"Judge us on the 2nd Half of the Season"

[rodgerfox]

I head Silvagni say this, and I also heard Lyon allude to it several times towards the end of the year as our season was slowly dying.

If I were to judge us on the 2nd half of the year, we failed horribly.

If I were to judge us on the first half, we performed better in my opinion.


The first half of the year was a wonderful effort. Incredibly decimated and getting used to new coaches and new players, but we won 4 games. Other clubs wouldn't have opened their account, and in some cases didn't.

But our 2nd half was what I found so disappointing. We had 1 great win. Against West Coast. But they were missing several key players.

We had a good win against Adelaide - but they had no backline.

The other wins we did have weren't impressive at all. Falling over the line against Richmond and Carlton is a disgrace.

Drawing with the Dogs and in particular the Collingwood loss were simply unacceptable. And totally winnable.

Every game we lost in the 2nd half of the year was winnable. We genuinely should have won them all (except the West Coast one in Perth).


We had a charmed draw in the 2nd half of the year, and had a very good injury list - 7 wins from 11 games isn't anything to brag about.


Please convince me that what we saw in the 2nd half of the year isn't what we are going to strive to achieve. If we accept that, we're in massive trouble.

[meher baba]

I thought there was good and bad in both halves of the season. I thought that in our early wins against the Dees, Dogs, Blues and Swans we were more dominant than we were for most of the second half when, even when we won games, we usually kept the opposition in it until the last few minutes.

The real low points in the season for me were our games against the Roos and Filth and our second games against the Blues and Dogs: all of which occurred during rounds 10-22. (Our first game against the Tigers was pretty dreadful too, but was the weekend after our big effort in Perth, so there was some sort of an excuse.)

However, I guess what was a bit encouraging about the end of the season was the style of play we saw in the last 3 games: a bit more of our old dominating style we saw during 2004-06. Will we pick up from there or will we still see performances like the one we gave in the tie with the Dogs?

I agree with your points about our injury list and our excellent draw at the end. However, for me the main problem we face remains one of kicking accuracy: particularly among our midfielders. It's so bad across the board now that even Blake doesn't stand out as our worst kick for goal as much as he used to do!!

I'm only being semi-facetious when I say that, if Lyon could fix our goal-kicking inaccuracy, he could get the team to flood and play chipalotto as much as he liked and we'd still win most of our games!!

[joffaboy]

I tend to agree with the OP.

I believe that we were out of the hunt for the eight before the break. To actually get four wins with our injury list was really a very good effort.

Once we had close to our full list on the park in the second round we won games we should have won, lost against the Pies when we should have won, drew against the Bulldogs when we should have won, and generally ran out of legs in every fourth quarter.

I was more dissapointed in the second half than the first, at least we show some heart in the first half of the year. In the second we really just peetered along.

If we had have done that all year with a ful list we may have got 14 wins but still wouldn't challenge Port or Geelong.

If we play crap boring flood chippy games like against Sydney I will almost give the game away. At least we looked good in one or two games, but the spark has left us.

We need some pace and a bloody ruckman.

[BringBackMadDog]

What you fail to understand is that although we had a better list of players on the park for the second half, the majority of them had had either extended periods of time off the field and training track or very limited pre-seasons. This would explain why when we had plenty of run in the legs in the first half we were generally better ability wise than the opposition but in the second half we just ran out of legs. Surely with a better pre-season and god willing no serious injuries early on we have proven that we have the talent to match any oppostion.
Fair dinkum I have almost had enough of the sad sacks on this forum, you almost thrive on the sains failing so you can come on here and have a rant. For gods sake look up supporter in the dictionary and start acting like one, or p1ss off to carlton who deserve sh1t like this

[Saints Premiers 2008]

7.5 wins in the back half is completely acceptable for me

what do you all expect???just because we had a fairly decent team in the back half it automatically means we should win everything regardless of who we are playing???

thats a bit far fetched all these forum 'experts' staying the second half of our season was unnaceptable because we blew a few winnable games in similar positions...it happened...all will learn and move on

our team might have been strong on paper but considering some of the highly-skilled and sought after were returning from major injuries i think we should be happy with what happened

we pumped games into goose, lenny and most important kosi

and with the return of bj next year in a flankers role i would suspect (there is no point in overloading him with the role he had pre-injury) we should be set for a much improved 2008 and beyond

if you double the 7.5 wins that makes 15 wins in a season - to me that is acceptable...

