The only way we'll ever net a big fish

[SydneySainter]

Much has been documented about our intentions to land a mature-age superstar recruit and how we're allegedly in pole position to do so because of our available cap space.

Yet, after two seasons of aggressively chasing all available top-end talent, we've recruited no body and nor are we linked to anyone. All players we were either in the box seat for, or that we were in ongoing discussions with have re-signed - Kelly, Fyfe, Sloane, De Goey, McGovern and it now looks like Gaff's interest has well and truly waned.

Clearly, our war chest of cap space is counting for very little when we're a club that's poorly resourced, no gun coach or any sense that we're going anywhere but further south.

If the club is fair dinkum about netting a big fish, then it needs to wake up and smell the coffee. We're not a destination club, the vast majority (if not ALL) top end talent don't want to play for us and simply being the club to offer them the biggest salary will count for nothing when all suiters are all offering them superstar money.

Eg, if Gaff gets offered say $900k to $1 mill at West Coast, will us offering $1.2 mill make the difference. It's likely it won't, because he still has a superstar offer at a club that's going somewhere. When you're already being offered $1 mill, really, what's another $200k or $300k to go play for one of the most rudderless teams in the comp? The only way we'll be able to even turn his head is by really offering the megabucks, an offer he just can't refuse, which will be like $1.5 to $1.6 mill. Overpaying, most definitely, but I think that's the only way we'll get any interest.

Same as a player like Polac. Let's say Port offer him $700k to $800k on a three year deal. Again, the only way he'll start to even think about us is if we offer him $1.2 to $1.3 over a four year term. Again, way overpaying, but a club in our dire situation, it's the only way we'll get any star player interest.

[Cairnsman]

Is going after the big fish suited to St Kilda and where the club is at presently.

Do we need to be comfortable with who we are?

Presently we are not a destination club?

I reckon we should target 2 or 3 players around the 400k to 500k mark. Players that can add some experience and if you get some improvement out of one of them into A grade then that is a bonus.

[stkfc1]

Is going after the big fish suited to St Kilda and where the club is at presently.

Do we need to be comfortable with who we are?

Presently we are not a destination club?

I reckon we should target 2 or 3 players around the 400k to 500k mark. Players that can add some experience and if you get some improvement out of one of them into A grade then that is a bonus.

Agree with this. We need to be targeting their 23 best players on the top teams not getting a game. Miles from Richmond as an example. Miles》Dunstan,Newnes. Whoever Lynch goes to will mean someone will be squeezed out and that who we need to look at. We need to upgrade all over the ground.

[Bernard Shakey]

Is going after the big fish suited to St Kilda and where the club is at presently.

Do we need to be comfortable with who we are?

Presently we are not a destination club?

I reckon we should target 2 or 3 players around the 400k to 500k mark. Players that can add some experience and if you get some improvement out of one of them into A grade then that is a bonus.

Agree with this. We need to be targeting their 23 best players on the top teams not getting a game. Miles from Richmond as an example. Miles》Dunstan,Newnes. Whoever Lynch goes to will mean someone will be squeezed out and that who we need to look at. We need to upgrade all over the ground.

I agree wholeheartedly. We need to get experienced leaders on all lines, not superstars.

[DJ Higgins]

This why we hired numbers guy. He will do a money all analysis on each player available and get the best value for money guys around

[Moods]

Is going after the big fish suited to St Kilda and where the club is at presently.

Do we need to be comfortable with who we are?

Presently we are not a destination club?

I reckon we should target 2 or 3 players around the 400k to 500k mark. Players that can add some experience and if you get some improvement out of one of them into A grade then that is a bonus.

Agree with this. We need to be targeting their 23 best players on the top teams not getting a game. Miles from Richmond as an example. Miles》Dunstan,Newnes. Whoever Lynch goes to will mean someone will be squeezed out and that who we need to look at. We need to upgrade all over the ground.

You mean like we did with Savage??

Couldn't disagree with you guys more. The LAST thing our club needs is more b-c grade talent. We need stars and desperately. Ideally we need one of our homegrown to step up - like a Ross, Steven, Billings, Carlisle, Webster, Acres,

In a year or two we need Clarke and Coffield to step up as well. Right now, none of the above are genuine A graders, I don't care what anyone says. In the meantime we need to land a big fish - whatever it takes. Right now we're heading nowhere. Even Carlton have more star quality than us. I would prefer Curnow, Cripps, Murphy (when fit) over any of our best players. We just have better overall depth.

