Looking back at 09 and 10 off-seasons

[bergholt]

This suggests that our 2009 and 2010 off-seasons were right up there with the worst of all time:

https://www.draftguru.com.au/draft-seasons/worst

Agree or disagree?

[White Winmar]

Wow. This is one of those occasions that statistics don't lie. Disastrous. We have certainly paid the price over the past three years.

[ace]

Worst Ever



Nothing but consistent.
Out of 258 (16 years of drafts)
2000 to 2004 were OK because we had really early obvious picks
The recruiters should pay every cent thy were paid back

2010 5th
2009 2nd
2008 30th
2007 177th
2006 134th
2005 48th
2004 152th
2003 225th
2002 173th
2001 249th
2000 242th
1999 188th
1998 195th
1997 14th
1996 237th

[ace]

1986 draft not one player got a senior game.
Probably because we had a team that was winning back to back to back premierships then.




Or was that Hawthorn and us winning wooden spoons

[bergholt]

1986 draft not one player got a senior game.

1986 was a lottery, no-one did well back then.

[BigMart]

There was a poster who people tried to run out of town, when he dared to critisise the drafting (and development) in that period... At the time.

Now it's allowed

[Teflon]

There was a poster who people tried to run out of town, when he dared to critisise the drafting (and development) in that period... At the time.

Now it's allowed

Who was that man BM do tell us?

[dragit]

I feel like we've been here before?

The worst, agreed.

[gringo]

What was interesting was how many bad ones Geelong has had but they are regarded as geniuses in the draft. The difference was in most of those years they got one or two guns while we had some absolute crap years.

[Spinner]

What a great site!

2013 looking superb! Could beat geelongs 1999 eventually. All look to continue to rack up the games

[Bluthy]

Would be very interesting to see what is the strike rate of Freo's draftee's under Mr Lyon in a few years. If young players aren't getting encouragement and regular feedback during the difficult formative years, then it puts them right up against it from the get go. Apparently Lyon doesn't have much to do with those not in his top 25. That probably also then influence how much attention the top tier players will give to young players. A young player could very easily get lost down at Sandy if he's not getting the direction and push he needs from the top echelon at the club.

[Munga]

What a great site!

2013 looking superb! Could beat geelongs 1999 eventually. All look to continue to rack up the games

Our 2013 batch is the best of all the 2013 clubs, and our 2014 equal first. 2015 should be pretty decent too!

[ripplug66]

Would be very interesting to see what is the strike rate of Freo's draftee's under Mr Lyon in a few years. If young players aren't getting encouragement and regular feedback during the difficult formative years, then it puts them right up against it from the get go. Apparently Lyon doesn't have much to do with those not in his top 25. That probably also then influence how much attention the top tier players will give to young players. A young player could very easily get lost down at Sandy if he's not getting the direction and push he needs from the top echelon at the club.

So players that aren't good enough would have made it if given games? The reason we drafted poorly was lack of resources and after RL realised we couldn't drat he punted on proven ordinary players in the hope of getting one that would get us over the lines. Our drafting was poor for years. Started under GT and continued under RL until we realised you need to put money into it. Also we get btter picks as we progressed down the ladder.

If not getting a game was the issue then may of those drafted would have been picked up by other clubs. The main issue is it was terrible drafting and started about 2005.

[gringo]

Would be very interesting to see what is the strike rate of Freo's draftee's under Mr Lyon in a few years. If young players aren't getting encouragement and regular feedback during the difficult formative years, then it puts them right up against it from the get go. Apparently Lyon doesn't have much to do with those not in his top 25. That probably also then influence how much attention the top tier players will give to young players. A young player could very easily get lost down at Sandy if he's not getting the direction and push he needs from the top echelon at the club.