[Red]

You can't judge a season by a half but by the whole and all excuses aside

we failed to make the 8 in the most open season for I don't know how

many years. The point is if we had finished in 8th spot we could have done

some real damage. So I believe the season was below par especially as a

lot of the injuries were preventable.

[Saints Premiers 2008]

normal order shall be restored next season...the season was open and being open...teams that shouldnt be there are and vice versa

we were just one of the ones that know our rightful place is way up in the 8

[meher baba]

Fair dinkum I have almost had enough of the sad sacks on this forum, you almost thrive on the sains failing so you can come on here and have a rant. For gods sake look up supporter in the dictionary and start acting like one, or p1ss off to carlton who deserve sh1t like this

The main purpose of these forums is for fans to come on and have an argument about the way the club and team are going, how it could be improved, etc. Otherwise there wouldn't be much to talk about except "OMG OMG isn't Dal hot" and so forth.

You have obviously chosen to abstain from these sorts of debates, which is presumably why you have made a grand total of 77 posts in 4 years.

BTW, I'm not too sure about your argument that the lack of a proper pre-season preparation leads to problems in the second half of the season. In 2005 and 2006 we had difficult starts to the season and came home like a ton of bricks. This year we didn't do that. I'm not sure it's all about preparation.

The traditional wisdom is that teams with better preparation end to come out of the blocks fast and then fade a bit as the season goes on: which is why we usually see at least one or two sides that didn't make the finals in the previous year bouncing off to a great start to the season and then fading away a bit as the teams that started their preparation later start to gain some form (although, this year, Geelong and Port have managed to keep it going all the way through).

[bigcarl]

my major concern in the second half was not the win/loss ratio but the way we played.

only once ... the fremantle game ... we played close to the levels we have shown we are capable of in recent seasons.

we showed similar spirit in the next game against west coast but in the end they ran us off our feet.

it highlighted to me that we need to find some talented runners to replace our ageing champion harvs.

the draw against the bulldogs was a very poor result

[saintsRrising]

What you fail to understand is that although we had a better list of players on the park for the second half, the majority of them had had either extended periods of time off the field and training track or very limited pre-seasons. This would explain why when we had plenty of run in the legs in the first half we were generally better ability wise than the opposition but in the second half we just ran out of legs. Surely with a better pre-season and god willing no serious injuries early on we have proven that we have the talent to match any oppostion.

ah...some common sense....



Anyone notice for eaxmple that Raph's last game, while still lacking, was much much superior to his first few back?

Marvelous what game time and fitness will do for you.....


Lenny was looking back in town too in his last couple of games.....I look forward to Lenny again being in the tp few elite mids in the competition in 2008.

[joffaboy]

Fair dinkum I have almost had enough of the sad sacks on this forum, you almost thrive on the sains failing so you can come on here and have a rant. For gods sake look up supporter in the dictionary and start acting like one, or p1ss off to carlton who deserve sh1t like this

Well why dont you just F*** off then/

Nobody is forcing you to post here.

Sounds like you are a control freak that cant accept an alternative opinion to your rose coloured, all is sunny opinion.

Well you may accept mediocrity in a 9th placed position and think all is good, but others dont find it acceptable.

if you dont like it bubbleboy, stiff!!!!!!!!!

