**** WE NEED BEN COUSINS ****

[One Eyed Saint]

Watching the game today, I realised how deficient we are of quality mids.

Cousins will help us stay top 4-6, maybe better.

If we don't get Cousins (or Kerr) and our young kids don't develop very quickly, other sides will pass us by. We will be bottom eight for a while.

Sponsors don't give a s*** about rebuilding and developing a side, they want success now.... and so do I.

Please St Kilda, do whatever you can to get Benny.

[SaintWal]

I tend to agree with OES. Although Cousins is not the answer. He is a one or two year proposition at best, sure the upside is good but the downside could be catastrophic for this football club.

[One Eyed Saint]

Saint Wal,

Two years ago I watched Benny & Kerr tear us up at the Dome.

Those two were a cut above Lenny, Ball etc.

He may be short term (2-3 years) but he can the set the standard (on-field) for our young midfielders to aspire.

Yeah, he's a risk but he is an elite midfielder.

Q. Do we get him now and try and win a flag, or wait to see the best of out young developing mids when lenny retires and bally and dal are in their last years?

He maybe a risk, but if he helped get us a flag it's worth it.

[SENsei]

My opinion.

The future isn't found by looking in the past. Cousins will not carry us forward to a premiership on his own. Not as a 31yo who has been out of the game for over 12 months and had three hamstrings in his last football year.

I'm against topping up. Pick up youngsters. The two top teams at the moment, Geelong and Hawthorn, are showing what can be done with building teams of talented youngsters.

[One Eyed Saint]

Maybe so,

If we slide, and become a bottom eight side we will find it hard to get new sponsors and new members.

To be financially competitive (and viable) we need to grow both of these areas to match the top clubs.

In 2-3 years Roo, Dal, BJ etc will be at peak or just past.

If we don't have a red hot crack in the next 2-3 years, the following few years might be lean pickings.

[SENsei]

Yeah, but by getting a risky player in Cousins, isn't a solution. Sure, we may go down the ladder by picking up youngsters. But if we are serious about building for sustained success on field (afterall, that's what it's all about - forget sponsors or the like), then we just have to look at the big picture.

Topping up historically just doesn't work in my view. Especially not by picking up 31 year olds.

[One Eyed Saint]

Can you spend another 5-10 years waiting for a premiership?

[felixleo]

Whats another 5 or 10 on top of 42 or are you just another fair weather supporter.

[SENsei]

Wouldn't necessarily take that long. Hawthorn was last in the finals in 2001 or 2002. Now they are looking at 10 years of sustained success. Geelong were not down in the last 6-7 years other than one.

Cousins is one almighty risk. Even if it pays off, I can't see what difference on player will make.

We need a key backman, a key forward and two ruckman plus some depth.

It's not one player that will make the difference, it's the depth of our list. The bottom 6-8 players in the team.

Cousins could ensure we are competitive for another year or two fighting for a top four spot. Terrific. Then what? By then, a good youngster could have 40-50 games under his belt, and ten years in front of him.

If Cousins is picked or we trade for another recycled player from another club I will be extremely disappointed. Why pick up other rejects?

[One Eyed Saint]

Wouldn't mind seeing a premiership sooner rather than later.

I'm guessing you enjoy watching finals series seeing us fall short or not their at all?

[SENsei]

OES, is that directed at me or felix?

[One Eyed Saint]

With GC and West Syndey coming in, are we going to be in a position in a few years to draft another Kosi, Roo, BJ, Ball etc.

I really doubt we will have the same opportunity.

The guys above are in their prime NOW, in a few years they won't be leading our charge to a flag.

[One Eyed Saint]

SEN, directed at felix who's posts are much lest constructive than yours

[SENsei]

Kosi is in his prime now? Seriously?

Here's what I would do: Trade Kosi to a team with high draft picks, get two high picks and get two highly rated youngsters in this draft.

You are right, the draft after this is going to be pretty shabby. Now is the time.

Don't waste it on a Cousins. If we are going to make a bold, big call, this year is the year.

Look to top up and I could just about guarantee it will turn pearshaped and will be down the bottom for a sustained period, not the reverse.

Now off to have a nightmare about today's game.

[felixleo]

Of course i would rather have success sooner than later but feel a quick fix is not possible under the current rules and agree with sensational that a prolonged development with the best youth available to us is the only way to go. That we have not groomed suitable young players to replace aussie,black,voss,powell,peckett etc and tried to trade replacements instead is why we are struggling now.

[SENsei]

That we have not groomed suitable young players to replace aussie,black,voss,powell,peckett etc and tried to trade replacements instead is why we are struggling now.

