What do you expect from the guys at Sandy?

[skeptic]

I've wondered as of late what expectations people have on our guys playing at Sandy and what they may need to do to get a gig in the seniors.

Now this isn't a reactionary thread to this Tommy Walsh saga or my questioning of Will Johnson's lack opportunity.

I am intrigued though.

Do people think it's realistic for players who aren't proven AFL players to tear up the VFL consistently all the time... and that that's the only way fringe players should get games?

So many times when I read about guys wanting Walsh, Johnson, Lynch etc to get more game time, they're met with the response of "what have they done in the VFL", "they can barely make the grade in the 2s" etc

Me perosnally, I've always looked at from the point of view that we should be getting games into the youngsters when a suitable role for them opens up for a week or 2.
History shows that the more games kids play in the seniors, they generally tend to get better.

That's why it frustrates me when a players like Baker plays poorly for a sustained period of time in the BP and we don't play Smith/Winmar etc for a week or 2.
Or when Johnson/Walsh miss again so that Jason Blake can play a non-role
Or Kosi gets rushed back into the team after a poor pre-season and puts in the type of performance we expect from him when he's underdone.

I look at this from the perspective of

James Gwilt never dominated the VFL over 3-5yrs but the games we got into him really paid off when he got an opportunity and made the most of it.

If Gardiner wasn't injured, would McEvoy be getting games at the moment? Or would we have persisited with Gardiner's ok-to mediocre form? Remember Ben was pretty average over the first 4-6 games this season and would most likely have been dropped if we had anyone else.

Would Jack Steven be playing if Lenny wasn't out?

Sam Gilbert has been very average all year but has consistently held his spot whilst any number of players could have added to their development?

[HSVKing]

Would Jack Steven be playing if Lenny wasn't out?

Sam Gilbert has been very average all year but has consistently held his spot whilst any number of players could have added to their development?

Jack would definitely be playing. He is easily in our best 22.

As for Gilbert, injuries have kept him in the side. His season has been terrible compared to previous.

If there has been a case for someone to be dropped, he is it.

[bobmurray]

I always expect those Saints listed players that are pushing for a senior spot to dominate in the VFL but this clearly doesn't happen.

Are they just not good enough or do they start so young and it's such a jump from the underage comp that it takes some time to find the tempo and be able to execute surrounded by so many more good players than they were used to.

And we are only talking about the VFL, and then there is another quantum leap to the AFL.....

Last years draft might have been the first time in years we drafted some decent players,maybe that's why Ross wants to cut deep.

[dragit]

This is a good thread,
I think it must be hard to stand out in the VFL,
Good AFL players can look ordinary in there,
Gram wasn't doing much, yet on his return to AFL has played some very good footy.
On the other hand Mini tears the VFL up, but looks average at best in the AFL.

I wonder whether Jack would have kept his spot if Lenny was playing, and maybe he would be even better this year if he'd had more games last year?

It must be hard for Simpkin, Lynch, Walsh and Johnson to play well for extended periods only to see others promoted in front of them.

[SainterK]

On that...one of the papers today said Siposs and Cripps are about to rejoin Sandy...is that correct?

[plugger66]

On that...one of the papers today said Siposs and Cripps are about to rejoin Sandy...is that correct?

Have they been sacked by the saints?

[saintbrat]

On that...one of the papers today said Siposs and Cripps are about to rejoin Sandy...is that correct?

Hutchy and ross both said a couple of weeks ago that Crippa was only a couple of weeks away
and Sipposs has been a week by week management ..

[SainterK]

On that...one of the papers today said Siposs and Cripps are about to rejoin Sandy...is that correct?

Hutchy and ross both said a couple of weeks ago that Crippa was only a couple of weeks away
and Sipposs has been a week by week management ..

Here it is...

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/b ... 6114830185

With its season on the line and the wind in its back, Sandringham surged with a six-goal second quarter and stole the lead late in the match. Michael Lourey had the chance to clinch victory in the dying minutes, but his long-range shot drifted out on the full.

Ruckman Michael Gardiner showed his AFL career might have one chapter left. "He's ready to go up, he just needs an opportunity. If the right match-up is there the Saints will look at him," Sandy coach Brett Lovett said.

Gardiner gathered 13 touches and had 20 hitouts, keeping Sandringham competitive early.