[CURLY]

It amazes me when people like Rodgerfox write that we won against Adelaide but they had no backline yet expect us to win and play outstanding football with our injuries and interupted seasons. Seriously you wouldnt have backed any team with any coach to perform as well as we did this year.[/quote]

[markinUSA]

For me the best game of the season was Harve's 350th. Nuff said.

The worst game of the season for me was Collingwood.

The game that was most BORING to watch was Hawthorn - that was a disgrace. Hopefully we NEVER play another game like that ever again.

[rodgerfox]

what do you all expect???just because we had a fairly decent team in the back half it automatically means we should win everything regardless of who we are playing???

I expect us to win games that we should win.

We didn't.

[barks4eva]

I head Silvagni say this, and I also heard Lyon allude to it several times towards the end of the year as our season was slowly dying.

If I were to judge us on the 2nd half of the year, we failed horribly.

If I were to judge us on the first half, we performed better in my opinion.


The first half of the year was a wonderful effort. Incredibly decimated and getting used to new coaches and new players, but we won 4 games. Other clubs wouldn't have opened their account, and in some cases didn't.

But our 2nd half was what I found so disappointing. We had 1 great win. Against West Coast. But they were missing several key players.

We had a good win against Adelaide - but they had no backline.

The other wins we did have weren't impressive at all. Falling over the line against Richmond and Carlton is a disgrace.

Drawing with the Dogs and in particular the Collingwood loss were simply unacceptable. And totally winnable.

Every game we lost in the 2nd half of the year was winnable. We genuinely should have won them all (except the West Coast one in Perth).


We had a charmed draw in the 2nd half of the year, and had a very good injury list - 7 wins from 11 games isn't anything to brag about.


Please convince me that what we saw in the 2nd half of the year isn't what we are going to strive to achieve. If we accept that, we're in massive trouble.

Agree 100%

Obviously due to poor recruiting, no rookies except for Allan Murray for five years, and trading away or using eight selections including three first round, three second round and two third round draft selections on recycled players such as Brooks, McGough, Guerra, Ackland by the previous football department has kicked in and has sent the list into decline.

With no real kids coming through at this point except or Gilbert, god bless him we are due to neglect and mismanagement from the previous football department, about three to four young up and coming players behind where we should be.

Too much reliance on draft picks from five and six years ago without much real development since, due to Thomas topping up on duds.

Even last year when Lyon was appointed during the middle of trade week before his appointment a selection was already traded away on another dud in Birss.

This wastefullness must be nipped in the bud NOW!

We need to start developing some fresh young talent and using our selections wisely

Hopefully Armitage will come on quickly next year and we can also address our lack of pace

Our list would be in the bottom four in the AFL for lack of pace and this is another reason as to why we are being overrun.

We need some leg speed desperately.

The decline that was evident in 2006 continued on into 2007 and unless something is done to fix our RECRUITING, the real reason behind our below par performances, all the other nonsense that so many on here distract themselves with is about as relevant as a dildo in a nunnery.

[meher baba]

no rookies except for Allan Murray for five years

Josh Dicketts, Ben Schwarze, Chris Jones, Jordan Barham, Dylan Pfitzner, Nick Stone, Luke Mullins, Edward McDonnell and Cathal Corr.

Pray tell me what all these guys were doing at the club?

The idea that we didn't have any rookies under GT is a myth.

You might say that none of them turned out to be much good (although Schwarze did get a run at another AFL club, and Stone got to play 3 games of senior AFL, although to say he was nothing special is an understatement).

But how do we know that any of the five rookies we had this year (leaving aside Attard, who was drafted as a senior player at another club and who was elevated before the start of the season proper) are going to turn out to be any better?

I know that the powers at the club seem to be in love with CJ, but if he ends up as a better player than Allan Murray in the long run I'll be very suprised. As for the rest, we'll see.

