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saintadamski wrote: ↑Wed 19 Sep 2018 12:01pm
The Litmus test for an objective view on any player is to REMOVE THE RED WHITE AND BLACK GOGGLES!!
Now imagine that player played for another club and did exactly the same things.
Now imagine that the Saints wanted to trade that player in.
There are 2 x answers:
1. 'Yes I want him to play for us'
2. 'No way would I want that guy in our team'
I don't think ANYONE on this forum, who went through that mental process would pick number 1.
He should be traded, and quickly, as he will lose all value after another bumbling season!
Count me as No.1.
Wow ok
So if he played for Carlton or Essendon etc, had exactly the same stats, knocked himself out multiple times, and could hardly take a mark...you would want him at the Saints?
Can I ask for some reasoning behind your choice?
Would you have wanted Aaron Francis 6 months ago?
Aaron Francis isn’t trying to make it as a power forward in 2018 with the footballing traits of a power forward from 1995 though is he?
I hope he succeeds but, I can just see him being one of those guys that’s spat out of the AFL system and ends up kicking a lazy 150 goals a season playing local footy down at South Warrnambool for the rest of his playing days. Having fun sinking beers with his mates around the club and enjoying a couple of dimmies at half time.
Paddy is not a 'stand out' at anything. Basically a witch's hat who takes the odd mark.
So Marshall is getting more disposals than any of the others? Something to work on there.
I’m not saying Paddy’s necessarily a bust, but he shouldn’t be considered a walk-up start. Ahead of Marshall, for instance. And he should be told that selection is on form and merit
If both Paddy and Marshall are fit and in form and Bruce and Membrey also fit who do you play? Personally I'd have Bruce and Membrey first and then...
The preference for the player who competes 'strongly' will sway it towards Paddy perhaps...or will Richo say that 'team balance' means Paddy is preferred? Marshall certainly has huge upside. Can Paddy takes his fitness up a few notches?
Scollop wrote: ↑Wed 19 Sep 2018 2:46pm
If both Paddy and Marshall are fit and in form and Bruce and Membrey also fit who do you play? Personally I'd have Bruce and Membrey first and then...
The preference for the player who competes 'strongly' will sway it towards Paddy perhaps...or will Richo say that 'team balance' means Paddy is preferred? Marshall certainly has huge upside. Can Paddy takes his fitness up a few notches?
Interesting times ahead
I would love nothing better than Paddy to put the doubters back in their box ( and I'm one of them ) but the fact is his medical issues & ability to stay on the park for a sustained period are pretty confronting. I know Richo has categorically ruled it out but when does it get to the stage when you need to cut your losses & at least get something for your investment .To continue on & saying he's a great bloke & hope he will come good is not doing anything for the club going forward .IMO his currency has dropped every year since he was drafted so if we don't do it now & nothing changes we have not only wasted a No.1 draft pick but a chance to at least use it to our advantage.
I know that we are seeing issues with Paddy - medical - fitness - flat hands - etc
But how the flying f*** can we judge a forwards worth when we keep dumping it on his head when he has 3 defenders hanging off of him
Lets judge him on his ability once he has been given:
- Good service
- An extended run
- Adequate support in the forward 50
For Petes sake - Lockett and Dunstall would be being berated on here after the season from hell we have had - or they would have been suspended for whacking their own players for the shiteful delivery we have served up.
I am not saying that Paddy is the answer - I am not saying that he will be a world beater - but we have only ever seen him without his paste and powder - make a decision after he has been gussied up a bit.
“Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated, and drunkenness sobered, but stupid lasts forever.”
― Aristophanes
If you have a Bee in your Bonnet - I can assist you with that - but it WILL involve some smacking upside the head!
Paddy is not a 'stand out' at anything. Basically a witch's hat who takes the odd mark.
The most damming thing about that list is how close Josh Bruce and Paddy are statistically…
One is a 22 year old, 35 game key forward who is supposedly unfit and no good.
The other a 26 year old, 91 game veteran, our marquee forward on big coin and long term deal… super fit, works hard up and down the ground… is the focus of more inside 50's than anyone else in the side by a mile.
How Does Paddy take more marks than Bruce? Averages essentially the same amount of disposals?