[dragit]

Is going after the big fish suited to St Kilda and where the club is at presently.

Do we need to be comfortable with who we are?

Presently we are not a destination club?

I reckon we should target 2 or 3 players around the 400k to 500k mark. Players that can add some experience and if you get some improvement out of one of them into A grade then that is a bonus.

Agree with this. We need to be targeting their 23 best players on the top teams not getting a game. Miles from Richmond as an example. Miles》Dunstan,Newnes. Whoever Lynch goes to will mean someone will be squeezed out and that who we need to look at. We need to upgrade all over the ground.

You mean like we did with Savage??

Couldn't disagree with you guys more. The LAST thing our club needs is more b-c grade talent. We need stars and desperately. Ideally we need one of our homegrown to step up - like a Ross, Steven, Billings, Carlisle, Webster, Acres,

In a year or two we need Clarke and Coffield to step up as well. Right now, none of the above are genuine A graders, I don't care what anyone says. In the meantime we need to land a big fish - whatever it takes. Right now we're heading nowhere. Even Carlton have more star quality than us. I would prefer Curnow, Cripps, Murphy (when fit) over any of our best players. We just have better overall depth.

Yup, guys like Miles will just keep players like Phillips and Clark out of the side, Richo just can't help himself.

Pies went for Howe, so we ended up with Nafe Brown.

[dragit]

Looking at our list, we should have 3 million spare in the cap… and while we've been sitting on our hands not wanting to pay overs - Melbourne, Hawthorn, Collingwood even Port just keep stock piling quality players.

We're not getting anyone at "market value" so just need to stump up. Get something done saints, the club is dying.

[SydneySainter]

Looking at our list, we should have 3 million spare in the cap… and while we've been sitting on our hands not wanting to pay overs - Melbourne, Hawthorn, Collingwood even Port just keep stock piling quality players.

We're not getting anyone at "market value" so just need to stump up. Get something done saints, the club is dying.

Agreed. Even if they're not a superstar, but at least an A-grader who will improve our list - especially the midfield. Hoping that Billings, Ross and Acres will go to the next level and bridge the gap hasn't worked and may not happen as long as Richo is coach.

Just doing a few more Austin-esq trades wont get us anywhere.

[parkeysainter]

We are better off targeting players around the 21 year old mark (played 2 or 3 years) that have the potential to become A grade. If you throw 2-3 players like that into the list for the next 2-3 years along with our crop of draftees from the past 5 years, then things could turn very quickly. There are alot of gettable players at clubs like the Suns and GWS that fit that bracket. Jack Steele is a perfect example of what we should try go after again.

My fear is that we will get rid of guys like Newnes, Weller and Savage and then replace them with players not much better, but something has to change on the list.

The new list manager is going to earn his paycheck.

[dragit]

We are better off targeting players around the 21 year old mark (played 2 or 3 years) that have the potential to become A grade. If you throw 2-3 players like that into the list for the next 2-3 years along with our crop of draftees from the past 5 years, then things could turn very quickly. There are alot of gettable players at clubs like the Suns and GWS that fit that bracket. Jack Steele is a perfect example of what we should try go after again.

My fear is that we will get rid of guys like Newnes, Weller and Savage and then replace them with players not much better, but something has to change on the list.

The new list manager is going to earn his paycheck.

How do we get 2 or 3 A grade potential 21 year olds parkey?

Our current picks are #3, #57, #62 & #68

[Cairnsman]

If the big fish strategy isn't working then what is plan B? The club must have one.

Bringing in 2 or 3 players provides support to the current A grade potential which is struggling at present due to being the easy target, only target.

The players recruited into this current playing group should be thought of as depth and complimentary and not as saviours. Think about it from the big fishes perspective. Massive expectation would be placed on the big fish. Resentment would quickly set in if big fish was taking big cash and delivering well below expectation. Would not be good for the big fish career.

Can the club culture support big fish recruiting or would it have the potential to fail?

Need to be honest with ambitions versus capabilities I reckon.

[parkeysainter]

We are better off targeting players around the 21 year old mark (played 2 or 3 years) that have the potential to become A grade. If you throw 2-3 players like that into the list for the next 2-3 years along with our crop of draftees from the past 5 years, then things could turn very quickly. There are alot of gettable players at clubs like the Suns and GWS that fit that bracket. Jack Steele is a perfect example of what we should try go after again.