Rookies are not, and will never be, a very important part of building a playing list for any Victorian club, and probably not for the Lions or the Swans either. (The WA and SA teams are in an entirely different situation: for them to select a rookie is like one of the better players in grade cricket being invited to train with the Pura Cup squad).

Enough about the rookies already!! Rookies, schmookies!!

[Brewer]

We had a couple of good wins in the second half of the season, but we had some shocking results too so I think the year was actually pretty even. Given that we were carrying so many injuries in the first half, I'd say there's some milage in the suggestion that we actually performed better earlier on.

If you look at our wins and losses, and our opponent's form at the time:

R01 Win +31 Melbourne, MCG
-Melbourne go on to prove their mettle by losing their first 9 games.

R02 Loss -52 Brisbane, Gabba
-Heavy loss to a side that wins only 4 of their first 13 games.

R03 Win +50 W. Bulldogs, TD
-Decent win, Doggies at 50% W/L after 10 rounds.

R04 Loss -31 Essendon, TD
-Bombers hardly on fire, winning only 2 of their first 7 rounds.

R05 Loss -53 Port Adelaide, AAMI
-Arguably first match against quality opposition in real form. We lose badly.

R06 Win +43 Carlton, TD
-Carlton win only 2 of their first 9 rounds and narrowly miss the wooden spoon.

R07 Win +26 Sydney, TD
-Sydney are in reasonable form, a good win by the Saints.

R08 Loss -28 Hawthorn, MCG
-Hawthorn in fair form, although they lost to Freo at Subi previous week.

R09 Loss -46 Fremantle, Subi
-Freo not that hot, sitting at 4/6 after first 10 rounds.

R10 Loss -60 Geelong, TD
-Arguably our second match against quality opposition in form. Again, we lose badly.

R11 Loss -22 Kangaroos, TD
-Roos hardly on fire, having been badly beaten by a weak WCE the week before and a weak Adelaide the week after.

R12 Win +23 WCE, Subi
-The win we still talk about. A good win whichever way you look at it, but WCE were missing key players and around this time they were also beaten by Hawks, Bombers, Brions and Port.

R13 Win +17 Richmond, TD
-Narrow win, at home, against the worst team in the comp.

R14 Loss -09 Collingwood, MCG
-Collingwood's form sitting on something like 65%. Result just about shows our relative level IMO.

R15 Win +02 Adelaide, TD
-The other win that made us think we were better than we were. A very narrow win, at home, against a travelling team that couldn't beat Essendon or Freo at the time.

R16 Win +17 Hawthorn, TD
-Our best win of the season IMO, notwithstanding the fairytale aspect of Bangers 350 at Subi. Hawthorn in good form.

R17 Win +10 Carlton, TD
Narrow win against the second worst team in the comp.

R18 Draw 00 W. Bulldogs, TD
-Bulldogs were about 50% W/L at this stage, and didn't win another game for the rest of the season.

R19 Loss -17 Sydney, TS
-Sydney were in good form, so a 17pt loss was probably about right compared to the rest of our season.

R20 Win +30 Fremantle, TD
-A good win, Freo finding form late in the season although they do struggle at Telstra Dome.

R21 Loss -08 WCE, TD
-We should be proud of this game, WCE were on fire at this stage and we nearly had them.

R22 Win +10 Richmond, MCG
-A narrow win against the worst team in the comp.

We had a couple of decent wins and a lot of very average results, so I'm not sure you could claim our second half actually proved anything - except that we simply weren't good enough this year to play in September.

[BAM! (shhhh)]

The decline that was evident in 2006 continued on into 2007 and unless something is done to fix our RECRUITING, the real reason behind our below par performances, all the other nonsense that so many on here distract themselves with is about as relevant as a dildo in a nunnery.

Better recruiting would be nice. I bet 15 other clubs would say the same, including the much vaunted Hawthorn, West Coast, an Port Adelaide teams.

