List Management - Where to from here?

[Otiman]

In my honest opinion, you should either be winning a flag, or building to win one. At the moment we are not close to doing either.

Scrap the following blokes -

Gwilt - (Hard battler, decent physically, but mentally [speed, decision making] not up to AFL)

Rix - Mature recruit that filled a gap for us, plays brilliantly at VFL level but just can't cut it in the AFL. If he gets a game while McEvoy is fit, just watch the wrath of Saintsational be unleashed.

Fiora - Enough said, He's done his dash, played his half decent season and has not improved further, just gone backwards.

L. Fisher - Slow, Injury prone, can't play mid.

R. Clarke - He will excel at another club, but not the saints. Let him go for his own sake. Port or Essendon would be good for him.

Dempster - With Attard coming back into the side, I think Dempsters defensive ability (or lack thereof) will be shown up.

Ferguson - Even if he plays well, is way too injury prone to keep on the list.

Hudghton - Retirement is entirely up to him.

Harvey - As above.

Gehrig - Retirement, forced or otherwise.


Close: Milne (age, lack of accountability, inconsistency), X (injury prone).


That's 10 players. Now, we need to fill some gaps obviously.

1. We recruit Alex Silvagni and put him at Full Back.
2. We recruit a pacey midfielder with good skill and work ethic with our first round pick.
3. We recruit some 20-22 year olds from the WAFL/SANFL, that have shown good work ethic and improvement since the draft they were passed up in.
4. Jack Steven comes in as a crumbing forward.
5. Elevate Miles, Eddy, Attard.
6. Retain Chivers, Haretuku.
7. Delist McQualter, Van Rheenen (redraft in rookie draft).


Thus, our 22 for 2009 looks like this.

B: Attard Silvagni Miles
HB: Gram S. Fisher Geary
C: Gilbert Hayes Goddard
HF: C. Gardiner Koschitzke Riewoldt
F: Schneider Allen Steven
R: King/Gardiner*, Hayes, Dal Santo
I: McEvoy, Birss, Howard, Jones

* Alternating on a weekly basis. Each player plays 11 games a season at 80% TOG, rather than 20 games at 57%.

[Eastern]

Historically clubs make around 5 changes to thier lists per year. This average will probably go up a little this year with all clubs wanting the biggest possible piece of the last uncompromised draft for 5-10 years. I wonder what gems are left at pick 112

I think most clubs, us included will make around 7 changes this year. Let's not worry about that until at least August !!

[SaintBot]

Interesting post.

Every week I like the idea of Alex Silvagni being recruited to our list more and more. Brilliant pedigree, our back coach is his uncle and he is the fullback of the number one defence in the VFL.

You don't mention what becomes of Maguire.
Also that forward line is a bit top heavy, Riewoldt or Koschitzke would have to find another position - if they can't then one of them has got to go.

[plugger66]

In my honest opinion, you should either be winning a flag, or building to win one. At the moment we are not close to doing either.

Scrap the following blokes -

Gwilt - (Hard battler, decent physically, but mentally [speed, decision making] not up to AFL)

Rix - Mature recruit that filled a gap for us, plays brilliantly at VFL level but just can't cut it in the AFL. If he gets a game while McEvoy is fit, just watch the wrath of Saintsational be unleashed.

Fiora - Enough said, He's done his dash, played his half decent season and has not improved further, just gone backwards.

L. Fisher - Slow, Injury prone, can't play mid.

R. Clarke - He will excel at another club, but not the saints. Let him go for his own sake. Port or Essendon would be good for him.

Dempster - With Attard coming back into the side, I think Dempsters defensive ability (or lack thereof) will be shown up.

Ferguson - Even if he plays well, is way too injury prone to keep on the list.

Hudghton - Retirement is entirely up to him.

Harvey - As above.

Gehrig - Retirement, forced or otherwise.


Close: Milne (age, lack of accountability, inconsistency), X (injury prone).


That's 10 players. Now, we need to fill some gaps obviously.