Josh Bruce's last 35 games are barely any better than Paddy's first 35 stunted career games, that is extremely alarming if we think Paddy is travelling so poorly.
yep agree - I'm no huge fan of either
The question is - which one would you pick based on other factors, like age, and health etc
Both of you are wrong. Totally wrong on Josh Bruce.
Bruce was played initially as a backman for a whole year if I recall so I'd be having a look at the body of work for Juice ONLY over the 3 seasons that he was played in the forward line - 2015/2016/2017.
He kicked 50 goals in 2015 and in the following two seasons BECAUSE he was our 2nd ruck most of the time he kicked a lot less. He also played the decoy in 2016 and 2017 so that Paddy could get experience...plus...he played the decoy in Rooy's last year so Roo could get the adulation he so rightly deserved and because both Rooy and Paddy could'nt play in any other position at that time
Correct weight. Bruce has good form and goals on his resume and is a good player when right. Hopefully he can get over his injury and be a reliable goalkicker in 2019.
Scollop wrote: ↑Wed 19 Sep 2018 2:46pm
If both Paddy and Marshall are fit and in form and Bruce and Membrey also fit who do you play? Personally I'd have Bruce and Membrey first and then...
The preference for the player who competes 'strongly' will sway it towards Paddy perhaps...or will Richo say that 'team balance' means Paddy is preferred? Marshall certainly has huge upside. Can Paddy takes his fitness up a few notches?
Interesting times ahead
I'd like to see something like,
Marshall Paddy Long
Gresh Battle Membery
Any chance Bruce could be FB?
Tall, wirey, quick of the mark.
Lost his mojo up fwd.
Sainter_Dad wrote: ↑Wed 19 Sep 2018 11:16pm
I know that we are seeing issues with Paddy - medical - fitness - flat hands - etc
But how the flying f*** can we judge a forwards worth when we keep dumping it on his head when he has 3 defenders hanging off of him
Lets judge him on his ability once he has been given:
- Good service
- An extended run
- Adequate support in the forward 50
For Petes sake - Lockett and Dunstall would be being berated on here after the season from hell we have had - or they would have been suspended for whacking their own players for the shiteful delivery we have served up.
I am not saying that Paddy is the answer - I am not saying that he will be a world beater - but we have only ever seen him without his paste and powder - make a decision after he has been gussied up a bit.
At the start of 2017 I would have agreed with you...
then these goal kicking yips emerged and I have no idea what to make of them especially considering he’s such a lovely field kick.
He kicked 12.17 for the year (13 games) and a bunch of out bounds too. Make that 25.10 (no out on the full) or closer to 40 goals with a near full season... we’re having a very different conversation about his talent
Not sure about the no 4 pick for Shiel. We need to get someone who is just a better user of the ball and can kick a goal a game. Imperative that we dont c**k this up. Shiel is better than Polec so dodged a bullet there.I would throw the bank at Gaff, he is the type of player who would not let you down at any stage and can get 40 possies a game against good sides and in a good side.More a winger but thats alright.
BenLong#21 wrote: ↑Thu 20 Sep 2018 1:43am
SEN reporting the following
Shiel to Saints for pick 4.
Hanners to Saints for 2019 2nd rounder OR Paddy.
This sounds good. We should jump at this offer with both hands. I'd prefer to keep Paddy. of course, but it sounds like the club want Hannebury for his on and off-field leadership, and a player like Shiel could release Billings or Gresham into the middle. Or maybe Shiel plays in the centre.
How reliable did this mail sound?
I have heard that Hickey did a medical at West Coast, that Geelong are making a play for Steven and perhaps Longer, and that the Swans want to unite Paddy with his brother up in Sydney, but it all sounds like media noise.
) but the fact is his medical issues & ability to stay on the park for a sustained period are pretty confronting. I know Richo has categorically ruled it out but when does it get to the stage when you need to cut your losses & at least get something for your investment .To continue on & saying he's a great bloke & hope he will come good is not doing anything for the club going forward .IMO his currency has dropped every year since he was drafted so if we don't do it now & nothing changes we have not only wasted a No.1 draft pick but a chance to at least use it to our advantage.
