Allen out for 2009!

[Bernard Shakey]

Jesus, the poor kid!

No that would be Jarryd.

[the_D_train]

i think your thinking of stanley his the 200cm developing ruckman.

cahill was drafted as a 192cm KPF

[Saints Premiers 2008]

i think your thinking of stanley his the 200cm developing ruckman.

cahill was drafted as a 192cm KPF

granted however surely one would give first real crack to lynch and hayne

[the_D_train]

agreed, i would give lynch and heyne first crack aswell

[Saintersss]

Cahill is more of a FF... so slightly different position to Lynch and Heyne and therefore i could see him getting a game.

[undecided]

agreed, i think he a better option then allen anyway b/c he is more athletic

[WayneJudson42]

Tough luck for the boy. Someone mentioned if he was related to Kosi, but it's not funny.

Bad injuries will not only keep him out, but also stifle his development. Just look at what's happened to Kosi.

Tragic.

[FortiusQuoFidelius]

the myth that resting ruckman go into the forward line and kick goals is bulls***...how many did king and gardiner get???

the only ruckman that can do that in the league is ottens and he is in the top 3 one would imagine

Its not the kicking goals thats important for a resting ruckman... he has an important role to play in taking up a tall defender thereby freeing up other forwards...

[plugger66]

agreed, i think he a better option then allen anyway b/c he is more athletic

Agreed and his form is better in the practice games as well.

[ace]

[quote="Armoooo"]Details please... if so this is devastating!![/quote]

http://saints.com.au/tabid/5315/Default ... wsid=70675

[size=18]Allen to miss most of '09[/size]
5:17 PM Sat 06 December, 2008

ST KILDA forward Jarryd Allen will miss most of 2009 after undergoing further surgery on the hip injury he sustained in the Saints’ semi-final win over Collingwood.

The 20-year-old is expected to be on crutches for about six weeks and the club says his status will be reviewed in three months to determine whether he can begin running.

“At this stage we can’t tell when Jarryd will be able to return, but he will be sidelined for at least six months," football manager Greg Hutchison said on Saturday

"It’s a disappointing blow for Jarryd and the club, which comes at a time when the list is almost completely healthy and looking forward to a strong pre-season.â€

[ace]

I don't like the sound of this.
I hear serious injury to hip and immediately think end of career.
Only no-one will officially say that just yet.
He may well sit the season out and get cut at the end of the year.
By then it will be 3 years in the system and shown nothing but a capacity to get injured.
He hasn't had the chance to improve his football in that time.
He has scored more injuries than goals.

[bigcarl]

bad luck to the kid.

injury free he would have had a crack at securing the second key forward position that we must fill if we are to challenge in 2009.

but crisis creates opportunity and surely someone will put his hand up for this position. it is there for the taking.

[markinUSA]

I feel for him. My thoughts are with him over the recovery period.
It's things like this that remind you that your health is more important than footy - I hope he has no long term isses (e.g. arthritis, scar tissue/nerve issues) from these surgeries and injuries.
All the best mate!

[BigMart]

Huge blow....

What has he done?????

He has spent 2 years at Casey developing, he is 20 (not 18) and is ready to step up.....niether Heyne, Lynch or Cahilll have that development....and will need it first.

Allen kicked 30 in the VFL as a lead up fwd last season.....the others played in the TAC Cup....a big difference..

McEvoy is a RUCKMEN (200cm) not mobile enough to be considered a KPF....either is Gardner, especially with Kosi in the same fwd half.....and McEvoy is still a season away....

And everyone please stop mentioning BJ as a KPF.....he is a mid/flanker....PERIOD.

Possible Fwd set up

Schnieder...... Maguire/Blake........X.Clarke

Milne.......Riewoldt.......Kosi

[plugger66]

Huge blow....

What has he done?????

He has spent 2 years at Casey developing, he is 20 (not 18) and is ready to step up.....niether Heyne, Lynch or Cahilll have that development....and will need it first.

