kosi or fraser. who should be full forward?

[bigcarl]

i can see the attraction for either and also for riewoldt

fraser is quick on the lead and still explosive over a few paces. but kosi is the better contested mark. roo's endurance might be wasted at full forward.

i'm just interested in who you guys think should be the spearhead this year?

[BallBanger]

Kosi may not kick the goals that g does but he always creates a contest.

[fugazi]

I think G-train still...but can play the decoy fwd a fair bit for Kosi to hit the centre square from the side (that seems to be his strength)

[golden hawk]

fraser is best in goal square

[Zippy]

Roo has to stay at CHF.

I vote for Frase to be planted in the goalsquare, and let kosi hang out 20-30m away when he's forward (I assume he'll still rotate into the ruck a lot. )

[bigcarl]

fraser is best in goal square

you're just saying that because you're in love with him

[golden hawk]

fraser is best in goal square

you're just saying that because you're in love with him

no because that is where he plays well

[Eastern]

I'd like to think that there are 15 afl coaches out there who would also love to know the answer to this question.

It all boils down to a "Horses fro Courses" scenario. G always attracts a Gorilla type Full Back because of his want to play body on body. Kosi is your old fashioned Full Forward who is probably the best contested mark in the comp. It would depend on match ups.

Just to add to the arguement, and the confusion, there will be times when Riewoldt &/or Goddard are rotated through FF, FP, CHF & HFF as well. A very good dilema for RL to be in.

Next arguement, possibly a poll: Who is the better shot for goal?

F. Gehrig

N. Riewoldt

J. Koschitzke

B. Goddard

!!

[bigcarl]

fraser is best in goal square

you're just saying that because you're in love with him

no because that is where he plays well

so you don't deny it then?

[st_Trav_ofWA]

run them both through it altinate them trough out the game

[golden hawk]

fraser is best in goal square

you're just saying that because you're in love with him

no because that is where he plays well

so you don't deny it then?

oops did i forget to say i am not in love with fraser there i said it .

[Halo-9]

definately big frase,thats his role now goalsquare and not too far else i reckon...will still kick 50+ easy.

[fonz_#15]

the way i see it, a forward line boasting 3 powerhouses in the mould of gehrig, kosi and roo will stretch any defence.

if these 3 are fit and firing, and with schneider, milne and maybe x feeding off them our forward line is very potent...if only the game plan will suit these men. the ball must go in quick and long, and chippolotto must be avoided, we need to see more of the geelong style..play on at all costs.

i don't think there are many teams that will be able to deal with three talls like kosi, roo and g. we may opt to put a resting ruckman in the forward line as well to really stretc the quality of teams defences but we must not become too tall as we will be shot if the ball hits the deck.

i think we will be best off playing kosi and Gwithin 30m of goal with roo pushing up because of his freakish workrate, whatever happens though we must get the ball in a lot quicker this season.

[bigcarl]

our forward line is very potent...if only the game plan will suit these men. the ball must go in quick and long, and chippolotto must be avoided, we need to see more of the geelong style..play on at all costs.

good call. aggressive, risk-taking play

[Eastern]

Lets not forget that King & M Gardiner will occasionally rotate through FP as well (Would require one or two of G, Kosi, BJ on the bench at the time !!

[evertonfc]

Koschitzke; Gehrig should be a third tall.

Gehrig gets murdered by good defenders. If he takes the third best tall defender, he might be a chance.

[st_Trav_ofWA]

Koschitzke; Gehrig should be a third tall.

Gehrig gets murdered by good defenders. If he takes the third best tall defender, he might be a chance.

of course he gets beaten by good defenders other wise they would be crap defenders

[midas_touch]

Koschitzke; Gehrig should be a third tall.

Gehrig gets murdered by good defenders. If he takes the third best tall defender, he might be a chance.

This is what I'm thinking as well, with them switching if Kosi doesnt perform well. Gehrig could still easily kick 50+ goals playing as a third forward.

[st_Trav_ofWA]

Koschitzke; Gehrig should be a third tall.

Gehrig gets murdered by good defenders. If he takes the third best tall defender, he might be a chance.

This is what I'm thinking as well, with them switching if Kosi doesnt perform well. Gehrig could still easily kick 50+ goals playing as a third forward.

problem is frase hardly has any say on who plays on him nowdays coaches have specific roles for all players so if frase go's to the wing his man will follow him

[evertonfc]

Koschitzke; Gehrig should be a third tall.

Gehrig gets murdered by good defenders. If he takes the third best tall defender, he might be a chance.

This is what I'm thinking as well, with them switching if Kosi doesnt perform well. Gehrig could still easily kick 50+ goals playing as a third forward.

problem is frase hardly has any say on who plays on him nowdays coaches have specific roles for all players so if frase go's to the wing his man will follow him

Err...that's the whole point.