VETERAN Steven Baker was again one of Sandringham's best, gathering the bulk of his 22 touches early. The defender is nearing a St Kilda return.

THE Saints' depth will be boosted with young guns Arryn Siposs and Jamie Cripps both expected to return from injuries in the next fortnight.

[bergsone]

Often been said easier to get a kick in the ones,than it is in the twos,because the skills around you are better.make of that what you may,

[Bernard Shakey]

On that...one of the papers today said Siposs and Cripps are about to rejoin Sandy...is that correct?

Have they been sacked by the saints?

Ignore him, he's being a smartarse again.

It is often difficult for good footballers to adjust to a lower level comp. I've seen many VFL/AFL players make good position in the ressies, but the ball just doesn't go where it's supposed to. Sandy are a rabble this year, probably because most of our kids are injured.

[Thinline]

Who'll be Sandy's B and F?

[Bernard Shakey]

Who'll be Sandy's B and F?

Gags or Magner.

[saintsRrising]

THE Saints' depth will be boosted with young guns Arryn Siposs and Jamie Cripps both expected to return from injuries in the next fortnight.

How will it really be boosted????

Sandy won't be playing finals...and these two guys cannot be fit, or match practiced. So they won't be part of any finals campaign this year.

A bit of a pity....


Hopefully it means both can get in a full season and be part of our 2012 campaign.

[Jacks Back]

On that...one of the papers today said Siposs and Cripps are about to rejoin Sandy...is that correct?

Hutchy and ross both said a couple of weeks ago that Crippa was only a couple of weeks away
and Sipposs has been a week by week management ..

Here it is...

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/b ... 6114830185

With its season on the line and the wind in its back, Sandringham surged with a six-goal second quarter and stole the lead late in the match. Michael Lourey had the chance to clinch victory in the dying minutes, but his long-range shot drifted out on the full.

Ruckman Michael Gardiner showed his AFL career might have one chapter left. "He's ready to go up, he just needs an opportunity. If the right match-up is there the Saints will look at him," Sandy coach Brett Lovett said.

Gardiner gathered 13 touches and had 20 hitouts, keeping Sandringham competitive early.

VETERAN Steven Baker was again one of Sandringham's best, gathering the bulk of his 22 touches early. The defender is nearing a St Kilda return.

THE Saints' depth will be boosted with young guns Arryn Siposs and Jamie Cripps both expected to return from injuries in the next fortnight.

The next fortnight? The VFL must be finishing up quite soon aren't they? They won't get much game time.

[Bernard Shakey]

Two games left for Sandy and I doubt Cripps or Siposs will be playing in either.

[skeptic]

just to clarify HSV

I mean would Jack Steven be the player he is now if Lenny hadn't gone down?

Or would he still be playing average games in the VFL, coming in to rotate with Armitage fir the forward pressure role

[bergholt]

Would Jack Steven be playing if Lenny wasn't out?

Jack would definitely be playing. He is easily in our best 22.

you mean that he is now.

in his first five games this year he averaged 12 touches, though he kicked five goals and had five tackles per game. dude was stuck in the forward line.

since then, he's averaged 23 possessions a game because he's been playing in the midfield. would he have got that midfield spot with lenny in the side? less likely. so i think there's something to the "injuries create opportunities" theory.

[hayes66]

Definitely agree with skeptic. I think it depends on the player/position etc what you expect. Some players never dominate in the VFL but perform once in the AFL, others dominate at VFL but this form doesnt translate to success in the AFL. I try to look at what they do with the ball and the quality of their possessions in the VFL. Im a big fan of siposs and although his only played a few games of footy I get the impression he wont dominate at VFL level but his ball use is just so good I think he will thrive with AFL games. I think steven was starting to dominate at VFL from what I saw. Havnt seen them every week but lynch and walsh seem to get in the best evry week. One of the games i did see Lynch got 30 odd possessions from the back pocket, id say thats a fair game.

[spert]

I think had McQualter not got injured, he would have been in the seniors in place of Polo or Armo, as he was showing consistant good form in the midfield at Sandy, and that's what RL would have been noticing. Gards would have taken Kosi's spot if fully match fit, as basically he is a better player as a tall, even at this stage of his career. Players like Siposs, and Cripps will be treated with caution, ready for 2012. Lynch should be pressing for Gilbert's spot.