If I was Pelchen, at the end of 2014.....

[citywest]

I would be looking at trading Gilbert (who by then will be 28), Armitage (26) and Ray (28). I'm not saying these guys are not good.

From a list strategy perspective, we could keep them but probably only Armitage would be the only one of the 3 that could play in our next Grand Final. The question I would like to ask all of you is......

What do you think the other clubs would offer for them??

Me personally, I would expect a pick between 20 to 30 for Gilbert, 18 to 25 for Armitage, 30 to 40 for Ray.

[Eastern]

I reckon he would be looking at picks 4,12 & 20. How he gets them will be as "interesting" as last year !!

[SaintPav]

Sounds simple, just like your sig.

[saint6709]

If I was Pelchen I would be waiting until the end of the 2014 season before making any decisions on what I would do at the end of the 2014 season.

[Eastern]

If I was Pelchen I would be waiting until the end of the 2014 season before making any decisions on what I would do at the end of the 2014 season.

Make no mistake. He would be working on it RIGHT NOW. He won't let anyone know what he's doing until the end of the 2014 season BUT he will be working on it now !!

[Heidelberg_Saint]

I would be looking at trading Gilbert (who by then will be 28), Armitage (26) and Ray (28). I'm not saying these guys are not good.

From a list strategy perspective, we could keep them but probably only Armitage would be the only one of the 3 that could play in our next Grand Final. The question I would like to ask all of you is......

What do you think the other clubs would offer for them??

Me personally, I would expect a pick between 20 to 30 for Gilbert, 18 to 25 for Armitage, 30 to 40 for Ray.

I don't disagree with those names, however history shows you have to give up something good to obtain a high draft pick.

Buckle your seat belts!

[Con Gorozidis]

I would be looking at trading Gilbert (who by then will be 28), Armitage (26) and Ray (28). I'm not saying these guys are not good.

From a list strategy perspective, we could keep them but probably only Armitage would be the only one of the 3 that could play in our next Grand Final. The question I would like to ask all of you is......

What do you think the other clubs would offer for them??

Me personally, I would expect a pick between 20 to 30 for Gilbert, 18 to 25 for Armitage, 30 to 40 for Ray.

I agree with all of that except "30-40" for Ray. Probably only get 40-50 for Ray at best.

Also I guess it depends how the younger guys come on this year. If guys like Webster, Newnes, Markworth, Curren, Roberton, Dunstan, Templeton, Acres don't show us they are good players then we simply can't afford to lose any of those 3.

[joffaboy]

Dumbest thing I have read from this Essendon troll, and thats saying something considering he wanted a complete rebuild at the end of the 2008 season.

Armo will be close to our best in and under by the end of the year, Gilbert is a good running back with plenty of experience, and Ray wont get traded for anything.

Add this to us losing Roo, Lenny, Fisher, Joey, Schneids and probably Dempster and or Gwilt in the next season or two and we have a recipe for Melbourne like belting for the next four years.

It is plain folly and sheer stupidity to trade the few experienced players we would have left.

But cant expect anythign else from this Essendon troll.

[citywest]

Hey Joffaboy, I seriously doubt you even read my post. If you had read my OP you would have seen that I said Armitage would be the only one of those 3 that 'could' play in our next Grand Final and I did say that all 3 players are good. They are just in the wrong age demographic for us and could be worth more to us if we trade them. Besides, they are the only 3 players we could/should use as trade bait if we wanted to try and get 3 picks in the top 20 again.

Also, with our whole list another year older at the end of 2014 and only really Lenny about to retire, we will have enough experience to easily cover for the above 3 if they were traded. If we were 3 years further down the rebuild track I wouldn't have posted this. I think even the most optimistic Saints supporter would agree that the earliest possible year we could play in a Grand Final again would be 2020. If this is correct then why not cash in at least Ray and Gilbert for Picks. Armitage I would demand probably a pick in the top 20 otherwise I keep him. If we are in the 2020 Grand Final then a 32 year old Armitage would be pretty good for us. However if he was traded for pick 18 then we may pick up a gun and he would be 23 with 100 games under his belt by the 2020 Grand Final.

[skeptic]

It's an interesting list of three because all of them have the potential to be A-Graders, but none of them look like they will be with Armo being the closest (though has promised for a while) and Ray looking the furthest away.

Realistically you can't see Armo being traded away as he enters his prime after all that has been invested into him. Furthermore you can't see Ray hanging on much longer unless he really steps it up... For mine he's an older fringe player and i don't see why we would need him.

Gilbert is the interesting one. He was a near elite player. A combination of injuries, distraction and having to play outside of his ideal position/role has left him looking like a B-Grade player. With the recruitment of some tall timber i think we'll learn a lot about him this season and ultimately Sam's form will make the decision for us

[saintspremiers]

Keep Armo anf Gilbo due to the retirements of the other big names. Ray will be worth Jack Shyte so may as well keep him also.

Pick 3 again here we come regardless of this thread

[Spinner]

I don't think we would get very much for Gilbert....

I reckon this might be a year that we just use what we get.

[bergholt]

I would be looking at trading Gilbert (who by then will be 28), Armitage (26) and Ray (28).

Armo might have some currency, Gilbert not much, Ray zero. It's only worth trading if you can pick up a first round or solid second round pick - we'd be doing very well to get one of those for the whole bunch of them.