Fact is, the Saints best 22 is a tough group to make. Fact is, it's hard to say who's on it, because the 2nd half of 2007 is the healthiest the Saints have really been since mid '05, and that's with 3 on the LTI list. Effect is that the Saints are not an attractive destination for players looking for opportunities. Effect is The Saints are not a team likely to call on the services of an 18 year old for any extended period.

Since Development takes time, it will only be moving forward that we really see much impact from post 2003 (when we drafted Raph Clarke and Sam Fisher, both playing in rd. 22, we've also got Watts who will sink or swim), the 2k4s have only just started to impact the league, and while McQualter is dissapointing at best, there's only a handful of guys out of that draft making any nosie at all... the only teams with any real return are Hawthorn (who had 2 top 5s) and Adelaide (who got Van Berlo and Knights). 2005 has looked more promising - we've gotten what we paid for out of Rix, and Gilbert has been fantastic. Jury is out on '07.

Given where the Saints are at, and where their picks have been, I'm not sure who these 4 stars of yours are... Richard Douglas? Darren Pfeiffer? James Ezard? Jayden Attard? (oh wait, we got him...)

Smart recruiting NOW will stand us in good stead for 2010. I'm a big fan of good recruitment, but honestly, I'm not that patient. What I'll be judging you man's recruiting on will be how the candidates step up to challenge for the full forward job. There are plenty of reasons the Saints had a bad '07, and didn't go as well in '06. Wishing for 4 more stars is just that. Wishing.

[evertonfc]

Fair dinkum I have almost had enough of the sad sacks on this forum, you almost thrive on the sains failing so you can come on here and have a rant. For gods sake look up supporter in the dictionary and start acting like one, or p1ss off to carlton who deserve sh1t like this

Well why dont you just F*** off then/

Nobody is forcing you to post here.

Sounds like you are a control freak that cant accept an alternative opinion to your rose coloured, all is sunny opinion.

Well you may accept mediocrity in a 9th placed position and think all is good, but others dont find it acceptable.

if you dont like it bubbleboy, stiff!!!!!!!!!

I've trained you well Joffa

Falling short feels like crap, doesn't it?

Ninth is unacceptable for a team with premiership aspirations.

[joffaboy]

I've trained you well Joffa

Falling short feels like crap, doesn't it?

Ninth is unacceptable for a team with premiership aspirations.

lol - never said otherwise.

Ninth is not and never is good enough.

Actually nothing short of 1st is good enough really.

Am also getting tired of the excuses. Sure we had injuries, a very bad run, but we seem to use this every year and every year our ladder position gets worse.

[The Saintsational Man]

Im sure all the saints boys would agree with us.....

Unacceptable on all accounts.....

Hard pre-season.....get in shape early.....start the season with an 'almost' injury free list.....begin our run at the flag!!!

[noreason41]

Actually nothing short of 1st is good enough really

Leigh Matthews said something about that:
"Anything aside from a premiership is a failure"

[Oh When the Saints]

We genuinely should have won them all

That is exactly why the second half of the season was good.

Ask yourself this:

Since the streak in '04, how often have we been in a position where we can correctly say that we should have won 11 in a row?

IMO never.


The very fact that we were in 11 matches right up until the last few minutes, and gave ourselves a chance to win 11 games, is a massive tick for the playing group.

Last year ... whilst we had some success, we never looked a chance in 3 of the games after the break (Adelaide, West Coast, Fremantle).


Even against Fremantle (first time), Kangaroos and Hawthorn (first time), we were in the match at three-quarter time.

With the one exception of the Geelong game, of the last 17 matches of the season, we were our own worst enemy.

Of those 17, we were in a position to win 16.

That's something that the Eagles, Sydney, Hawthorn and Port Adelaide can't say.


Now ... this is only a positive if you identify the factors that prevented you from winning 11 games in a row, address these factors, and turn the losses into victories in 2008.