I reckon it's much harder to get games into kids and also have access when you are at the top of the ladder for extended periods. The system is weighted towards equalisation. Teams like Melbourne who stay perennially down and team like Geelong who do it the opposite are the exceptions. Guys like Weller and Hartung probably would play a lot more footy at a club like melbourne or St kilda so they are more likely to flourish and also less likely to leave for opportunity. If we had been playing guys like Jamie Cripps and Tom Lynch more they might have stayed at the Saints.

[ripplug66]

Would be very interesting to see what is the strike rate of Freo's draftee's under Mr Lyon in a few years. If young players aren't getting encouragement and regular feedback during the difficult formative years, then it puts them right up against it from the get go. Apparently Lyon doesn't have much to do with those not in his top 25. That probably also then influence how much attention the top tier players will give to young players. A young player could very easily get lost down at Sandy if he's not getting the direction and push he needs from the top echelon at the club.

I reckon it's much harder to get games into kids and also have access when you are at the top of the ladder for extended periods. The system is weighted towards equalisation. Teams like Melbourne who stay perennially down and team like Geelong who do it the opposite are the exceptions. Guys like Weller and Hartung probably would play a lot more footy at a club like melbourne or St kilda so they are more likely to flourish and also less likely to leave for opportunity. If we had been playing guys like Jamie Cripps and Tom Lynch more they might have stayed at the Saints.

Cripps would never have stayed but I'm sure Lynch would have. Cripps was actually played a lot in his first year but injury wrecked his season. Lynch played 5 in his last year with us and 6 in his first year with Adelaide. Luckily for him 2 forwards were injured and he got his chance and took it. he is the exception though. Most usually just aren't good enough.

[Bluthy]

Would be very interesting to see what is the strike rate of Freo's draftee's under Mr Lyon in a few years. If young players aren't getting encouragement and regular feedback during the difficult formative years, then it puts them right up against it from the get go. Apparently Lyon doesn't have much to do with those not in his top 25. That probably also then influence how much attention the top tier players will give to young players. A young player could very easily get lost down at Sandy if he's not getting the direction and push he needs from the top echelon at the club.

I reckon it's much harder to get games into kids and also have access when you are at the top of the ladder for extended periods. The system is weighted towards equalisation. Teams like Melbourne who stay perennially down and team like Geelong who do it the opposite are the exceptions. Guys like Weller and Hartung probably would play a lot more footy at a club like melbourne or St kilda so they are more likely to flourish and also less likely to leave for opportunity. If we had been playing guys like Jamie Cripps and Tom Lynch more they might have stayed at the Saints.

It's not just about senior games. Because of the strength of their list, Hawthorn have had a lot of young players playing VFL for years and most of them are happy to stay until they get their shot. Paddy has played a fair bit of VFL and he doesn't look unhappy. The old reserves for a few years then senior VFL system used to work well because they were treated as one club.

It's all about how much a part of the club they feel and if they are able to access high quality coaching and development and inspiration to push themselves. I think the reality was that a lot of our young players pre-Richo era just didn't get the development they needed and got lost. We lament the kicking of a lot of our players as if we drafted bad kickers but that too can be poor technique or lack of situational awareness and decision making. On the radio someone said Hawthorn have classes where they learn how to learn

It makes such a difference when everyone in the club is pulling in the same direction. It shouldn't come down to how the senior coach wants to work. Direction starts at the top and we seem to have that now and I think we're seeing the results already with the kids and the competition for spots. WE're like a stove with all burners and the oven going instead of just one pot cooking

[hayes66]

Mark Hutchings???
Exception or just not good enough?

Yeah Lyon realised after 07 when St Kilda took McEvoy at nine and then didn't have a pick till 42 and took Steven, that there were signs, the recruiting wasn't up to it!
In 08 to take Lynch a third forward at 13 when we already had McQualtor and Eddy for that role was a waste.
To rub salt into the wound our next pick was 47 and to take Stanley well!!! Have to be the worst in the league.
So in 09 Ross decided after those muck ups we need to recycle and trade.
On reflection you really can see why he became so frustrated!!