1. We recruit Alex Silvagni and put him at Full Back.
2. We recruit a pacey midfielder with good skill and work ethic with our first round pick.
3. We recruit some 20-22 year olds from the WAFL/SANFL, that have shown good work ethic and improvement since the draft they were passed up in.
4. Jack Steven comes in as a crumbing forward.
5. Elevate Miles, Eddy, Attard.
6. Retain Chivers, Haretuku.
7. Delist McQualter, Van Rheenen (redraft in rookie draft).


Thus, our 22 for 2009 looks like this.

B: Attard Silvagni Miles
HB: Gram S. Fisher Geary
C: Gilbert Hayes Goddard
HF: C. Gardiner Koschitzke Riewoldt
F: Schneider Allen Steven
R: King/Gardiner*, Hayes, Dal Santo
I: McEvoy, Birss, Howard, Jones

* Alternating on a weekly basis. Each player plays 11 games a season at 80% TOG, rather than 20 games at 57%.

Dempster will not be going anywhere. Silvagni why because he plays at Scorps so next year do we get a Sandy player. And we will not and should not promote 3 rookies. I would say one or two at the most. Lets see how they go in the last 10 games.

[bobmurray]

In my honest opinion, you should either be winning a flag, or building to win one. At the moment we are not close to doing either.

Scrap the following blokes -

Gwilt - (Hard battler, decent physically, but mentally [speed, decision making] not up to AFL)

Rix - Mature recruit that filled a gap for us, plays brilliantly at VFL level but just can't cut it in the AFL. If he gets a game while McEvoy is fit, just watch the wrath of Saintsational be unleashed.

Fiora - Enough said, He's done his dash, played his half decent season and has not improved further, just gone backwards.
"
L. Fisher - Slow, Injury prone, can't play mid.

R. Clarke - He will excel at another club, but not the saints. Let him go for his own sake. Port or Essendon would be good for him.

Dempster - With Attard coming back into the side, I think Dempsters defensive ability (or lack thereof) will be shown up.

Ferguson - Even if he plays well, is way too injury prone to keep on the list.

Hudghton - Retirement is entirely up to him.

Harvey - As above.

Gehrig - Retirement, forced or otherwise.


Close: Milne (age, lack of accountability, inconsistency), X (injury prone).


That's 10 players. Now, we need to fill some gaps obviously.

1. We recruit Alex Silvagni and put him at Full Back.
2. We recruit a pacey midfielder with good skill and work ethic with our first round pick.
3. We recruit some 20-22 year olds from the WAFL/SANFL, that have shown good work ethic and improvement since the draft they were passed up in.
4. Jack Steven comes in as a crumbing forward.
5. Elevate Miles, Eddy, Attard.
6. Retain Chivers, Haretuku.
7. Delist McQualter, Van Rheenen (redraft in rookie draft).


Thus, our 22 for 2009 looks like this.

B: Attard Silvagni Miles
HB: Gram S. Fisher Geary
C: Gilbert Hayes Goddard
HF: C. Gardiner Koschitzke Riewoldt
F: Schneider Allen Steven
R: King/Gardiner*, Hayes, Dal Santo
I: McEvoy, Birss, Howard, Jones

* Alternating on a weekly basis. Each player plays 11 games a season at 80% TOG, rather than 20 games at 57%.

I dont know how close you will end up to what actually transpires but there is no doubt we need a decent cleanout,other clubs aren't going to give up good draft picks for anything we have to offer so it's going to be one of the most interesting off seasons we have seen for sometime......

I know there is still some way to go until seasons end but it's nearly all we have got to look forward to.....

"The Cleanout".....

[borderbarry]

Miles has not done enough yet.
We could not afford to pick up 10 players in the one draft. 5 or a maximum. Plus a full complement of rookies.

[kos]

In my honest opinion, you should either be winning a flag, or building to win one. At the moment we are not close to doing either.

Scrap the following blokes -

Gwilt - (Hard battler, decent physically, but mentally [speed, decision making] not up to AFL)

Rix - Mature recruit that filled a gap for us, plays brilliantly at VFL level but just can't cut it in the AFL. If he gets a game while McEvoy is fit, just watch the wrath of Saintsational be unleashed.

Fiora - Enough said, He's done his dash, played his half decent season and has not improved further, just gone backwards.