What are these factors:
- Fitness (the major one IMO)
- Players returning from long-term injuries and not at their best
- Coaching style
- Leadership on-field
- Kicking for goal
- Disposal and decision-making



They are the areas that prevented us from winning 16 out of our last 17 ... a feat that was very achievable when you consider how easily those areas can be fixed.


Our average losing in the back half of 2007 was 11 points .... our average losing margin in the back half of 2006 was 43 points ...


People say that "we beat Collingwood last year by 50 points and this year we lost to them, despite them not improving".

Last year we also got smashed by Adelaide and West Coast ... this year we played much better football against those two sides and we looked like winning.


There are positives and negatives.


But the very fact that we were in a position to be 11-0 has to be a massive positive, considering we weren't in this position in 2006 ...

[barks4eva]

The decline that was evident in 2006 continued on into 2007 and unless something is done to fix our RECRUITING, the real reason behind our below par performances, all the other nonsense that so many on here distract themselves with is about as relevant as a dildo in a nunnery.

Better recruiting would be nice. I bet 15 other clubs would say the same, including the much vaunted Hawthorn, West Coast, an Port Adelaide teams.

Given where the Saints are at, and where their picks have been, I'm not sure who these 4 stars of yours are... Richard Douglas? Darren Pfeiffer? James Ezard? Jayden Attard? (oh wait, we got him...)

While Rendell and Thomas were asleep at the wheel giving away picks 6 and 31 for Brooks this is what was on offer

FYI , McIntosh was rated as the number ONE ruckman in the draft and Rendell chose with Thomas's tick of approval Barry Brooks and not only gave up pick 6 but threw in pick 31 as if 6 wasn't enough already

FAIR DINKUM

Yes I'm talking about PICK 6 in the draft

just pissed it up against the wall

2002 AFL National Draft

Round Pick Player Recruited from Club
1 1 Brendan Goddard Gippsland U18 St. Kilda
1 2 Daniel Wells Peel Thunder Football Club Kangaroos
1 3 Jared Brennan Southern Districts Football Club Brisbane Lions
1 4 Tim Walsh Northern U18 Western Bulldogs
1 5 Jarrad McVeigh NSW-ACT U18 Sydney Swans
1 6 Steven Salopek Dandenong U18 Port Adelaide
1 7 Andrew Mackie Glenelg Football Club Geelong
1 8 Luke Brennan Northern Ballarat Football Club Hawthorn
1 9 Hamish McIntosh Murray U18 Kangaroos
1 10 Jason Laycock Tasmania U18 Essendon
1 11 Jason Winderlich Gippsland U18 Essendon
1 12 Jay Schulz Woodville-West Torrens Football Club Richmond
1 13 Byron Schammer West Adelaide Football Club Fremantle
1 14 Daniel Bell Glenelg Football Club Melbourne
1 15 Nicholas Smith Norwood Football Club Melbourne
1 16 Stephen Gilham Oakleigh U18 Port Adelaide
1 17 Cameron Faulkner Central Districts Football Club Western Bulldogs
1 18 Kris Shore Eastern U18 Kangaroos
1 19 Troy Selwood Bendigo U18 Brisbane Lions
1 20 Will Minson Norwood Football Club Western Bulldogs
1 21 Bo Nixon Calder Cannons Collingwood
2 22 Matthew Ferguson Gippsland U18 St. Kilda
2 23 Tom Lonergan Calder Cannons Geelong
2 24 Paul Johnson Dandenong U18 West Coast Eagles
2 25 Callum Urch Western U18 Kangaroos
2 26 Jared Rivers North Adelaide Football Club Melbourne
2 27 Darren Walsh Sandringham U18 Essendon
2 28 Tristan Cartledge North Ballarat U18 Essendon
2 29 Luke Shackleton Tasmania U18 Collingwood
2 30 Daniel Merrett Southport Football Club Brisbane Lions