Agree with that statement.

[Teflon]

My opinion.

The future isn't found by looking in the past. Cousins will not carry us forward to a premiership on his own. Not as a 31yo who has been out of the game for over 12 months and had three hamstrings in his last football year.

I'm against topping up. Pick up youngsters. The two top teams at the moment, Geelong and Hawthorn, are showing what can be done with building teams of talented youngsters.

Not that simple.

Geeelong took a "year off" in 06, missed finals grabbed J Sellwod (awesome get) AND have never needed to bottom out while father/sons of the calibre of Abletts, Hawkings and others walked in (I know theres more cant be stuffed looking)

Hawks drank long and deep from the draft, stayed bottom cedllar for years got lucky with a good draft (as did we) and are now where we were in 04.

Point is our core group of elites are 24/25 - theres probably 8 or 9 you could build round solidly BUT if you go the path of "lets take all kids" be prepared to not see this core reach the top in the next few years while your kods develop. By the time you "maybe" get a gun grouo together Riewoldts 30.

We either make the decision to cut deep this core deep, total rebuild like and draft youth OR we decide we can complement this core with some elite for another tilt in the next 2yrs...aka get Cousins.

[One Eyed Saint]

Teflon, couldn't agree more.

This up coming trade period and draft is the most important in the last 5 years and in the next 5 years. It will either set us up for a tilt at a flag or put us on the path of rebuilding and development.

We can win a flag in the next 2-3 years if we trade/draft well this year.

If we don't...... well, I don't like to think about the alternative.

[Sainternist]

Initially I wasn't for this, but now I'm actually not opposed to the idea of getting Cousins.

With Harves gone next year, Cousins, if he has his head screwed on, could be somewhat of a replacement.

[felixleo]

One eyed saint, who are you going to trade and what picks are you going to give up for cuz? Would you agree that Ball,S.Fisher,B.J.,Lenny,Rooey are untouchable? That leaves you with Kosi ,Del ,Joey and the Clarkes to trade .As to give away any of the promising youngsters (Allen,Armitage,Howard,Jones,Mcevoy and Steven) would be the surest folly in the current climate. Regarding picks this draft is supposed to go fairly deep , thank God for that as we wont get an early one and as this will be our last run at an uncomprimised draft for a few years any first round pick is gold. So weigh it up is Cuz going to win you a premiership I don't think so, but thats me. I say stick with what we have got,develop them and what we get , see where we are at down the track and then trade for what we need only if that is vital for a serious tilt at the flag.We all know our current group playing their best can beat anyone but its all about bringing there worst closer to their best, thats why I called you an addled imbred fool (a good insult I thought at the time) thats my opinion but they are like assholes.(everyones got one)

[SENsei]

Don't have to trade for Cousins, he's uncontracted.

My objection is on philosophical grounds. Topping up v building up

[plugger66]

Wouldn't mind seeing a premiership sooner rather than later.

I'm guessing you enjoy watching finals series seeing us fall short or not their at all?

Tell me what Cousins would have done yesterday. We still would have been killed. He has 2 years at best left and who is to say he will get near his best again. If we should go for anyone it should be Kerr as he has a good 6 years left but neither will win us a flag unless owe bottom 6 players improve.

[kaos theory]

Don't have to trade for Cousins, he's uncontracted.

My objection is on philosophical grounds. Topping up v building up

There is yet to be a team that has won a flag through years of bottoming out & collecting draft picks to win a flag.

Its always a combination of MANY factors that determine who wins a flag or not.

Our midfield is WAY off the best atm.

We need cousins AND Kerr to compete with the cats' midfield (wont happen though....)

There is an illusion that somehow you magically create a team of certain future champions & a flag, when you get a couple of top draft picks....

Many don't meet expectations, and you have wasted years of development, loss oppotunities, supporters, money etc...

[SENsei]

Never said anything about bottoming out.

Smart recruiting and trading is the go.

Two things we haven't been very good at.

[Saintschampions08]

Kosi is in his prime now? Seriously?

Here's what I would do: Trade Kosi to a team with high draft picks, get two high picks and get two highly rated youngsters in this draft.

You are right, the draft after this is going to be pretty shabby. Now is the time.

Don't waste it on a Cousins. If we are going to make a bold, big call, this year is the year.

Look to top up and I could just about guarantee it will turn pearshaped and will be down the bottom for a sustained period, not the reverse.

Now off to have a nightmare about today's game.

Name one club that would trade Kosi for 2 high draft picks..

I mean while were out trading Kosi for first rounders, why don't we throw in Fiora and look to trade for Bartel & Ablett