Kosi is our #1 FF. No questions asked. He's clearly more fit, agile and capable against quality defenders than Gehrig is.

Gehrig, however, could still kick 2-4 every week if he's played oscilating to the side of Koschitzke, and he gets a weaker defender. The depth in competition backmen is not great; Gehrig should be able to handle the third tall defender.

So (based on the theory Riewoldt will only ever get defender #1 or #2), here's the scenarios:

Kosi gets the #1/2 defender, Gehrig the #3:

At 198cm, Kosi is nearly impossible to mark - Darren Glass found this out the hard way. The great thing about Kosi is that his size:agility balance virtually ensures he'll kick at least 3-4 each week. He's lost some versatility since 2001 (an atheltic CHB), but he's still got ample amounts for an FF. The great thing as well is that if you're in trouble, you can, on the odd occasion, punt it high to him - he'll either mark it, or it's a 50-50 ball in the forward line. (This never happened with Gehrig. He is superb on a lead, but has terrible second efforts, and is useless under the high ball. An odd thing for a bloke of his size, but remember, he played as a HFF for a long time, not KPP, so it makes sense).

Gehrig gets the #3 defender, something he hasn't had since 2003. That's one hell of a luxury. You can bank on Kosi kicking a few either way, as well as providing a contest. Gehrig can be the alternative tall forward off to the side; even play him in the right pocket so he can wheel onto his left foot. He's sure to kick 2-3 on a weak defender, and if he can drag that defender say, 35m out, there's ample room for Kosi.

Gehrig gets the #1/2 defender, Kosi gets #3

Most likely scenario is that Gehrig won't beat his man (an honest appraisal based on 2007, sans games against teams with weak FBs: Freo, Richmond, Carlton) - but he can drag him off to the pocket/flank. He doesn't have a huge impact, but neither does his opponant. A 0-0 result is a win for us. Our non-#1 forward takes out their #1 defender? Deal.

Kosi gets the #3 defender - fantastic. Aside from Geelong (Harley, Scarlett, Egan) and perhaps WCE, very few teams will have the depth to provide a decent match-up for Kosi. Thus, Kosi becomes our #1 target, against their #3 defender. Goals, goals, goals. Oh, and a bloke who will actually contest aerially and take contested marks? Haven't seen that in our forward line since Loewe in early '96.

======================================

I'm genuinely excited at the prospect of Kosi in our forward line F/T. Gehrig can become a very handy decoy/destraction/absorber, but just as much, he's an excellent back up if Kosi - for whatever reason - loses form or cops an injury. You also can't deal him a dud defender, or he has the capacity to kick a bag.

In addition to all this, with Kosi creating crumbs left, right and centre when he doesn't actually mark it, Milne might actually remember how to play the small forward role properly - because he'll be getting the ball off a physically-crunching pack, instead of in normal play, where he often gets caught.

I've thought about our forward structure quite a bit; I've got no doubts it can be as potent as it was a few years back *if* we play our cards correctly.

[plugger66]

Koschitzke; Gehrig should be a third tall.

Gehrig gets murdered by good defenders. If he takes the third best tall defender, he might be a chance.

This is what I'm thinking as well, with them switching if Kosi doesnt perform well. Gehrig could still easily kick 50+ goals playing as a third forward.

problem is frase hardly has any say on who plays on him nowdays coaches have specific roles for all players so if frase go's to the wing his man will follow him

Err...that's the whole point.

Kosi is our #1 FF. No questions asked. He's clearly more fit, agile and capable against quality defenders than Gehrig is.

Gehrig, however, could still kick 2-4 every week if he's played oscilating to the side of Koschitzke, and he gets a weaker defender. The depth in competition backmen is not great; Gehrig should be able to handle the third tall defender.

So (based on the theory Riewoldt will only ever get defender #1 or #2), here's the scenarios:

Kosi gets the #1/2 defender, Gehrig the #3:

At 198cm, Kosi is nearly impossible to mark - Darren Glass found this out the hard way. The great thing about Kosi is that his size:agility balance virtually ensures he'll kick at least 3-4 each week. He's lost some versatility since 2001 (an atheltic CHB), but he's still got ample amounts for an FF. The great thing as well is that if you're in trouble, you can, on the odd occasion, punt it high to him - he'll either mark it, or it's a 50-50 ball in the forward line. (This never happened with Gehrig. He is superb on a lead, but has terrible second efforts, and is useless under the high ball. An odd thing for a bloke of his size, but remember, he played as a HFF for a long time, not KPP, so it makes sense).