Allen kicked 30 in the VFL as a lead up fwd last season.....the others played in the TAC Cup....a big difference..

McEvoy is a RUCKMEN (200cm) not mobile enough to be considered a KPF....either is Gardner, especially with Kosi in the same fwd half.....and McEvoy is still a season away....

And everyone please stop mentioning BJ as a KPF.....he is a mid/flanker....PERIOD.

Possible Fwd set up

Schnieder...... Maguire/Blake........X.Clarke

Milne.......Riewoldt.......Kosi

You make excellent points and then go and name Blake or Maguire in our forward line.

[joffaboy]

Shame for the kid. Would have been his break out year after a couple of development years. Good luck and lets hope he it all goes well from now on.

I dont know offering up a recently drafted kid is the answer. We have a plethora of players who were originally forwards whom we have attempted to turn into backs.

As Mart said Goose or Blake can play forward. Blake is a very good overhead mark and has done the job before. Goose would be a good leading forward as well. Both Gilbert and Gwilt can also play up forward.

We aren't really that bad as far as forwards are concerned, it is the backs that are the problem, hence the recycling of Colm Begley.

And for the poster whom reckons Reiwoldt was our only forward option in 2008. Must have missed the 50+ goals of Milne this year

[BigMart]

Sam Fisher 191
Max Hudghton 191
Matt Maguire 192
Jason Blake 191
Sam Gilbert 194

We have the back half covered with talls

We have only two talls who are READY to play foward.....Roo & Kosi

One of the backs will to reinvent themselves as a fwd.....whether it is only to create a contest (Maguire) or be mobile or defensive (Blake)

Max cannot do this
Sam is the best defender in the AFL
Gilbert plays better running out of defense, and is not a natural footballer..

[LTN16]

People saying that McEvoy is to slow to play as a KPF are wrong..

McEvoy is just as quick and mobile as Allen. There isn't much difference between the two mobility wise and McEvoy is 7cm taller. It would be a good way to ease McEvoy into AFL football by playing him up forward.

[WinnersOnly]

People saying that McEvoy is to slow to play as a KPF are wrong..

You are kidding aren't you LTN16 - We look too top heavy at times with a slow lumbering KOSI up forward let alone another ruckman. Dont you remember how poor we were when we had three talls up forard in KOSI, ROO and GTrain...

McEVOY needs to be developed as a forward who can go forward and replace KOSI not solely as a forward...far too big and slow...

[Armoooo]

Blake will never be a forward nor will Maguire, and if both those two managed to have full pre-season and were in full fitness I would want them both in the backline to free up Gilbo, Sam Fisher, Goddard and Gram to run through the midfield more often...

The only player out of ourbackline I think should even be considered being moved to the forward half full time is Gilbert.

As for McEvoy he easily has the mobility to play lead up forward, watch some of his games at Casey, he is really athletic, but I would much rather him be moulded into a swingman Ruck/ Forward then become a full time KPP, that is why we recruited Cahill and maybe Walsh soon...

[bigcarl]

And for the poster whom reckons Reiwoldt was our only forward option in 2008. Must have missed the 50+ goals of Milne this year

milney's terrific, but he's not going to take pressure off riewoldt as a marking target, is he.

he's an opportunist rather than a kpf.

[To the top]

The problem was not playing Riewoldt, Koschitzke and Gehrig up forward - the problem was the form of Gehrig and the ability of opposition teams to negate him and run off him - also then exposing the defensive shortfalls of our small forwards and our absence of mid-sized forwards.

The injury to Allan is a blow, because he has the size to play forward AND take some pressure off Riewoldt.

IF one of the drafted players can perform at levels to take the pressure off Riewoldt (and without the "feeds" of Harvey) that will be an absolute bonus, with the emphasis on absolute.

