19pts............misleading?

[Teflon]

Im wrapt we had a crack last night and hearing all about "we won inside 50's..." etc but I cant help but feel we've got some rose colored glasses on here....

Facts are we played Collingwood off 2 6 day breaks (for them) on OUR home ground they naturally dont like.

YET at NO STAGE in that game did I feel we would win it.

19 pts sounds great but reality is we were 35 pts down at 17 min mark of last qtr..........junk goals helped........

Everytime the games intensity went up - we couldnt go with the Pies....they put down the accelerator.

IMO on a nice big MCG.......we'd be in trouble with last nights set up.

Im absolutely not bagging the effort - it was there. But really, Pies are a 5-7 goal better side and their skill level alone leaves us for dead.

Weve got a real lot of work to do in off season if we are gonna bridge that gap in 2012.

[saintbrat]

it may have been ' junk time' but they are a team that delight in 'putting the foot on the throat' of opposition so I don't discount the effort that the saints continued right to the end.





interesting that despite complaining about 2 X6 day breaks and interstate travel it would appear that some of their players have flown interstate.....

we played up to 4 or 5 X 6 day breaks in a row over the last few years... but continued to work with the system..

[bobmurray]

Eddie has probably asked the AFL to play all Colliwobbler games in Melbourne but as yet that wish hasn't been granted which gives the space cadet, otherwise known as M.Malthouse, grounds for goofing off about how the draw affects his pampered ones....

[Junction Oval]

Yep, not far off Teflon. Our effort and intensity matched the Pies. We fell down in delivery (badly at times), an impotent forward structure, poor/defensive Selection - BLake in, Gamble out, and Coaching on the day, leaving Davis unmarked for the "entire" match.

Unfortunately, on the bigger MCG, where it more difficult to cover, the Pies delivery will carve us up.

Hopefully, the Club will have learnt a lot from last night. The players can certainly take a lot of confidence out of their endeavours. It may well be enough to carry us through to a Prelim.

[Teflon]

Yep, not far off Teflon. Our effort and intensity matched the Pies. We fell down in delivery (badly at times), an impotent forward structure, poor/defensive Selection - BLake in, Gamble out, and Coaching on the day, leaving Davis unmarked for the "entire" match.

Unfortunately, on the bigger MCG, where it more difficult to cover, the Pies delivery will carve us up.

Hopefully, the Club will have learnt a lot from last night. The players can certainly take a lot of confidence out of their endeavours. It may well be enough to carry us through to a Prelim.

For me the upside is we can certainlu use the ball better going fwd....and kick accurately at goal but perhaps the biggest room for improvement is we know Dal (ok), Roo, Goddard and Fisher can all play much better....

To beat them on the G our best will ghave to play blinders and our suspect disposers liting their turn overs.

Gilbert was horrible last night....

Still some positives.

[plugger66]

Plenty of positives but the margin wasnt one of them. Doesnt mean we cant beat the next year and that must be our aim.

[Leo.J]

Im wrapt we had a crack last night and hearing all about "we won inside 50's..." etc but I cant help but feel we've got some rose colored glasses on here....

Facts are we played Collingwood off 2 6 day breaks (for them) on OUR home ground they naturally dont like.

YET at NO STAGE in that game did I feel we would win it.

19 pts sounds great but reality is we were 35 pts down at 17 min mark of last qtr..........junk goals helped........

Everytime the games intensity went up - we couldnt go with the Pies....they put down the accelerator.

IMO on a nice big MCG.......we'd be in trouble with last nights set up.

Im absolutely not bagging the effort - it was there. But really, Pies are a 5-7 goal better side and their skill level alone leaves us for dead.

Weve got a real lot of work to do in off season if we are gonna bridge that gap in 2012.

I see your points Teflon.

Howver, the positives I see are

We won 2 quarters, one being the 2nd, which we've struggled in lately.

We out tackled them.

We matched them in clearances.

Matched them in scoring shots, and inside 50's

After watching the replay also they were not impressed in the coaches box how we ran over the top of them in the last quarter... 6 day break or not.

As I've said in another post imo we're not far of it.

A little bit of confidence will go a long way, and I think we would have gained a lot from last night.

A few percent improvement in our composure with our important kicks and we would of had a different result.

I know we didn't but we live and learn from this one.

Glass is half full here.

[SainterK]

Saints have been finishing well late, why was this so unique?

Similar to the WCE game, Freo game.

I don't see anything 'flukey' about it.

[Teflon]

yeah I saw the coaching box image of Malthouse and behind closed doors I reckon hed have had a bit to say.

But still you didnt feel we were gonna win it at any stage did you?

The Pies are an even side that have multiple skilled ball users through the middle - we need to match their evenness...thats will require us to have a good day and them be a little off IMHO as we are a side with a strong group of very good players.......but we fall away quality wise faster than they do.

They are beatable though Ive no doubt.

Must say i was impressed with our 2nd qtr and our clearance work, tackles etcso its all good.

Imagine that side and effort with Hayes in the guts and Gwilts composure/long penetrating kicks down back?

