Questions re Richo's ability

[terry smith rules]

It is wonderful that we have a game plan and that there is confidence in it.

But surely when we are about to play a team like the Dogs with their obvious style we have a Plan B or a Plan C

How could the dogs defence be allowed to have up to 3 loose and sweep the ball forward RELENTLESSLY

Why can't Sinclair (or someone) be put on Johnaissen and told just run with him?

Now maybe the players simply don't have the smarts to be able to change. But surely that is what our coach is there to do. We need to be able to adapt when our system is not working, otherwise we are in for a world of pain.

Finally, what really worries me is that we now have teams of it seems of 15 running/midfielders who can't do anything outside their comfort zone

[HitTheBoundary]

At least we got to round two before the coach's ability was questioned......

We can have 50 game plans, but if we keep handballing/kicking to the opposition then the plan goes out the window.

The game plan looked good when Billings had the ball.

[matrix]

Ive got a feeling theres more than one game plan
Possibly more than two

[terry smith rules]

Ive got a feeling theres more than one game plan
Possibly more than two

well then why wasn't there one on show demonstrating a defence plan to deal with the dogs run

[Legendary]

There weren't too many questions about Richo's game plan at 3Qtr time against Port in Round 1....

Have a look at Freo v Bulldogs in Round 1. Freo looked exactly like St Kilda, and Ross the Boss made some moves and switched it up and it had no effect.

[terry smith rules]

There weren't too many questions about Richo's game plan at 3Qtr time against Port in Round 1....

Have a look at Freo v Bulldogs in Round 1. Freo looked exactly like St Kilda, and Ross the Boss made some moves and switched it up and it had no effect.

that's not the point

the point is about ability to change

and against port it was more often than not there poor game plan as was evidenced on the weekend that allowed us goals over the top, not necessarily our plan

[lefty]

Richo's gameplan in Round 1 was the same as Round 2.

It is to handball the ball out of the back line (maybe 2-3 handballs), try to break the lines, then kick it over the top and get goals that way.

Though it doesn't work well, because..

1. We handball to players 5m away standing still.
2. After the 3rd or so handball, the player was under pressure and had no one to kick to, so decides to do 10-15 meter dicky kicks that ended up in turnovers (monty a classic example).

I'd much rather Bulldogs game plan, which is the old fashioned, handball it out the back of the contest in the backline, and then kick wide to a lose defender who then runs forward with the ball.

Happened every single time yet nothing was done about it.

Left the game utterly disappointed. I don't think there was 1 positive thing to come out of it.

It wasn't like we lost, we gave a good effort / can see improvement etc etc, it was more like 'that was the worst game of football I've watched'.

The only thing I liked was that Paddy looked much better built, slimmer and moving much faster than last year.

[Con Gorozidis]

The trouble with patting ourselves on the back for the Port game is that Port are sh*t.
Sure they will be sitting 2-1 after beating the Bombers this week but they are no good. Will be 8-10th again.

[saynta]

The trouble with patting ourselves on the back for the Port game is that Port are sh*t.
Sure they will be sitting 2-1 after beating the Bombers this week but they are no good. Will be 8-10th again.

I'd be wrapped with an 8-10 finish

[Con Gorozidis]

Richo's gameplan in Round 1 was the same as Round 2.

It is to handball the ball out of the back line (maybe 2-3 handballs), try to break the lines, then kick it over the top and get goals that way.

Though it doesn't work well, because..

1. We handball to players 5m away standing still.
2. After the 3rd or so handball, the player was under pressure and had no one to kick to, so decides to do 10-15 meter dicky kicks that ended up in turnovers (monty a classic example).

I'd much rather Bulldogs game plan, which is the old fashioned, handball it out the back of the contest in the backline, and then kick wide to a lose defender who then runs forward with the ball.

Happened every single time yet nothing was done about it.

Left the game utterly disappointed. I don't think there was 1 positive thing to come out of it.

It wasn't like we lost, we gave a good effort / can see improvement etc etc, it was more like 'that was the worst game of football I've watched'.