My fear is that we will get rid of guys like Newnes, Weller and Savage and then replace them with players not much better, but something has to change on the list.

The new list manager is going to earn his paycheck.

How do we get 2 or 3 A grade potential 21 year olds parkey?

Our current picks are #3, #57, #62 & #68

Players and future picks. Just like we used future 2nd rounder on Jack Steele.

[dragit]

We are better off targeting players around the 21 year old mark (played 2 or 3 years) that have the potential to become A grade. If you throw 2-3 players like that into the list for the next 2-3 years along with our crop of draftees from the past 5 years, then things could turn very quickly. There are alot of gettable players at clubs like the Suns and GWS that fit that bracket. Jack Steele is a perfect example of what we should try go after again.

My fear is that we will get rid of guys like Newnes, Weller and Savage and then replace them with players not much better, but something has to change on the list.

The new list manager is going to earn his paycheck.

How do we get 2 or 3 A grade potential 21 year olds parkey?

Our current picks are #3, #57, #62 & #68

Players and future picks. Just like we used future 2nd rounder on Jack Steele.

I'm all for moving a few players on, just not sure we have a lot of value… plus if we can get back into the 2nd round this year I'd prefer we go to the draft.

[The_President]

Everyone in charge or that has a say about the direction of the club needs to sit down and really think about what St.Kilda Football Club is and where it needs to be headed.

We aren’t one of the big teams. Even during the 09-10 peaks we didn’t have massive record numbers and we never will, we will always be trying to crack 50k. Which is fine, but we need to recognize that and acknowledge it.
We are a boutique club, like the Geelongs of the world.

We really need to push to be able to play at least 1 game at Moorabbin for points next season and just try and build on that every year. We aren’t going to make massive revenue from membership and we’re getting out of the pokies which is a massive revenue stream for clubs.
This means that we rely heavily on merchandise and gate revenue. With the Etihad deal we got destroyed with the splits of the gate.

We need to slowly try and push to get games at Moorabbin where we can get majority of the gate PLUS get a fairer deal from Etihad/Marvel.

Lastly, it’s no good just getting games at Moorabbin (even if we can) we have to bring the history and culture back with Moorabbin. We need to celebrate our greatest players and greatest moment. We need to have something that makes the fans proud to call Moorabbin Home again and build that fan loyalty again to get engagement at an all time high so we get bums on seats, even if we are serving up steaming piles of trash on the field

[Ajantis]

Pay the $$$$ st.kilda.
We have always been reluctant to fork out the big bucks. ffs just do it.

[CarlD]

North have been attempting to throw pots of money around as well and they have performed significantly better on-field yet haven't landed a big fish either (although the Higgins recruitment has been a winner).

Kidnapping is starting to look like a plan

[dragit]

Dangerfield, Ablett, Tuohy, Stewart, Kelly > talk about a royal flush.

Swap them out for Dunstan, Newnes, Savage, Brown and Mav.

[Moods]

We are better off targeting players around the 21 year old mark (played 2 or 3 years) that have the potential to become A grade. If you throw 2-3 players like that into the list for the next 2-3 years along with our crop of draftees from the past 5 years, then things could turn very quickly. There are alot of gettable players at clubs like the Suns and GWS that fit that bracket. Jack Steele is a perfect example of what we should try go after again.

I was just about to use Steele as an example of a player that hasn't given us what we wanted. Steele has played rserves and has had some very average games. He's too slow as well. Yeah he's also had some good games, but targeting the likes of him aint going to change anything. For Steele to be really good for hiss ize he needs to be more dynamic, like Cripps or far better overhead like The Bont - and also have far better penetration in his kicks.

Lets be honest, the bombers brought in 3 x senior footballers this year, Saad, Stringer and Smith. All are performing quite well at the moment. Has made a difference to their team but certainly doesn't transform them into some super team. And they are coming off a much higher base than us. They have genuine guns in Merrett, Hooker, Hurley, Danihar, and Hepple. Some will argue the toss over who I have named as guns but they are better than anything we have (possibly Carlisle would match Hooker)

[Dave McNamara]

We have heaps of room in our salary cap, and (unfortunately) not (currently) much in the way of players who can command the big $$$.

