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Excuse me if im wrong, but what does going to Geelong have to do with his mental health? Im asking this question genuinely. Does he have access to some kind of support or treatment in Geelong that he wouldnt get an hour away in St Kilda? Because if you are suggesting that playing for a winning football team has some kind of connection to improved mental health, then i think your understanding of mental health problems such as depression is a little shallow.
Oh how very little you know... It is because I have a VERY good understanding on mental health issues that I am posting here in support of Jack. If you had the same understanding as me you would not be posting such drivel.
Boo hoo. Cry me a f****** river.
You really are just ranting now.
“Listen to me because I’m an expert” aka the logically fallacious appeal to authority argument.
Priceless.
Holder of unacceptable views and other thought crimes.
The Fireman wrote: ↑Wed 16 Oct 2019 10:05am
Id be having a go at geelong if I was you, if they paid the right price up front Jack would have made a smooth transition to the Cats to aid his mental problem much sooner.
If you want to blame anyone blame Richo who refused to let him go a year ago. We would have gained quality for Jack in this case.
100000%. Cho talking Jack out of leaving last year is important here. We would've had trade currency (like Freo has with Hill) if Jack had 2 years on a contract; rather than one. That short-sighted move from Cho helped precisely no one - Cho lost his job; Jack hardly played; and we didn't make finals. And now we have to cop pick 58. Lose, Lose, Lose, Lose.
The Fireman wrote: ↑Wed 16 Oct 2019 10:05am
Id be having a go at geelong if I was you, if they paid the right price up front Jack would have made a smooth transition to the Cats to aid his mental problem much sooner.
If you want to blame anyone blame Richo who refused to let him go a year ago. We would have gained quality for Jack in this case.
Are you sure? are you suggesting a club like Geelong would have paid more for Jack last year possibly knowing he would hardly take the field in 2019? How did that make him more valuable than what they are paying his year? At least he got on the field at the end of the season to give some indication he might make the field consistently in 2020.
There were no issues with Jack last trade period.
So there was no "possibly knowing he would hardly take the field in 2019".
Cats were actively chasing Jack last trade period.
So are you saying that Jacks issues hadn't started before the trade period last year? Would it be possible Joel would have known what was going on and feeding the Cats not only last year but this year too?
I’m trying to strike a balance between us looking after Jack and us looking after St Kilda.
We are getting a pittance for a four-time best and fairest who will be a key part of Geelong’s midfield and is virtually guaranteed to be playing finals in 2020.
Pick 58, I don’t agree with for a start. It way less than he is worth. It seems a mental health crisis significantly lessens one’s value. Damaged goods? I don’t buy it. People overcome these sorts of things all the time and get back to their best.
To add insult to injury, we’ll reportedly be paying part of his salary.
Christ, what an absolute gift to Geelong of all clubs.
bigcarl wrote: ↑Wed 16 Oct 2019 1:02pm
I’m trying to strike a balance between us looking after Jack and us looking after St Kilda.
We are getting a pittance for a four-time best and fairest who will be a key part of Geelong’s midfield and is virtually guaranteed to be playing finals in 2020.
Pick 58, I don’t agree with for a start. It way less than he is worth. It seems a mental health crisis significantly lessens one’s value. Damaged goods? I don’t buy it. People overcome these sorts of things all the time and get back to their best.
To add insult to injury, we’ll reportedly be paying part of his salary.
Christ, what an absolute gift to Geelong of all clubs.
I wonder whether we have backed ourselves in a corner a little with the Hill deal needing this pick to get this done. Geelong know this and holding the ax over our head knowing we need the pick to get Hill done.
Annoys me as unders for a player like Steven and also the way Geelong sook about let Ablett come home, Let Dangerfield, Let Steven - Kelly no way only for a kings ransom
That said well played by them and when you want as much as we do in this period you have to lose somewhere along the way.
If All get done as speculated :
Howard/Ryder - win
Butler - Win
Hill - Win -( big fan of his and brings what we do not have)
Steven - Loss
Acres _ neutral
FortiusQuoFidelius wrote: ↑Wed 16 Oct 2019 10:00am
I was just reading the thread on Jack Steven's trade to Geelong and am absolutely disgusted at some of the comments you all have made in relation to Jack's worth to the club.
Nobody appears to have grasped the real issue here which is Jack's mental health. I'd give him to Geelong for nothing if it was going to aid Jack in his recovery from what is a serious and insidious disease.
You all obviously have very short memories and I'm sure Spud would be turning in his grave at some of your comments.
You are a heartless pack of <edited by mods>
<1 day ban for circumventing the swear filter>
You’re a plastic fan... the club always takes precedent over the player.
bigcarl wrote: ↑Wed 16 Oct 2019 1:02pm
I’m trying to strike a balance between us looking after Jack and us looking after St Kilda.
We are getting a pittance for a four-time best and fairest who will be a key part of Geelong’s midfield and is virtually guaranteed to be playing finals in 2020.
Pick 58, I don’t agree with for a start. It way less than he is worth. It seems a mental health crisis significantly lessens one’s value. Damaged goods? I don’t buy it. People overcome these sorts of things all the time and get back to their best.