Not many on the list that anyone would bother to trade for. Maybe:

Jack Steven: first round pick
David Armitage: second round pick
Jack Newnes: late second round pick (if he improves this year)
Dylan Roberton: late second round pick
Leigh Montagna: late second round pick
Jarryn Geary: third round pick
Rhys Stanley: third round pick (if he improves this year)

That's about all I can see at this point. Maybe some of the guys we traded in last year are still worth something. And maybe someone would take a chance on one of our recent draftees, even though they obviously haven't had much time yet.

So unless we see a massive amount of development from a few guys this year, we haven't got much we can put on the table. That doesn't mean Pelchen won't give it a good shot, but I do understand why he went hard last year - we're rapidly running out of bargaining power.

[gringo]

No one of those guys would attract enough interest to justify trading them out. Armo will blitz this year and become untouchable IMO. Steven would be like selling the the rolls royce to gamble on the pokies, Gilbert's body will make him unattractive to other clubs so his value to us far outweighs his trade value. Ray wouldn't get you very much at all so he is better off as depth to us.

Montagna is probably the one that could get us value as a free agent but he's contracted I think.

[Megamaguire]

... he will have a better idea as will AR I hope reg: which players could be counted as being able to participate in a champion team as opposed to a team of champions. I'm not a big fan of Gilbert but he may be on the brink of his best year (after he loses the moon boot that is) and excel under AR. Some players play best under certain coaches. Some may not look like much as trade value but still produce regularly for a coach they thrive under.

I hope the Pelican is looking hard and creatively at who we could possibly lure to Moorabbin for 2015 but players playing well can surely influence these plans? Having lost a bit of experience recently I think it would be counter-productive to let go too many seniors too soon in the assumption that a stack of highend draft picks will guarntee us a grand final appearance. Years of waiting and waiting and waiting for young guys to nail it can see the crowds rapidly diminish and than we have new financial pressures on the club.
I can see Gilbe; Ray and Jones staying around for a while yet.

GO SAINTS!

[lloyd21]

Dumbest thing I have read from this Essendon troll, and thats saying something considering he wanted a complete rebuild at the end of the 2008 season.

Armo will be close to our best in and under by the end of the year, Gilbert is a good running back with plenty of experience, and Ray wont get traded for anything.

Add this to us losing Roo, Lenny, Fisher, Joey, Schneids and probably Dempster and or Gwilt in the next season or two and we have a recipe for Melbourne like belting for the next four years.

It is plain folly and sheer stupidity to trade the few experienced players we would have left.

But cant expect anythign else from this Essendon troll.

Agree Joffaboy

[dragit]

Sell the farm including cattle, it's the only way out of this pickle.

Another gem from chitywest.

[The Redeemer]

Dumbest thing I have read from this Essendon troll, and thats saying something considering he wanted a complete rebuild at the end of the 2008 season.

Armo will be close to our best in and under by the end of the year, Gilbert is a good running back with plenty of experience, and Ray wont get traded for anything.

Add this to us losing Roo, Lenny, Fisher, Joey, Schneids and probably Dempster and or Gwilt in the next season or two and we have a recipe for Melbourne like belting for the next four years.

It is plain folly and sheer stupidity to trade the few experienced players we would have left.

But cant expect anythign else from this Essendon troll.

Agreed,

Just because they are slightly older, does not mean squat.

Like Joey, they can get a good pay packet here and probably an inflated one considering we have to pay a certain percentage of the allotted cap and we certainly won't be giving draftees pay rises for the sake of it.

[Dis Believer]

If you were Pelchen we'd be in more strife than a pregnant nun !!

[plugger66]

I would see if we can get permission to do the trade even earlier. Why not afterall there is only 22 games left in the season. Maybe we just trade everyone over the age of 25.Who needs guys older than that when rebuilding.

[mr six o'clock]

Another reactionary post from citywest !
Who'd have guessed .

[joffaboy]

If you were Pelchen we'd be in more strife than a pregnant nun !!

+1

[bobmurray]

It was stated by the Saints on the weekend that they will again trade for better draft picks prior to the 2014 draft.

If the club wants to do that then they have to give up something, i wouldn't be surprised to see Gilbert on the table, if he stays injury free.

[plugger66]

It was stated by the Saints on the weekend that they will again trade for better draft picks prior to the 2014 draft.

If the club wants to do that then they have to give up something, i wouldn't be surprised to see Gilbert on the table, if he stays injury free.

If Gilbert plays as he has for the last 3 years he is worth a late second pick IMO so I dont see the point. If he plays like he did before about 2010 he is a first round pick but if he plays like that surely we would want to keep him. You are 100% correct saying you have to give up something good to get something good but I reckon it is hard to suggest many if any player with 22 games to go in the year.

[lefty]

I wouldn't be trading Armo at all.

Gilbert started to come good last year, so he might have value.

Ray is a good player, but I don't think we'd get anything, so I'd keep him. IIRC melbourne didn't offer much, I can't remember exactly what the offer was, but at the time I don't think it was worth it, he's a good over head mark for his size.

CJ might offer some value, if a team is after a tagger, might suit freo.

But all in all, it depends what a team needs. Usually a team will give up anything they require if they're in a position for a grand final spot. IE - We gave up our first pick for A.Lovett because he was exactly what we needed at the time. Before that, we wouldn't have gave what we did. All depends on timing and clubs needs, as to what you might receive.