[hayes66]

Sorry i have mentioned two years.
And, unless l am mistaken the Lyon era was mentioned, so i have looked at those years.
Yes Winmar was a mistake what pick was he again?
Top ten? no, top twenty no or 30 that's right a mistake.
Amazing you don't mention the pick and where it was!!!!

[gringo]

Would be very interesting to see what is the strike rate of Freo's draftee's under Mr Lyon in a few years. If young players aren't getting encouragement and regular feedback during the difficult formative years, then it puts them right up against it from the get go. Apparently Lyon doesn't have much to do with those not in his top 25. That probably also then influence how much attention the top tier players will give to young players. A young player could very easily get lost down at Sandy if he's not getting the direction and push he needs from the top echelon at the club.

I reckon it's much harder to get games into kids and also have access when you are at the top of the ladder for extended periods. The system is weighted towards equalisation. Teams like Melbourne who stay perennially down and team like Geelong who do it the opposite are the exceptions. Guys like Weller and Hartung probably would play a lot more footy at a club like melbourne or St kilda so they are more likely to flourish and also less likely to leave for opportunity. If we had been playing guys like Jamie Cripps and Tom Lynch more they might have stayed at the Saints.

It's not just about senior games. Because of the strength of their list, Hawthorn have had a lot of young players playing VFL for years and most of them are happy to stay until they get their shot. Paddy has played a fair bit of VFL and he doesn't look unhappy. The old reserves for a few years then senior VFL system used to work well because they were treated as one club.

It's all about how much a part of the club they feel and if they are able to access high quality coaching and development and inspiration to push themselves. I think the reality was that a lot of our young players pre-Richo era just didn't get the development they needed and got lost. We lament the kicking of a lot of our players as if we drafted bad kickers but that too can be poor technique or lack of situational awareness and decision making. On the radio someone said Hawthorn have classes where they learn how to learn

It makes such a difference when everyone in the club is pulling in the same direction. It shouldn't come down to how the senior coach wants to work. Direction starts at the top and we seem to have that now and I think we're seeing the results already with the kids and the competition for spots. WE're like a stove with all burners and the oven going instead of just one pot cooking

I think in a club like Hawthorn or Geelong the coaching staff is so big you know where you are sitting in the plans. I think when Ross was with us there were not enough staff to really spend time talking through the progression for their career. I heard Geelong have one coach for every 4 players or something including VFL. Under Ross we had 3 assistants and a VFL coach I think. I guess it's about selling the vision to the player and seeing it through. I have spoken to a few fringe guys and spoken to a relative of a player and there is a suggestion that we still aren't great if you aren't playing regular seniors.

[Spinner]

There was a poster who people tried to run out of town, when he dared to critisise the drafting (and development) in that period... At the time.

Now it's allowed

Jamie Cripps still going alright, even played in a GF albeit without a photo on draft day.

People criticised your reasoning. Such as the one provided by your very self. No photo on the afl draft tracker on draft day equaled a terrible decision.

[BigMart]

Jamie Cripps played in a GF

So did Robert Eddy

Both great players who had great GFs

He wasn't a poor player because he had no photo... He was a a bit of a roughie in the fact he was not an expected pick at 24 by us... And most people would have not had him on our RADAR at that pick. Did you??

He is an average player IMO
Because he's soft as butter (by afl standards) and he pulled out in the GF (of all days, when even softies go hard) just to illustrate that he doesn't like the contest

It's my opinion
And I'm entitled to it

[BigMart]

Cripps was a resounding success at pick 24
He played less than 30 uninspiring games at the club

Also
What about my criticism of

Polo
Pattison
Johnson
Howard
Sweeney
And of course
Lovett

Why not mention those...

[ripplug66]

Wowee

[satchmo]

It's like déjà vu all over again.

[maverick]

Cripps was a resounding success at pick 24
He played less than 30 uninspiring games at the club

Also
What about my criticism of

Polo
Pattison
Johnson
Howard
Sweeney
And of course
Lovett

Why not mention those...

Why would anyone need when you will do so yourself… many times.