The only thing I liked was that Paddy looked much better built, slimmer and moving much faster than last year.

Agree but we dont have the personnel to run with the footy out of our defence. Joey does it a bit but is always looking for the dinky '1-2' (the Trent Cotchin special) to get his stats up. Savage used to do it but he now just goes backwards every time he gets it. We need D-Mac in the side. Newnes should be switched permanently to defence and Webster needs to lift his game. The rest are useless.

[Con Gorozidis]

The trouble with patting ourselves on the back for the Port game is that Port are sh*t.
Sure they will be sitting 2-1 after beating the Bombers this week but they are no good. Will be 8-10th again.

I'd be wrapped with an 8-10 finish

I mean Port 8-10th.
We are certainties for bottom 6. 13th the absolute best we can hope for.

[St Chris]

I think we're still at the stage where we're a lot more interested in getting our ball movement working the way we want, rather than worrying too much about what the opposition is doing.

A couple of times it did work and it looked good. Creating an overlap coming out of the back line with handballs, just too many rushed handballs due to pressure, and poor decisions once we got past halfway killed us.

This was our first test against immense pressure this year, and we failed. So we go and work harder on getting it right, and tweak as necessary.

Thank god Saintsational doesn't run the club. We've played twice and we already would have delisted half the list, and sacked the coach.

[Con Gorozidis]

I think we're still at the stage where we're a lot more interested in getting our ball movement working the way we want, rather than worrying too much about what the opposition is doing.

A couple of times it did work and it looked good. Creating an overlap coming out of the back line with handballs, just too many rushed handballs due to pressure, and poor decisions once we got past halfway killed us.

This was our first test against immense pressure this year, and we failed. So we go and work harder on getting it right, and tweak as necessary.

Thank god Saintsational doesn't run the club. We've played twice and we already would have delisted half the list, and sacked the coach.

But it isnt really just the 2 games is it. In the last 50 games - we have won 11. That is 22% win 78% loss.

That is enough data to suggest the program is not A Grade.

[saynta]

Thank god Saintsational doesn't run the club. We've played twice and we already would have delisted half the list, and sacked the coach.

Amen brother. And Lenny, Armo and a couple of others wouldn't have been given a second year.

The negative s*** really wears me down.

[Con Gorozidis]

Thank god Saintsational doesn't run the club. We've played twice and we already would have delisted half the list, and sacked the coach.

Amen brother. And Lenny, Armo and a couple of others wouldn't have been given a second year.

The negative s*** really wears me down.

How so - point me to one post that someone has called for a 1st year player to be de-listed? Straw man.
I also havent seen anyone want to sack the coach.

Not even a microwaved membership yet. Although the club accidentally sent me two membership cards this year - so i do have a spare 'microwaveable' one if required

[terry smith rules]

Thank god Saintsational doesn't run the club. We've played twice and we already would have delisted half the list, and sacked the coach.

Amen brother. And Lenny, Armo and a couple of others wouldn't have been given a second year.

The negative s*** really wears me down.

and tell me where anyone has said sack the coach

it's about having a conversation about what us as members and supporters see each week

and frankly why shouldn't we be a little negative

we were awful on Saturday and it is a natural reaction

[perfectionist]

... Lenny, Armo and a couple of others wouldn't have been given a second year...

Anyone who saw Lenny's first few games knew he was going to be a champ. I can recall Kevin Sheedy making a very positive statement about him right after the game in which we thrashed them in 1999 (we even thought Timmy was good coach at that stage). Lenny got only a few possessions but what he did with them was all class. David Armitage, on the other hand, never had the basics to work with - the basics being the ability to kick or handball to a teammate either side. I can also recall him being literally led around the field at training to show him where he should run to. It was only in his fifth season that he scored a permanent place in the team - largely because we had no-one else. If you are slow, like Lenny and David (and Sam Mitchell and Greg Williams), then you must be able to kick both feet and handball both hands.