2 31 Joel Perry Eastern U18 Kangaroos
2 32 Luke Jericho West Adelaide Football Club Adelaide Crows
2 33 Brad Murphy Clader Cannons Western Bulldogs
2 F/S 34 Sean Dempster Calder Cannons Sydney Swans
2 35 Scott Bassett Port Adelaide Magpies Western Bulldogs
2 F/S 36 Tim Callen Geelong U18 Geelong
2 37 Brent Staker NSW-ACT U18 West Coast Eagles
2 38 Blake Grima Eastern U18 Kangaroos
2 39 Gary Moorcroft Essendon Melbourne
2 F/S 40 Jobe Watson Sndringham U18 Essendon
2 41 Tim Fleming Carlton Richmond
2 F/S 42 Brett Ebert Port Adelaide Magpies Port Adelaide
2 43 Cameron Cloke Eastern U18 Collingwood
2 44 Anthony Corrie Nightcliff Football Club Brisbane Lions
3 45 Kade Simpson Eastern U18 Carlton
3 46 Leigh Fisher Sandringham U18 St. Kilda
3 47 Bill Nicholls Hawthorn Richmond
3 48 Greg Edgcumbe Eastern U18 Fremantle
3 49 Cameron Wight Calder Cannons Western Bulldogs
3 50 Josh Thewlis Bendigo Bombers Sydney Swans
3 51 Tim Boyle Geelong U18 Hawthorn
3 52 Pass Geelong
3 53 Adam Selwood Bendigo Bombers West Coast Eagles
3 54 Cameron Hunter Calder Cannons Melbourne
3 55 Ryan Crowley Calder Cannons Fremantle
3 56 Robert Shirley Adelaide Crows Adelaide Crows
3 57 Wade Champion West Adelaide Football Club Port Adelaide
3 58 David King Glenelg Football Club Collingwood
3 59 Pass Brisbane Lions
4 60 Cameron Croad Oakleigh U18 Carlton
4 61 Pass St. Kilda
4 62 Daniel Sipthorp Calder Cannons Richmond
4 63 Brett Doswell NSW-ACT U18 Fremantle
4 64 Nick Malceski Eastern U18 Sydney Swans
4 65 Lochlan Veale Geelong U18 Hawthorn
4 66 Ryan Ferguson Frankston Football Club Melbourne
4 67 Steven Alessio Essendon Essendon
4 68 James Begley St. Kilda Adelaide Crows
4 69 Pass Port Adelaide
4 70 Matthew Lokan Port Adelaide Magpies Collingwood
4 71 Pass Brisbane Lions
5 72 Brad Fisher Eastern U18 Carlton
5 73 Pass St. Kilda
5 74 Pass Richmond
5 75 Pass Fremantle
5 76 Pass Sydney Swans
5 77 Pass Adelaide Crows
5 78 Pass Brisbane Lions
6 79 Karl Norman Wangaratta Rovers Carlton
6 80 Pass St. Kilda
6 81 Pass Richmond
6 82 Pass Fremantle
6 83 Pass Sydney Swans
7 84 Mick Martyn Kangaroos Carlton
7 85 Pass St. Kilda
7 86 Pass Richmond
7 87 Pass Fremantle
8 88 Pass

Pick 6 and 31 for Brooks


McIntosh + one of the Selwood brothers or Brooks


Just one example of how we stuffed up our recruting and there are many, many others

We had pick 6 in the draft and gave it away for what? and we threw in a second round selection 31 as if 6 wasn't enough for Brooks

yeah yeah, hindsight is a wonderful thing, but McIntosh was highly rated as the number one ruckman in the draft and he went at 9

FAIR DINKUM

[Dan Warna]

yes and with mcintosh spending 4 seasons doing nothing till 07, most of the supporters here would have demanded he be delisted for everyone one of those years.

of course if he came good in 07 as he did for north they would have all 'called it '

as for salopek we were accroding to some going to pick him with pick 3 as goddard adn wells would have already gone to carlton right?