L. Fisher - Slow, Injury prone, can't play mid.

R. Clarke - He will excel at another club, but not the saints. Let him go for his own sake. Port or Essendon would be good for him.

Dempster - With Attard coming back into the side, I think Dempsters defensive ability (or lack thereof) will be shown up.

Ferguson - Even if he plays well, is way too injury prone to keep on the list.

Hudghton - Retirement is entirely up to him.

Harvey - As above.

Gehrig - Retirement, forced or otherwise.


Close: Milne (age, lack of accountability, inconsistency), X (injury prone).


That's 10 players. Now, we need to fill some gaps obviously.

1. We recruit Alex Silvagni and put him at Full Back.
2. We recruit a pacey midfielder with good skill and work ethic with our first round pick.
3. We recruit some 20-22 year olds from the WAFL/SANFL, that have shown good work ethic and improvement since the draft they were passed up in.
4. Jack Steven comes in as a crumbing forward.
5. Elevate Miles, Eddy, Attard.
6. Retain Chivers, Haretuku.
7. Delist McQualter, Van Rheenen (redraft in rookie draft).


Thus, our 22 for 2009 looks like this.

B: Attard Silvagni Miles
HB: Gram S. Fisher Geary
C: Gilbert Hayes Goddard
HF: C. Gardiner Koschitzke Riewoldt
F: Schneider Allen Steven
R: King/Gardiner*, Hayes, Dal Santo
I: McEvoy, Birss, Howard, Jones

* Alternating on a weekly basis. Each player plays 11 games a season at 80% TOG, rather than 20 games at 57%.

obviously a ross lyon post, armitage still cant get a gig in 09

[Winmar7Fan]

In my honest opinion, you should either be winning a flag, or building to win one. At the moment we are not close to doing either.

Scrap the following blokes -

Gwilt - (Hard battler, decent physically, but mentally [speed, decision making] not up to AFL)

Rix - Mature recruit that filled a gap for us, plays brilliantly at VFL level but just can't cut it in the AFL. If he gets a game while McEvoy is fit, just watch the wrath of Saintsational be unleashed.

Fiora - Enough said, He's done his dash, played his half decent season and has not improved further, just gone backwards.

L. Fisher - Slow, Injury prone, can't play mid.

R. Clarke - He will excel at another club, but not the saints. Let him go for his own sake. Port or Essendon would be good for him.

Dempster - With Attard coming back into the side, I think Dempsters defensive ability (or lack thereof) will be shown up.

Ferguson - Even if he plays well, is way too injury prone to keep on the list.

Hudghton - Retirement is entirely up to him.

Harvey - As above.

Gehrig - Retirement, forced or otherwise.


Close: Milne (age, lack of accountability, inconsistency), X (injury prone).


That's 10 players. Now, we need to fill some gaps obviously.

1. We recruit Alex Silvagni and put him at Full Back.
2. We recruit a pacey midfielder with good skill and work ethic with our first round pick.
3. We recruit some 20-22 year olds from the WAFL/SANFL, that have shown good work ethic and improvement since the draft they were passed up in.
4. Jack Steven comes in as a crumbing forward.
5. Elevate Miles, Eddy, Attard.
6. Retain Chivers, Haretuku.
7. Delist McQualter, Van Rheenen (redraft in rookie draft).


Thus, our 22 for 2009 looks like this.

B: Attard Silvagni Miles
HB: Gram S. Fisher Geary
C: Gilbert Hayes Goddard
HF: C. Gardiner Koschitzke Riewoldt
F: Schneider Allen Steven
R: King/Gardiner*, Hayes, Dal Santo
I: McEvoy, Birss, Howard, Jones

* Alternating on a weekly basis. Each player plays 11 games a season at 80% TOG, rather than 20 games at 57%.

Totally agree with your list of the to go players right down to as much as i don't like to admit it Max unfortunately as much as i love him he's finished. Would also add Blake in there as well.

[Otiman]

obviously a ross lyon post, armitage still cant get a gig in 09

He should be in there. Replace Birss or Schneider with him.

