfits...recrited from other clubs

2001


heath black
trent knobel

2002


barry brooks
luke penny

2003

brent guerra
craig callaghan
alan murray

2004

dylan pfitzer...upgraded rookie
nick stone
aaron fiora
cain ackland
mark mcgough

2005

michael rix
fergus watts


2006

shane briss

2007

matthew clarke
charlie gardiner

2008

colm begley

2009

jesse smith
adam pattison
zac dawson
andrew lovett
brett peake

2010

ryan gamble
dean polo


just think, if we had picked a kid with each of those draft picks....

No mention of Schneider, gehrig, Dempster and the list goes on. Yep we could have picked a kid like LJ or Sweeney or Howard. You can use names and stats to prove anything you like. Our problem was picking the wrong kids over the last 8 years. No wonder we tried recycled players. Sorry that doesnt include the last 2 years. That certainly looks better.

Picking Howard excusable but with pick 26....now that was extremely dumb