2012 is the go for mine -MUST inject Ledger, Cripps, ....Sippos.......these guys skill wise will improve us.....love to see this Crocker kid come good one day (still skinny)sounds like he too has those skills we really need.

[SaintPav]

Plenty of positives but the margin wasnt one of them. Doesnt mean we cant beat the next year and that must be our aim.

To improve next year in order to challenge we need around 4/5 new/different players who can have an impact to come through who were not playing last night. Lenny and Jimmy will be two. Not sure who the others will be.

[Teflon]

Plenty of positives but the margin wasnt one of them. Doesnt mean we cant beat the next year and that must be our aim.

To improve next year in order to challenge we need around 4/5 new/different players to come from last night team. Lenny and Jimmy will be two. Not sure who the others will be.

Thats it in a nutshell Pav.

Ledger/Cripps you would think would play more - not all games but more. Sippos too.

Lets face it - we need:

1. players skilled under pressure.
2. some more dash would be nice to help offence surges and give our fwds a 1 out contest through quick ball movement.

Everyone goes on about our fwd line last - seriously the way we delivered the ball fwd at times was comical .......ridiculous over handball had me playing the 'Benny Hill' theme in my head at one stage.....BUT the good news from that was - Ross and the boys ARE trying something different and it takes time. Which is why Om convinced 2012 is the go.

Bring in some kids
Trade a name to upskill IMO - BUT only if we what we get has those foot skills/dash we need.

Not into losing a Gilberty for a player who cant kick.

[bigred]

GIlbert probably lost 10-20% of his trade value last night.

His disposal under pressure or even inferred pressure was dreadful.

[hungry for a premiership]

19 pts sounds great but reality is we were 35 pts down at 17 min mark of last qtr..........junk goals helped........

Pies are a 5-7 goal better side

Disagree. Football is a four quarter game and every minute counts. At the end of the day, they finished 19 points in front of us. They are a 19 point better side. If we had been a 20 point better side last night, we'd have won.

After the infamous round 3 clash vs filth last year, when Malthouse was asked, "what is the difference between the two sides," he said, "well, its 27 points," which is what we won by. 10 weeks later, they come out and belt us by 8 goals.

Make no mistake, we have made up a heap of ground. Let the form ascension continue, and if we meet them again this year it means we will have improved even more. They'll be cacking their dacks.

[CURLY]

Disagree. The fact we missed so many simple set shots shows the scoreboard should have been closer. Fair enough if those missed goals were from snaps or from tight angles but 4 of them were from 30 out on minimal angles. It showed that we could get the ball in good scoring range.

[Mr Magic]

Isn't Collingwood the team that spends all that time in Arizona to improve their fitness base?
WHy would 2 six-day breaks affect them so badly, given their 'improved' fitness base'.

Why would anybody take Malthouse post game mutterings seriously?
The pictures told the real story.
He wasn't expecting a 'fade out' from them.
He was expecting them to finish strongly.

His comments after the game were just more 'bluster' from a 'master of bluster'.

[saintbrat]

Malthouse Venom during game and post game - still fuming and struggling to find the right words-- " mark my words they are a very very good side' after he'd ripped through his team... shows it was close.

[saintsRrising]

Im wrapt we had a crack last night and hearing all about "we won inside 50's..." etc but I cant help but feel we've got some rose colored glasses on here....

Facts are we played Collingwood off 2 6 day breaks (for them) on OUR home ground they naturally dont like.

.

Well other facts were:

* that the last 6 day break was a training training run of bruise free football against the Powerless.

* that Roo was pretty inept in the second half

* that while Gilbert and Gram are never the best of kicks, that they were particularly inept

* dal was most unusually poor with his kicking

* That the Pies were the most accurate they been all year in terms of goal-kicking....wheres from similar spots we were getting posters. Swans skewed bouncing kick grubs through for a goal, whereas Schneider gets a point etc.



I think the Saints showed that they can compete....

Our lesser lights were in the main particularly good. Armo was about the only quiet one.

It was our "main" players that were lacking apart from Joey, and Dal...and Dal's kicking was poor.


Now yes it was not at the G...but it was good for our self-belief.

Our 4 quarter workrate was really good.

Our mid-tier players were ery good. Ray, Peake, Big Ben etc....


Speaking of Ben...while he has been good this last couple of months...I think he "arrived" against the Pies. AL aspects of his game were good. It was not a "yes he was good around the ground BUT was poor in the ruck game....".


IMO this weekend showed that we can beat the Pies if we meet them again if we play at our best. They are clearly a great team...and so we will have to play a blinder.

We are "capable" of winning.....but it will not be easy, or automatic...it will needed to be earnt by 100% effort.

[barks4eva]

The filth were as ripe for plucking as they will get this year


coming off two six day breaks with the last one being in heavy conditions interstate

at the dome, under lights at night, usually when we perform at our best

not the filths ideal venue

in the past few years the sides who have dominated the competition have dropped late home and away games before the finals


everything was set up for us, an upset was definitely on


AND we still couldn't nail them

of course they were tired, they had two six day breaks before this one


come September at the MCG if we happen to play them we will be lucky to get within 8 goals


If anyone thinks we are a sneaky chance this year then they are delusional and living in cloud cuckoo land

[ralphsmith]

We would have beaten them with some better disposals from
Jason gram
Sam gilbert

Those two guys can win the footy, or at least revieve and run well.