[cwrcyn]

Retirements

Hudghton
Gehrig
Harvey

De-listings

Rix
Fiora
Ferguson (maybe)
L.Fisher (maybe)


Rookie elevations:

Miles


That leaves six draft selections, and assuming we finish around 10th, the picks will be

6, 22, 38, 54, 70, 86


Problems:

Who plays full-back after Hudghton retires?
If Maguire doesn't return, who plays CHB?
We desperately need a young, talented midfielder, but equally need a tall, big-bodied defender. Our first pick will most likely be a midfielder.



Possible line-up 2009

Geary S.Fisher Gilbert
Miles Maguire X.Clarke
Gram Armitage Goddard
Dal Santo Riewoldt Montagna
Milne Koschitzke Allen

R: Gardiner Hayes Ball

Inter: Baker McEvoy Blake McQualter (I live in hope)

Emerg: Steven, R.Clarke Birss


Still looks a reasonable line-up, with Gram, Goddard, Dal Santo, and Montagna playing more attacking roles.

We need speed and skill with our firt pick, a good tall with our second, and some more speed and skill withour remaining picks.

[bobmurray]

Possible line-up 2009

Geary S.Fisher Gilbert
Miles Maguire X.Clarke
Gram Armitage Goddard
Dal Santo Riewoldt Montagna
Milne Koschitzke Allen

R: Gardiner Hayes Ball

Inter: Baker McEvoy Blake McQualter (I live in hope)

Emerg: Steven, R.Clarke Birss

This looks way too much like the current team that just cannot cut the mustard at this level,the team needs a much bigger tweak than you have
shown here if it is to be successful......

[Teflon]

Maguire would struggle to get back in for mine.

[Winmar7Fan]

Retirements

Hudghton
Gehrig
Harvey

De-listings

Rix
Fiora
Ferguson (maybe)
L.Fisher (maybe)


Rookie elevations:

Miles


That leaves six draft selections, and assuming we finish around 10th, the picks will be

6, 22, 38, 54, 70, 86


Problems:

Who plays full-back after Hudghton retires?
If Maguire doesn't return, who plays CHB?
We desperately need a young, talented midfielder, but equally need a tall, big-bodied defender. Our first pick will most likely be a midfielder.



Possible line-up 2009

Geary S.Fisher Gilbert
Miles Maguire X.Clarke
Gram Armitage Goddard
Dal Santo Riewoldt Montagna
Milne Koschitzke Allen

R: Gardiner Hayes Ball

Inter: Baker McEvoy Blake McQualter (I live in hope)

Emerg: Steven, R.Clarke Birss


Still looks a reasonable line-up, with Gram, Goddard, Dal Santo, and Montagna playing more attacking roles.

We need speed and skill with our firt pick, a good tall with our second, and some more speed and skill withour remaining picks.

Maguires finished Geary we don't even know about yet as McEvoy , Steven and Miles , McQualter give him credit he tries hard but i think he still falls short and R.Clarke Huh ? But we may recruit some good young replacements.

[bigred]

Just as long as we find a first 22 that actually play for the jumper.

dempster wont be going anywhere.

Gwilt, Rix, Fiora, & L.Fisher are most likely past it. Shane Birss would not be on any top eight side's best 22....Harsh but true. None of those guys would earn a traded fourth rounder. Gehrig is gone. Thats 5...maybe 6 players cut.

We are flowered for any trade bait as well....Kosi? Not viable.
I would however (this will cause some stink) Throw Dal Santo's name out though...No development in his game in the past three years. If this is as good as it gets, he is wasting his talent.

I would retain Raph Clark. Unless tradeable.

Definately retain X Clark. Unless tradeable.

C.Jones retained. At least he has a dip for 4 quarters.

Three crucial injuries have especially cruelled our setup in my opinion. Steven Baker, Jaydn Attard & Matt Maguire. I think we have seen enough of Gram and Sam Fisher to say that they could each be used in a midfield rotation. At least in a relieving rotation, which is currently non-existent. Attard, and Maguire give us the flexibility to do so. You have to remember that Bakes IS....IS one of the best tags in the comp. Dont discount the effect of these injuries. They pretty much drained our depth in one hit.