Gehrig gets the #3 defender, something he hasn't had since 2003. That's one hell of a luxury. You can bank on Kosi kicking a few either way, as well as providing a contest. Gehrig can be the alternative tall forward off to the side; even play him in the right pocket so he can wheel onto his left foot. He's sure to kick 2-3 on a weak defender, and if he can drag that defender say, 35m out, there's ample room for Kosi.

Gehrig gets the #1/2 defender, Kosi gets #3

Most likely scenario is that Gehrig won't beat his man (an honest appraisal based on 2007, sans games against teams with weak FBs: Freo, Richmond, Carlton) - but he can drag him off to the pocket/flank. He doesn't have a huge impact, but neither does his opponant. A 0-0 result is a win for us. Our non-#1 forward takes out their #1 defender? Deal.

Kosi gets the #3 defender - fantastic. Aside from Geelong (Harley, Scarlett, Egan) and perhaps WCE, very few teams will have the depth to provide a decent match-up for Kosi. Thus, Kosi becomes our #1 target, against their #3 defender. Goals, goals, goals. Oh, and a bloke who will actually contest aerially and take contested marks? Haven't seen that in our forward line since Loewe in early '96.

======================================

I'm genuinely excited at the prospect of Kosi in our forward line F/T. Gehrig can become a very handy decoy/destraction/absorber, but just as much, he's an excellent back up if Kosi - for whatever reason - loses form or cops an injury. You also can't deal him a dud defender, or he has the capacity to kick a bag.

In addition to all this, with Kosi creating crumbs left, right and centre when he doesn't actually mark it, Milne might actually remember how to play the small forward role properly - because he'll be getting the ball off a physically-crunching pack, instead of in normal play, where he often gets caught.

I've thought about our forward structure quite a bit; I've got no doubts it can be as potent as it was a few years back *if* we play our cards correctly.

I think the problem with that is we do not choose the defender the opposition does and secondly pack marks are hardly taken these days and most goals kicked by a FF still come from a leading player. G must play as the leading FF or not play at all.

[bigcarl]

I think the problem with that is we do not choose the defender the opposition does and secondly pack marks are hardly taken these days and most goals kicked by a FF still come from a leading player. G must play as the leading FF or not play at all.

in the past few years, yes. however I do not think that means the contested mark forward is gone forever.

sooner or later a new carey or lockett or jonathon brown will dominate the competition and oppositions simply will not be able to cope. everyone will want to copy them.

it's very much a cyclical thing. using a cricketing anology people said leg spin was dead and buried forever before warne came along and changed the face of the game.

[The_Dud]

Given decent delivery, Gehrig could kick 70-80 goals this year

just look at how well he did last year where we were the lowest scoring team in the league and for half the season our delivery to him was deplorable

[evertonfc]

I think the problem with that is we do not choose the defender the opposition does

But so what? You can't have more than one #1 defender. The weaker defender (#3) has to go somewhere, doesn't he?

and secondly pack marks are hardly taken these days and most goals kicked by a FF still come from a leading player.

You've gotta understand how footy is played these days: pack marks are almost a luxury item, but you get a few of them. Kosi takes them; Gehrig doesn't. But even more than that, you'll get a contest. Gehrig never provided a contest up forward under the high ball, but Kosi will. Contrary to popular belief, a high ball lobbed forward can be an effective weapon if there's no alternative (obviously, a hot pass to a leading forward is preferred, but how many times did we do that last year?), and you've got a bloke willing to contest it at the other end. That will make a huge difference to our scoring capacity.

Our previous strategy was go to Gehrig and that's it. If he doesn't get it, we lose the ball. That will not win games of football. We need to outsmart teams, not try and play to an ailing player's strengths.

G must play as the leading FF or not play at all.

Time to let go of the glory days, P66. He needs to have his role adjusted so it's commenserate with his ability. He can play as a decoy/third tall very effectively. But as our #1, leading forward? Scarlett, Harris, Glass, etc - they'd be confident at keeping Gehrig down to under three touches.

[plugger66]

I think the problem with that is we do not choose the defender the opposition does and secondly pack marks are hardly taken these days and most goals kicked by a FF still come from a leading player. G must play as the leading FF or not play at all.

in the past few years, yes. however I do not think that means the contested mark forward is gone forever.

sooner or later a new carey or lockett or jonathon brown will dominate the competition and oppositions simply will not be able to cope. everyone will want to copy them.

it's very much a cyclical thing. using a cricketing anology people said leg spin was dead and buried forever before warne came along and changed the face of the game.

Lockett would have got most of his goals on the lead and even Brown gets most of his goals on the lead and I dont see that Kosi is a leading forward. He is more a stand and mark it type which doesnt work with the flooding. Yes footy may change again but due to fitness of players there will just about always be some fooding these days.