On the OP, no coach who has ever coached a team ever would be able to turn so many unskilled players into a winning outfit, let alone a finals team. He is only to blame to the extent that he is responsible for recruiting those member of the current playing personnel at the club, and that's not many. But I guess that won't save him at the end of the year if we finish 0-22.

[saynta]

... Lenny, Armo and a couple of others wouldn't have been given a second year...

Anyone who saw Lenny's first few games knew he was going to be a champ. I can recall Kevin Sheedy making a very positive statement about him right after the game in which we thrashed them in 1999 (we even thought Timmy was good coach at that stage). Lenny got only a few possessions but what he did with them was all class. David Armitage, on the other hand, never had the basics to work with - the basics being the ability to kick or handball to a teammate either side. I can also recall him being literally led around the field at training to show him where he should run to. It was only in his fifth season that he scored a permanent place in the team - largely because we had no-one else. If you are slow, like Lenny and David (and Sam Mitchell and Greg Williams), then you must be able to kick both feet and handball both hands.

On the OP, no coach who has ever coached a team ever would be able to turn so many unskilled players into a winning outfit, let alone a finals team. He is only to blame to the extent that he is responsible for recruiting those member of the current playing personnel at the club, and that's not many. But I guess that won't save him at the end of the year if we finish 0-22.

Hear what you say about lenny and agree with you. Didn't stop the armchair critics on here though.

Don't agree with you on Armo though. He was , like Ross, always going to be a player.

[terry smith rules]

On the OP, no coach who has ever coached a team ever would be able to turn so many unskilled players into a winning outfit, let alone a finals team. He is only to blame to the extent that he is responsible for recruiting those member of the current playing personnel at the club, and that's not many. But I guess that won't save him at the end of the year if we finish 0-22.

Well then no your limitations, keep it simple. Start with accountability and learning to defend.

I don't mind that Gresham's handball gets intercepted, he was having a go.

What I don't like is that the Bulldog defence were for the most part completely left to run riot, our defence did ok considering the amount of entries and the speed in which it got there

[saint-stu]

Based on interviews with Richo, I think he knows how he wants the team to play, but execution is the issue. We're looking long term, so maybe its better to keep practicing the gameplan rather than try a different plan and maybe scrounge a few extra wins this year.

[lefty]

Agree but we dont have the personnel to run with the footy out of our defence. Joey does it a bit but is always looking for the dinky '1-2' (the Trent Cotchin special) to get his stats up. Savage used to do it but he now just goes backwards every time he gets it. We need D-Mac in the side. Newnes should be switched permanently to defence and Webster needs to lift his game. The rest are useless.

I agree that Newnes should be back in defense, I think he is better suited there.

I also think Geary should play on the wing or midfield. I know he doesn't have the best skills, but I will never question his commitment and effort, and from all reports he has the biggest tank at the club, so I'd much rather see him on the wing or in the midfield giving it a go. Sometimes I just feel we need Geary's intensity around the ground/contest and I can't really see the downside of at least giving it a go.

[dragit]

Pretty hard to comment on game plans with such an ordinary list...

I'm not rapt in richo's handling and development of players that he seems to have ruled out as forming any part of the future. The 40th player on the list needs the confidence of the coach IMO.

[SemperFidelis]

Based on interviews with Richo, I think he knows how he wants the team to play, but execution is the issue. We're looking long term, so maybe its better to keep practicing the gameplan rather than try a different plan and maybe scrounge a few extra wins this year.

This. +1.

[White Winmar]

At least we got to round two before the coach's ability was questioned......

We can have 50 game plans, but if we keep handballing/kicking to the opposition then the plan goes out the window.

The game plan looked good when Billings had the ball.

Sorry, HTB, I distinctly recall calling for Richo's sacking early in the preseason. Just for the hell of it. Thought I'd get in early, before the inevitable rush.

[White Winmar]

Ive got a feeling theres more than one game plan
Possibly more than two

Someone forgot to tell the players, matrix. Secrecy is all well and good, until.........