Our key mids, our first string, may lack pace, but they can get the ball as often as any midfield in the competition. It needs assistance however. As much as we wish goalkicking mids grew on ovals around Sandringham, it just doesnt happen. Sure we can use the draft, but topping up this list will not solve our issues. We need to draft to develop. We need to completely wring our rookie list dry. If this means blooding first gamers on half back flanks, to allow Fisher & gram to have a ten minute midfield run, then so be it.....Do it.

Steven King should not be retained. Michael Gardiner should be retained. McEvoy should most definately be second ruck. Van Rheenen should be retained. This is an injured season for him, he has shown plenty already to invest at least another year. Our rucking this year has been good.

Schneider & Milne....Typical freakin lazy, frontrunning small forwards. However both players can win games off thier own play. This years drafting of Schneider and C.Gardiner were definately worth the punt in my eyes.

Kosi.....CHB. He is probably the worst full forward I have seen. Confidence player. With the delivery our forwards get, I'm not surprised he isnt getting a kick. I dont want him to ruck, I just want him to play a position close enough to general play where he can actually earn a kick or two. I would actually make this move NOW. Max is going at the end of this year.

We need to reward our current rookies if they are worth it. I have only seen Casey twice this year, so there are a couple of guys I cant really comment on. We need to keep flushing the rookie list with new talent each year. At least under Lyon we actually have one. Use it. Its a list extension ffs....we need to make the most of it.

We need to go back to basics.

Our skill level is terrible. At the moment, with the exception of BJ, we are the most poorly skilled team in the comp. Even with Melbourne. This has declined over the past three years. Not good enough. By god we have absolutely slaughtered the ball this year....

Our next preseason should consist of three things.

1) Raw Fitness.

We need to be finishing games better than the next guy. We are not fit enough. Full stop. More sand dune running FFS. A good dose of harden the fcuk up is also required. I want to see more vomit on the grass....So many of our list JUST DO NOT DO THE HARD YARDS. simple.

2) K.I.S.S gameplan. Keep is flowering simple. Also make it viable to actually kicking goals. Use the corridor, play to our strengths. Our strengths atm are clearances. We need to be crisp and move the ball. To do so, we need to refer to #3....

3) Skills. FFS most of our list cant hit a fcuking target from twenty meters. Our skills so far this year have been absolutely deplorable. For the past five years, we have made a rod for our own backs with our delivery into the forward line. Good general skills can actually overcome glaring list deficiencies such as "not enough pace", or "a short backline"....
USE THE BALL....

With all that said, I honestly believe that our list is suffering from a dose of complacency, that has developed into frustration, that has developed into desperation....too late. We have some glaring dead wood. We have some mids that dont work hard enough. We have some backs that dont work hard enough and we have some forwards, who wont earn thier own ball.

ATM our team does not play with any confidence, passion, intensity, desire or even flowering PRIDE>!!

Hard questions need to be asked. Not just of our top up or fringe, but of our core 10.

Why cant Joey chase late in the third quarter? Is he not fit enough? Is he expecting someone else to cover him? Is he just not doing it?

Get the captaincy off Roo also...It completely head **** him. Give it to Lenny. Just do it and leave it there.

Anyhoo...

[congorozides]

good post but saints fans have to get the f*** over the clarke brothers. they are rubbish. raph will not excel at another club. hes slow. physically weak, not competitive and not footy smart. he wont be struck by lighting and all of a suddenly become good.

its like bomber fans waiting for keplar bradley. it wont happen. sorry guys.

[groupie1]

I think a lot of you blokes would make decent administrators - impressed by a topic for the first time - nobody insulted anyone, everyone has strongly felt opinions.

I like the idea of Kozi at CHB - been calling for it all year
I've also like the idea of Roo on a wing
I'd - this will sound insane - I'd keep Gehrig - when the ball is delivered properly he's a fine lead, a fine 40-50 goal forward, an Alastair Lynch type. and all those wankas who argue about Scarlett running off him, Scarlett runs off everyone. Should Carlton drop Fev? Brisbane Brown?