To add insult to injury, we’ll reportedly be paying part of his salary.
Christ, what an absolute gift to Geelong of all clubs.
I wonder whether we have backed ourselves in a corner a little with the Hill deal needing this pick to get this done. Geelong know this and holding the ax over our head knowing we need the pick to get Hill done.
Annoys me as unders for a player like Steven and also the way Geelong sook about let Ablett come home, Let Dangerfield, Let Steven - Kelly no way only for a kings ransom
That said well played by them and when you want as much as we do in this period you have to lose somewhere along the way.
If All get done as speculated :
Howard/Ryder - win
Butler - Win
Hill - Win -( big fan of his and brings what we do not have)
Steven - Loss
Acres _ neutral
Unknown
Bruce and Jones ?
I dont understand how getting pick 58 improves our standing with hill whatsoever, we can just as easily facilitate a trade using a future pick of equivalent value right now.
I think it was probably a good time for Jack to go. When a club is trying to settle and build a team, any destabilising influences and background distractions with personnel are the last thing that's needed- especially with a new coaching regime. Whatever Jack's situation is, it is better he sorts it out elsewhere. We know what a great player he has been for us, but we got his best I think, and Geelong may get a few good games from him, if indeed he can settle- maybe he won't? I think pick 58 in some way reflects the situation.
I think another fact we have to remember is that the club actually hasn’t done anything wrong here.
They signed Steven to a deal
Honoured it
Supported him in his troubles
What’s changed is that Steven wants to go
Geelong want him on their list but don’t want to pay his worth in terms of picks or honouring his contract
That is not on us
To sit there and say we need to get understand and cover the contract is NOT a part of his mental health considerations... it’s trying to take advantage
I will be disgusted if St K pays him anything in 2020.
He wants to leave and is breaking the contract. Let him negotiate a new one with his next employer. We wasted 800K or whatever on him in 2019. No more! Charity starts at home.
" If thought corrupts language then language can also corrupt thought."
This is random but the title of the thread made me think about this joke:
Two guys get invited to a costume party. The invitation says that all costumes need to be of an emotion. So they think about it and figure out their costumes. The day of the party comes and the first guy gets completely naked, gets a bowl of custard and sticks his dick in it. The second guy also gets completely naked, cuts a whole in a pear, and sticks his dick through it. They walk in to the party together and people at the party are freaking out. The host runs up and says "Whoa guys what are you doing. This isn't that kind of party. You were supposed to dress up like an emotion." The first guys says "I am dressed as an emotion. "I'm deep in dis pear." Second guys says "And I'm f***** dis custard."
sendmehomehappy wrote: ↑Wed 16 Oct 2019 1:41pm
I will be disgusted if St K pays him anything in 2020.
He wants to leave and is breaking the contract. Let him negotiate a new one with his next employer. We wasted 800K or whatever on him in 2019. No more! Charity starts at home.
Geez...Jeez...why wouldn't it make sense to anyone ,
A) I've screwed up here or I am screwed up or both, and there is some bad blood in the water mixed in with the love
B) I still have some footy in me and actually have talent
C) Time to move on and step out of this environment and try a new one
D) why not Geelong? I'm from Lorne. Family close*
* I'm sorry but I disagree about closeness and number of kms being the same. Lorne is a west coast vibe, doesn't matter how long it takes to drive to Kardina Park from there. Driving through Melbourne suburbs , even if shorter, does not cut it.
I can totally imagine that JS loves his mates at StK and would have loved it another way but I can also see why Geelong and Lorne appeal. If may well not be the pacea he is looking for , but a new environment, absolutely is needed if some of these stories are true.
sendmehomehappy wrote: ↑Wed 16 Oct 2019 1:41pm
I will be disgusted if St K pays him anything in 2020.
He wants to leave and is breaking the contract. Let him negotiate a new one with his next employer. We wasted 800K or whatever on him in 2019. No more! Charity starts at home.
For pick 58 I would agree.
If we could have gained say pick 34 ish (ie for Jones) I would have been ok to pay part of his wage for 2020.
Not for the sake of Jack, but because it is a better pick!
Flying the World in comfort thanks to FF Points....
A very well orchestrated move by Geelong i think to get him next to nothing.
His mental health will improve once at Geelong and they will be laughing in our face about it,
Not sure why all the angst at the Cats? One minute we're all ranting about how the club needs to look after the club and not the player. When another club does exactly that, we're up in arms. Well, some of us anyway.
Geelong's responsibility is to Geelong, not to us and not to Jack. They may or may not have chased Jack (who knows) but he's the one who has made it pretty clear that he wants to go there. If a gun player wanted to come to our club, but we didn't really need that type of player, I'm pretty sure we'd be open to it but would make it as hard as possible for the club that the player's coming from. That's business. Jack wants to leave, we need to get the best deal, and so do the Cats. They hold the upper hand because they don't really need him, but they would like him (who wouldn't)
Us paying Jack's salary really needs to be explained to the members, because a contracted player demanding to leave and the club getting a poor draft pick PLUS paying his salary or part of is going way overs to assist the player.