So it makes perfect sense right now to spend on some top liners... as long as they aren't too old! (Which rules out Hannebury. As do his dodgy groins.)

Gaff this year, and Kelly next year are prime examples of types we need. Excellent kicks, and not too old. So go and get it done Saintas!

[wally]

I think Essendon did well with the 3 they got, all were good players , better than a lot of our blokes.
That improves the team overall, but not superstars, then the club as a whole looks better.
18 months ago Bris and Rockliff wanted to part ways, I was against it but at the time nobody wanted him
and we could maybe have got a good deal done.By now it would have been a step forward.
After Ablett move stars look at that and maybe no amount of money is enough.

[dragit]

I think Essendon did well with the 3 they got, all were good players , better than a lot of our blokes.
That improves the team overall, but not superstars, then the club as a whole looks better.
18 months ago Bris and Rockliff wanted to part ways, I was against it but at the time nobody wanted him
and we could maybe have got a good deal done.By now it would have been a step forward.
After Ablett move stars look at that and maybe no amount of money is enough.

Bombers also gave up quite a lot though, I'm glad we didn't go hard for those 3.

Smith would be handy but Stringer is a dirty pervert and a downgrade on Membrey and an ordinary Savage has been better than Saad this year.

I'm glad we have Clark, Coffield… Austin & Clavarino

[saynta]

I think Essendon did well with the 3 they got, all were good players , better than a lot of our blokes.
That improves the team overall, but not superstars, then the club as a whole looks better.
18 months ago Bris and Rockliff wanted to part ways, I was against it but at the time nobody wanted him
and we could maybe have got a good deal done.By now it would have been a step forward.
After Ablett move stars look at that and maybe no amount of money is enough.

Bombers also gave up quite a lot though, I'm glad we didn't go hard for those 3.

Smith would be handy but Stringer is a dirty pervert and a downgrade on Membrey and an ordinary Savage has been better than Saad this year.

I'm glad we have Clark, Coffield… Austin & Clavarino

And after tomorrow night... Paton.

[ace]

Much has been documented about our intentions to land a mature-age superstar recruit and how we're allegedly in pole position to do so because of our available cap space.

Yet, after two seasons of aggressively chasing all available top-end talent, we've recruited no body and nor are we linked to anyone. All players we were either in the box seat for, or that we were in ongoing discussions with have re-signed - Kelly, Fyfe, Sloane, De Goey, McGovern and it now looks like Gaff's interest has well and truly waned.

Clearly, our war chest of cap space is counting for very little when we're a club that's poorly resourced, no gun coach or any sense that we're going anywhere but further south.

If the club is fair dinkum about netting a big fish, then it needs to wake up and smell the coffee. We're not a destination club, the vast majority (if not ALL) top end talent don't want to play for us and simply being the club to offer them the biggest salary will count for nothing when all suiters are all offering them superstar money.

Eg, if Gaff gets offered say $900k to $1 mill at West Coast, will us offering $1.2 mill make the difference. It's likely it won't, because he still has a superstar offer at a club that's going somewhere. When you're already being offered $1 mill, really, what's another $200k or $300k to go play for one of the most rudderless teams in the comp? The only way we'll be able to even turn his head is by really offering the megabucks, an offer he just can't refuse, which will be like $1.5 to $1.6 mill. Overpaying, most definitely, but I think that's the only way we'll get any interest.

Same as a player like Polac. Let's say Port offer him $700k to $800k on a three year deal. Again, the only way he'll start to even think about us is if we offer him $1.2 to $1.3 over a four year term. Again, way overpaying, but a club in our dire situation, it's the only way we'll get any star player interest.

Can we use a dead Trout as bait to secure a big fish.

[ace]

It is like being an English second division team with ambitions to become a English premier league club.
No premier league player will play for you until you make it into the premier league.
First you need to recruit a team to get you into the first division.
Once there you can recruit to get a team to advance to the premier league while dropping your weaker second division players.
Once in the premier league you can pick up the better premier league players from relegated clubs and drop your weaker first division players.
Only then can you dream of a rise through the ranks of the premier league.

The reality for St Kilda is we are as good as a second division club with second division players playing in a league which contains premier league clubs..
Rather than being a destination club we are a prospective departure club like Gold Coast and Brisbane.
Retention of star players would be a problem if only we had a star player to retain.