The point of Baker being injured is crucial too - easily in our elite 5
NDS for trade bait - probably worth considering

I'm also a Clarke Bros fan - lose Milne - he's 28 and inconsistent, go with a forward line looking more like:
X Raph Schneider
Jack Steven Gehrig

But, get rid of all the weight:
Blake, L Fisher, Rix, C Gardiner, McQualter, Fiora, C Jones

So, for me... rest of this year wants to look like
Geary Hudghton Baker
Goddard Kozi Fisher NDS
Roo Ball Joey
X Raph Schneider
J Steven Gehrig

R: M Gardiner, Hayes, Harvey
Int: Gram, King/McEvoy, Armitage, Gilbert

[congorozides]

I'm also a Clarke Bros fan

why?

[vacuous space]

NDS for trade bait - probably worth considering

Might as well get rid of Goddard too. There's no place at this club for anyone who can kick the ball.

[groupie1]

first I think for X, he's clearly been instructed to play safe... no flying for marks, concentrate on the weak side of his game
i believe in focusing on the weak sides of your game during the week, not at training - so I think he's been de-flamboyantised, and that's affected his confidence.

Raph just looks like, for mine. looks like a footballer, a classy one. Sapped of all self-belief after too many injuries, played out of position, and not coached to throw his body around more.

Both Clarkes are soft but I think that's a function of playing to instructions - the instructions are sound, it's to keep them on the park. But if they were both let off the leash, and the latter given bursts in the center where his job is to use his body to do some toweling up I reckon Raph would come good in a big way.

I'm not unlikely totalling misjudging them - just reckon they both - the younger esepcially - have it in them

I would love to see Raph Clarke undergo an 'anger' course - tell him he's to play with a bit more aggression at the man, and that that would jump-start his confidence, which, would lead to him playing to his potential. Have you seen the way he sometimes stands way ahead of the pack at VFL>? I know it doesn't always translate, but he has at least in terms of the others discussed here (Fisher, Blake, Dempster, C Gardiner, Rix) etc the natural flair for the game

But I might be wrong and mislead

[groupie1]

vacuous space, any trade for NDS is simply the idea of he's one who who's underawed us and would also be valued. Would you consider a couple under 20 draft picks for him?

[spert]

Trade off Kozi, Dal Santo and Montagne. Delist Milne, Shnieder, Dempster, King, both Clarkes and Goose. Retire Harvs and Max. A huge cleanout is required.

We need to just bring the youth through,..over to you recruiters

[Thinline]

Get rid of all the dead wood and the players that are an injury liability.

X Clarke I am a real fan of when fit, but we get f all value out of him. Sorry X. time's up. Raph is our Kepler Bradley. No thanks.

Sam Gilbert hasn't been mentioned. The guy tries hard, but has no right side and couldn't hit the side of a barn with his left. Sorry. No place at this level.

Two of Gardiner M, King and Rix to go. McEvoy need sto be fast tracked.

Kosi has to stay. We need the size, and he will return to form. Perhaps the CHB idea has merit. Goose is cooked...excuse pun.

Likes of Fiora, Leigh Fisher, Gwilt etc delist.

Max, Harvs, Gehrig go.

You need to aim for a core of 26 players that would be picked in every other clubs top 20. The team needs to built around Sam Fisher, Kosi, Riewoldt, Hayes, Montagna, Gram, Ball, Goddard. All are young enough to be there when the team has reloaded. Get Goddard fit and get him to study Adam Cooney closely. BJ has the attributes. Long and direct up the corridor...

Play Armitage every week. Persist, Ross...although I suspect Ross aint the biggest fan for some reason...

Then flog them to within an inch of their lives in off season.

And then, finally, and controversially, give some thought to relocating to the Gold Coast. It's worked for the other two who've packed up and gone elsewhere. And it's not too late. Let's face it. Saints are going nowhee locally, and that'll never change.

[vacuous space]

vacuous space, any trade for NDS is simply the idea of he's one who who's underawed us and would also be valued. Would you consider a couple under 20 draft picks for him?

Dal's a player who could quite reasonably play another 5-10 years if managed properly. If we managed to trade Dal for the second overall pick and drafted Daniel Rich, we'd all be hoping that Rich could get up to Dal's level and play for us for at least ten years. If and when Rich got up to Dal's level, he'd then be faced with taggers. Do you think this team would help out Daniel Rich any more than they do Nick Dal Santo? I have my doubts.