I am of the view that our reliance on Riewoldt is not healthy - and my preference would be to lay down the challenge to others absolutely by playing Koschitzke further out from goal at CHF and allowing Riewoldt to become a true utility player - where his skills will win a Brownlow.

From there we need to restructure our forward division around Koschitzke.

In the game he played, McEvoy seems remembered by some for the ball hitting him on the nose - but he showed far more than that taking a couple of strong grabs including running at the ball - and a big kick from on the 50 in a pocket which just missed.

He may be an answer.

With the release of the likes of Gram, Goddard and the 2 Clarke's (plus Riewoldt) to the mid-field whoever grabs the forward positions on offer should not lack for opportunity - the name of the game is to have the ball in goal scoring positions as often and as frequently as you can - and that comes back to a ruck dominance (King & M. Gardiner) and a mid-field spread which can maintain dominance.

Winning the ruck and the mid-field is the name of the game.

The likes of Blake and Maguire are not the answers to the forward conundrum - and neither is Goddard who has the body and the disposal required around where the ball is hot - particularly in the absence of Harvey - which can not be understated.

Maguire is a dead set CHB because he is straight ahead - and has the kicking depth to compliment that style.

Blake is an honest utility player best suited to a defensive flank.

So we look at options forward - and occasional stints of King or M. Gardiner going forward may produce a couple of goals if the ball is delivered to their advantage quickly when a decided size mis-match can be gained.

So we look for that 194cm type who can present and contest - we look for a mid-sized forward who can present and contest and remain dangerous and we look for the "small forwards" to evolve to a Stevens type with genuine pace - and skill.

To continue with the reliance on Riewoldt is fraught with danger because we need more - and Riewold putting the ball in and going forward at his discretion, dragging someone in with him who is not a noted defender, will show us what we have in the cupboard.

The more we put the ball in there, the more we find out.

And given our current situation with our forward options, it is about ensuring the ball is our side of the centre, in our hands because our rucks, mid-field and defence should be able to deliver that outcome.

If our forwards can not take it, they scrap it and lock it in.

So we wait to see who stands up.

[bigcarl]

Allen kicked 30 in the VFL as a lead up fwd last season

was it that many? plugger told me it was 23.

McEvoy is a RUCKMEN (200cm) not mobile enough to be considered a KPF.

tend to agree, but i've been wrong before.

And everyone please stop mentioning BJ as a KPF. he is a mid/flanker. PERIOD.

lacks a couple of cms perhaps, but is a very accomplished footballer who knows where to run.

takes a lot of marks and is a lovely kick, which should never be underestimated in a full forward.

he'd be my choice, but there's enough who have him pencilled in as a gun mid to think that it probably won't happen.

a shame, i think, because it would be well worth a try.

i reckon we need a 70-plus full forward (to add to the 70-odd riewoldt will kick if he plays every game) to challenge for the flag.

Schnieder, Maguire, X. Clarke
Milne, Riewoldt, Kosi.

not the worst idea i've heard on here, IF he can get back to his barnstorming pre-injuries best. can take a good contested mark and would always give you something to kick to.

whether he could kick enough goals is a concern, though.

[Armoooo]

And for the poster whom reckons Reiwoldt was our only forward option in 2008. Must have missed the 50+ goals of Milne this year

milney's terrific, but he's not going to take pressure off riewoldt as a marking target, is he.

he's an opportunist rather than a kpf.

Exactly, I rat eMilney an all time great of our club, yet if we ever have to play him uot of the goal square we are in some real trouble IMO...

[Richter]

There's a big opportunity here for one man in particular.....

...... James Gwilt......

I'm not convinced that he's much more than a handy VFL player, but with the delisting of Ferg and Gardiner, and now Allen's injury - the likes of Lynch a couple of seasons away, well, it's his big chance to show he wasn't just a one-game wonder (PF vs Crows)

He has the body, and the kick...... I just doubt he has the natural footballing skills or nous....... we'll see next year....