But they cant kick properly.

Those two particuarly need to improve before the finals. Could be the difference between a premiership and nought!

Both have improved in some areas recently but i thiink so much rests on them because of their ability to get the footy and run.

Just kick it better!!! It would be so punishing to opposition teams and a pleasure to watch gram sprint down the guts and nail a pass to a team mate.

[saint tash]

We would have beaten them with some better disposals from
Jason gram
Sam gilbert

Those two guys can win the footy, or at least revieve and run well.

But they cant kick properly.

Those two particuarly need to improve before the finals. Could be the difference between a premiership and nought!

Both have improved in some areas recently but i thiink so much rests on them because of their ability to get the footy and run.

Just kick it better!!! It would be so punishing to opposition teams and a pleasure to watch gram sprint down the guts and nail a pass to a team mate.

If Grammy and Gilbo haven't mastered their kicking now it would be hard to see them making much improvement.

Especially Grammy at his age and stage of his career.

[matrix]

well i like cloud cuckoo land

i thought we had a sniff
two six day breaks??
diddums
they had a hard two weeks there huh?
didnt even have to try against the power ffs

bj hits the post, polo misses what he shouldve kicked
we were right there

cant see them being junk time goals either
the pies stopped
not many teams have matched or even beaten them in the last qtr this year

we are right up there and have a big chance
stop being so bloody negative people

[dragit]

well i like cloud cuckoo land

i thought we had a sniff
two six day breaks??
diddums
they had a hard two weeks there huh?
didnt even have to try against the power ffs

bj hits the post, polo misses what he shouldve kicked
we were right there

cant see them being junk time goals either
the pies stopped
not many teams have matched or even beaten them in the last qtr this year

we are right up there and have a big chance
stop being so bloody negative people

I'm with you Matrix,
I thought we could match them, and for the main we did…
3 posters & 2 easy misses from Polo really hurt us,
They are a better side, but when we really knuckle down we can go with them…

Stop looking to 2012 everyone FFS, we may not even make the finals, enjoy the fact that

A. we are still in contention
&
B. after a quarter time we stuck with a side that has been head & shoulders above the comp all year…

Maxwell & Sure-bet out till finals will be interesting, it's not over until Eddie McGuire sings…

Hate to see this place next year if we miss the finals… we'll need the Beyond Blue phone number in the banner…

[dragit]

We would have beaten them with some better disposals from
Jason gram
Sam gilbert

Those two guys can win the footy, or at least revieve and run well.

But they cant kick properly.

Those two particuarly need to improve before the finals. Could be the difference between a premiership and nought!

Both have improved in some areas recently but i thiink so much rests on them because of their ability to get the footy and run.

Just kick it better!!! It would be so punishing to opposition teams and a pleasure to watch gram sprint down the guts and nail a pass to a team mate.

If Grammy and Gilbo haven't mastered their kicking now it would be hard to see them making much improvement.

Especially Grammy at his age and stage of his career.

Where is the enjoyment in coming to our website and pretending to barrack for the saints,
I don't understand…

[Stillwaiting]

Plenty of positives but the margin wasnt one of them. Doesnt mean we cant beat the next year and that must be our aim.

To improve next year in order to challenge we need around 4/5 new/different players to come from last night team. Lenny and Jimmy will be two. Not sure who the others will be.

Thats it in a nutshell Pav.

Ledger/Cripps you would think would play more - not all games but more. Sippos too.

Lets face it - we need:

1. players skilled under pressure.
2. some more dash would be nice to help offence surges and give our fwds a 1 out contest through quick ball movement.

Everyone goes on about our fwd line last - seriously the way we delivered the ball fwd at times was comical .......ridiculous over handball had me playing the 'Benny Hill' theme in my head at one stage.....BUT the good news from that was - Ross and the boys ARE trying something different and it takes time. Which is why Om convinced 2012 is the go.

Bring in some kids
Trade a name to upskill IMO - BUT only if we what we get has those foot skills/dash we need.

Not into losing a Gilberty for a player who cant kick.

Agree with this, we need to improve our footskills but it is pointless trading players such as gilbert unless it is a big improvement on his footskills. Should we concentrate on improving his, and others kicking.

2012 could be exciting, if we can have a crap free offseason, give RL time to tweak the gameplan, and maybe get some of the young blokes fit we could be challange again next year

[thejiggingsaint]

I felt that the effort was there from the Saints, but that Colonwood had better composure under pressure and that their disposal skills were far ahead of ours. I don't expect us to tear up the opposition in the finals, however I do believe that we are capable of producing something special.
We just don't have (at this moment) a side that can QUITE match the top four for overall skills.
My tip for the flag (from around May) has been Geelong and I still feel that way.
2012? Too far away to make any predictions, but with Lenny Hayes back and more game time for Steven, Sippos and others we could see a vast improvement on this season. I reckon Polo and Peake are two who on current rates of performance improvement could make us a force.