[meher baba]

We seem to get one of these threads after every loss, always filled with the same sort of "let's trade 12 players at the end of the season" nonsense who think that establishing a list in the real world is exactly the same as fantasy football.

A few bleeding obvious comments

1) Over a third of our list as of September 2006 has retired/been delisted (Powell, Peckett, Thommo, Brooks, Watts, Hamill, Murray, Sweeney, Raymond, McGough, Voss, Schwarze, Gehrig, Ferguson, McQualter: and I'm doing this from memory, so I've probably missed a few), albeit a few have managed to find their way back by various routes.
If we were to delist another 10 at the end of this season, that would represent well over half our list having been turned over in 2 years, plus the board and the entire coaching staff. Has there ever been a club in the history of AFL which has experienced this much of a change of personnel in such a short period of time and gone anywhere except backwards as a result?

2) A poster earlier on has suggested that we might end up with picks 6, 22, 38, 54, 70, 86 if we finish tenth. If we were to go ahead and attempt to draft six players to our senior list from this, and we used the 2005 draft as a guide, we would have ended up with Beau Dowler, Beau Muston, Travis Tuck, Kristin Thornton, Jonathan Giles and, I suppose, Justin Sweeney (who was the last player picked at 71). Personally, I would far rather have Blake, Fiora, R Clarke, Gwilt, X Clarke and L Fisher than that lot. Perhaps other drafts would look better, but - apart from the 2000 and 2001 super drafts, I doubt that it would be that much better.

3) Half the players named by most of the posters for delisting didn't play on Saturday night (L Fisher, R Clarke, Fiora, Birss, Rix, Ferguson, Gehrig) or have hardly played AFL this season (Gwilt). So I don't see how they can really have contributed a great deal to our current problems. Perhaps our depth isn't as good as other clubs - I'm not sure - but personally I much more worried about how our so-called "stars" are going ATM without wanting to take the axe to our current cadre of backup players.

4) Most of the calls for elevation/regular selection of the likes of McEvoy, Steven, Miles, etc. are based upon the idea that the "grass is greener": the posters who call for this know no more about the capabilities of these players than would the average follower of lacross on Prince Edward Island. They are just playing fantasy football again: "bringing in Gwilt and C Jones into the first team didn't help me much this week, so let's give Miles and Steven a go for next week".

5) The only possible reaction to the idea that Attard could somehow be the future saviour of our backline is


Is it just me, or are other posters on here starting to find this sort of thread to be utterly ridiculous.

[bigred]

Your only reading what you want to read.

FACT: Attard cemented a spot in our first 22 last year.

FACT: The loss of Attard, Maguire and Baker to injury have compromised our backline/midfield.

FACT: If Attard was fit, he would be in our best 22 in a heartbeat.

Opinion:

5) The only possible reaction to the idea that Attard could somehow be the future saviour of our backline is

I dont think he is a saviour. I dont think he is a superstar.

But losing a player that can fill a roll, means that we cannot use others such as Gram or S.Fisher to thier full potential. Make no mistake, losing Attard, Maguire and Baker has effected not just our backs, but our midfield as well.

The post I made earlier on this thread is not a knee jerk, typical after loss rant. We WILL....WILL delist at least five players this year. And as you said, its a lot to turn over in 2 years.

The way it stands atm, this year is toast. Why not play some kids? I dont mean to bring up half a dozen in a week, but one or two....why the hell not...At least they may have a crack. Most of our regulars dont.

Half the players named by most of the posters for delisting didn't play on Saturday night (L Fisher, R Clarke, Fiora, Birss, Rix, Ferguson, Gehrig) or have hardly played AFL this season (Gwilt). So I don't see how they can really have contributed a great deal to our current problems. Perhaps our depth isn't as good as other clubs - I'm not sure - but personally I much more worried about how our so-called "stars" are going ATM without wanting to take the axe to our current cadre of backup players.

Well, we can discount Gehrig. Fiora is gone. Rix is gone. Clarke may be gone. Fergs...pfft who knows. L.Fisher has been shown up this year.

My greatest concern is the lack of intensity and skill from our core group also. But our list has been exposed for some serious deficiancies. The time for sticking with some of the cattle, hoping for them to come good must surely be over.