Saints need stand alone VFL side

[tedtheodorelogan2018]

Why was this anandoned?
Anyone know?

Anyway, its time to give this Sandy experiment and relationship the boot.

I want a stand alone Saints VFL side that plays its home games out of Moorabbin. Same as the new chicks side next year.

Build a 2000-3000 seat mini stadium on the outer wing, get beer tents and food trucks set up, let members in for free, open up the existing bar area, have auskick every game, etc. Make it a day! Even organise buses to Marvel or the G if the Saints play later on in the day or night.

Players are developing ok right now but a stand alone side would get the entire list playing on the same page. It would be a Saints brand and a much better way to get draftees ready or returning players from injury ready for senior footy.

I don't care if its expensive, surely it can't cost much more than what we are doing now.

Moorabbin has the facilities and soul for such a side. Get it done Bassett! Please.

[thejiggingsaint]

Why was this anandoned?
Anyone know?

Anyway, its time to give this Sandy experiment and relationship the boot.

I want a stand alone Saints VFL side that plays its home games out of Moorabbin. Same as the new chicks side next year.

Build a 2000-3000 seat mini stadium on the outer wing, get beer tents and food trucks set up, let members in for free, open up the existing bar area, have auskick every game, etc. Make it a day! Even organise buses to Marvel or the G if the Saints play later on in the day or night.

Players are developing ok right now but a stand alone side would get the entire list playing on the same page. It would be a Saints brand and a much better way to get draftees ready or returning players from injury ready for senior footy.

I don't care if its expensive, surely it can't cost much more than what we are doing now.

Moorabbin has the facilities and soul for such a side. Get it done Bassett! Please.

I agree with you 100% Colleague..... However, we would need (IMHO) at least half a dozen straight seasons of playing finals, (possibly some PF's?) to gain momentum for such a thing to happen...... there again, Norf have been able to do it! The Dullbogs have done it, how hard can it be?????

[tedtheodorelogan2018]

It can be done. Just depends if the club wants to or cares enough.

[B.M]

Really, we are 12 million in debt, and we are funding a stand alone team and building another structure at Moorabbin?!

Can you answer me this about having a stand alone team (which we basically have)

If we had a stand alone team this weekend, how would they have gone... more so who the hell would have played?!

Available players were
Lonie, Armitage, White, Rice, Clavarino, Joyce, Marsh, Young, Rowe, Langlands, Mayo

That’s 11 players, and pretty average ones at that, WTF does the other 11 come from, who pays them, and how much would they get flogged by.

We have remained competitive over the years in the VFL because of experienced Sandy players like Secull, Cook, Noone, Cockie, Gallagher, Magner, Marigliani, Dowler amongst others

Stand alone seconds team, least of our concerns.

[saintsRrising]

Really, we are 12 million in debt, and we are funding a stand alone team and building another structure at Moorabbin?!

Yes I believe that the extra cost is probably the main reason we do not have our own stand alone VFL team.

Can you answer me this about having a stand alone team (which we basically have)

If we had a stand alone team this weekend, how would they have gone... more so who the hell would have played?!

A: Look at what the other clubs with stand alone VFL teams do. For example at stage this year Richmond have had a large injury list, though has shrunk now. Looking at the injury list the Pies will probably have lot out this week and will I assume still field a VFL Team.

[leighsaintsince66]

I agree Ted

[shanegrambeau]

I don’t know how he finances work at all but don’t you wonder how Hawthorn would be with its own seconds team.

I love Sandy, watched em as a teen and St Kilda and Sandy have always been better buddies than say, Melbourne and Casey, Collingwood and Williamstown but I absolutely love the idea of a seconds team playing Moorabbin...or of course... (Dr Spaceman) ...the Junction. The JO is go, and the Saints Second’s know!

[B.M]

Maybe we should throw the 30 million down the toilet that was spent to build Moorabbin
And build a training base in our spiritual heartland - StK at the junction. We could share with CV because our relationship with cricket was so good last time.

Surely if we were training at StK our fortunes would turn around. After all, the hundreds of StK supports could zip down to training and watch if they were having a day off work?
Really something for all our inner city fans, of course it’d be a bit of a hike for the majority of our fans that actually live on the peninsula.

It’s funny
Hawthorn moved there trading base, and are doing so again. Wonder if their players and supporters will crack it, or blame their isolated training venue on their performance?
They also stayed in Tas and chose to embrace it (as North have done) rather than use it as an excuse for losing. Good clubs win regardless of where they playing or training.
Essendon moved out of their spiritual home. As did Collingwood?!
Wonder how detrimental it has been for those clubs?!

[saintsRrising]

Maybe we should throw the 30 million down the toilet that was spent to build Moorabbin
And build a training base in our spiritual heartland - StK at the junction. We could share with CV because our relationship with cricket was so good last time.

Surely if we were training at StK our fortunes would turn around. After all, the hundreds of StK supports could zip down to training and watch if they were having a day off work?
Really something for all our inner city fans, of course it’d be a bit of a hike for the majority of our fans that actually live on the peninsula.

It’s funny
Hawthorn moved there trading base, and are doing so again. Wonder if their players and supporters will crack it, or blame their isolated training venue on their performance?
They also stayed in Tas and chose to embrace it (as North have done) rather than use it as an excuse for losing. Good clubs win regardless of where they playing or training.
Essendon moved out of their spiritual home. As did Collingwood?!
Wonder how detrimental it has been for those clubs?!

I thought this was a thread on having a stand alone StKilda VFL team? None of the above is really relevant to that.

[B.M]

The op refers to building a stand at Moorabbin and funding a Seconds team

Then another post on going to the JO

I think both are costly and not required at this point

[bigred]

Debt should be reduced to 9-10 mill this year.

If it is not, then we should start thinking about what we should be called when all our home games are in Tassie.

[B.M]

Southern Saints

[mad saint guy]

Our plan to build a stand alone VFL team was abandoned right around the time that our bid for an AFL women's team was announced. The official line is that the two decisions are unrelated, but that is clearly not true. We poured many of our limited resources into the women's team and the men's team has and will continue to suffer because of it.

[Saintmatt]

Nice sentiment from OP but - it is simply about money now. Surely you can't be that naiive? Our relationship basically costs us nothing with Sandy - it's very complimentary ... except for the quota system (and that horrid hybrid jumper they've been wearing). Having said that - a St K employee is now the Sandy coach so, for all intents and purposes - it's a St K VFL team.

However - if anyone thinks having their own VFL team is the panacea to fast-tracking development of your drafted talent - it's not. Hawthorn have done exceptionally well out of their relationship with Box Hill. The difference between them and us is that they're incredibly well run both administratively and football-wise and they fostered a mutually beneficial working relationship between themselves and Box HIll. We're pretty much hopeless and both. Anyone wanting some detail on this - read here with trepidation ... https://themongrelpunt.com/afl/2018/4/2 ... t-st-kilda

PS - the AFL was actually pretty keen on awarding us an inaugural season Women's AFL team (as the only team south of the Yarra) ... but didn't because we barely had enough free cash-flow from ordinary operations to run the men's team. Fact.

[B.M]

It is definitely a StK seconds team, has been since McPhee was coach, as he was a StK employee at the time. Nor have they had the quota system (which was VFL wide for affiliated clubs) for a few years now. They play an exact replica of the senior game plan and the priority is player development for StK

Although Sandy in an ideal world would like to be Stand Alone, and almost went that way a few years ago, but flip flopped. They simply couldn’t survive without the alignment. StK in an ideal world would love stand alone team too, but can’t afford it, and up until this year never had a suitable oval to play at. Seaford was purely a training base with no visitors rooms or spectator facilities.

Sandy are happy with the arrangement because for years they haven’t paid a coaching staff, and have access to AFL elite talent.

It suits StK because we don’t have to pay supplementary players or VFL administration costs.

Not too sure why a stand alone team would be any different to having a reserves. Did anyone show any interest in the old AFL reserves in the 90s?
Can you name Captains, B&Fs, leading goal kickers, ladder positions from our seconds?
Did anyone go to watch the twos? I remember Waverley being pretty empty until half an hour before the seniors.
Because a fair few people go to watch Sandy, both Sandy and Saints supporters there.

[bigred]

I don't see the point of it.

It would just cost us a lot more money that we do not have.

We pretty much have full control anyway.

[shanegrambeau]

It is definitely a StK seconds team, has been since McPhee was coach, as he was a StK employee at the time. Nor have they had the quota system (which was VFL wide for affiliated clubs) for a few years now. They play an exact replica of the senior game plan and the priority is player development for StK

Although Sandy in an ideal world would like to be Stand Alone, and almost went that way a few years ago, but flip flopped. They simply couldn’t survive without the alignment. StK in an ideal world would love stand alone team too, but can’t afford it, and up until this year never had a suitable oval to play at. Seaford was purely a training base with no visitors rooms or spectator facilities.

Sandy are happy with the arrangement because for years they haven’t paid a coaching staff, and have access to AFL elite talent.

It suits StK because we don’t have to pay supplementary players or VFL administration costs.

Not too sure why a stand alone team would be any different to having a reserves. Did anyone show any interest in the old AFL reserves in the 90s?
Can you name Captains, B&Fs, leading goal kickers, ladder positions from our seconds?
Did anyone go to watch the twos? I remember Waverley being pretty empty until half an hour before the seniors.
Because a fair few people go to watch Sandy, both Sandy and Saints supporters there.

So Sandy is effectively a shell of its former self, a jumper and the beach oval and not much more? If we are keeping the Zebs jumper alive bravo, otherwise we are degrading them and they have little of their own identity. Surely it would be better in an ideal world for two different clubs not to share teams, but if footy is now in such a decline that old VFA staples are virtually
kaput, we deserve extra money from the AFL for being the St Johns Ambulance of footy. No wonder we have the cross of our crest.

[leighsaintsince66]

Our plan to build a stand alone VFL team was abandoned right around the time that our bid for an AFL women's team was announced. The official line is that the two decisions are unrelated, but that is clearly not true. We poured many of our limited resources into the women's team and the men's team has and will continue to suffer because of it.

If the above is the case, members should have been informed of the choice at the time, despite this being a sensitive issue.
I for one was really happy to hear of the proposed stand alone side. Was also keen to shift to the Moorabbin area in this context.

Oh well, perhaps the women's team will win a flag for us soon. Except for 1966, this has eluded our men ( at the seniors level) for 146 years!