is roo our greatest ever player?

[stinger]

must be getting close to it,,,if he is not already there......probably won more games for us than any other player....milne, the doc and plugger included......certainly closing in on spud's record of most ever games as captain........much more durable than baldock........more loyal than plugger, stewart and ditterich.......banger was in a league of his own in respect of games played and no of possessions per game..loyalty on a par with roo....and pluggers best ever teammate.....according to plugger...nicky was well...nickly.....love him...i really do......but he played that one season with the doggies......and was never as consistent as roo.......

...roo for mine...if not now...by the end of his career....lucky aren't we????

[prwilkinson]

He's in the top 3. What a servant to the club he has been.

[jonesy]

Lockett easily. Then harvey. Didnt see the doc or stewart

[ROLS-LEE]

If his performances in the prelims were as good as the GFs, I would say yes, but I think plugger still has it.

[PADDLEPOP1001]

I think Plugger on song was unstoppable,but Roo and the great Banger man are both on par and I love Banger but Roo may very well go past him if he drags this young team up continuously!

[whiskers3614]

If his performances in the prelims were as good as the GFs, I would say yes, but I think plugger still has it.

Think you phrased that poorly.
If his prelims were as good as those in GF's there would have been no GF's!

[ROLS-LEE]

If his performances in the prelims were as good as the GFs, I would say yes, but I think plugger still has it.

Think you phrased that poorly.
If his prelims were as good as those in GF's there would have been no GF's!

Yes you are right. It was phrased poorly.
I meant if he displayed those performances in a gf as those he displayed in the prelims he would be a saints immortal and probably the greatest ever.

[Bernard Shakey]

Plugger
Harves
Roo
Doc

[Old Mate]

Love Harves but reckon Roo has him covered dominating a more labour intensive position for the team, dominating final series and dragging us into two grandfinals.

Whilst Plugger was great his career was tarnished by undisciplined acts, poor fitness and training habits and abandoning ship to the Swines.

I wasn't around to comment on Doc or any others from that era so Roo is the greatest Saints player of ever seen IMO.

[White Winmar]

Plugger. Roo must be very close though.

[Moods]

It's an interesting discussion. From afar (when I followed another club in Fitzroy) plugger was a football genius. Better than anything I'd ever seen. He had strength, power, speed, toughness, mongrel and enormous skill.

I rate Roo as second to him. Bit hard to say that if Roo had performed in GF's he'd be our best ever. Who has performed in GF's for the saints in the last 40 years who can be mentioned in these discussions? - certainly not Plugger. Lenny maybe, but he would make my top 5 saints, not top 2.

Roos finals record is as good as anyone's at the saints I reckon - including Harves. Won that many finals off his own boot, or influenced the game it's amazing. Off the top of my head 2010 prelim, 2010 Qualifying final. 09 Qual final. 09 prelim final. 08 1st semi final, 05 Qual final, 04 semi final - and he played a great game from memory in 04 prelim final (maybe not game changing) To play well in Qual and prelim finals consistently you have to be a champion - Like Carey. And Like Carey, Roo never had the same influence in the GF (although I rate his 2010 drawn GF quite highly)

Roo is just so consistent - much like Harves. However to be THAT consistent as a CHF is truly remarkable.

PLugger
Roo
Harves

[Junction Oval]

Gee it's close and it can be argued on all sides.

Plugger for me, for his dominance and match-winning kicking over a very long time , in sides that were very average. His winning goal after the siren (and finger salute to Barassi) against Sydney at the SCG was spine tingling.

Roo next - just, for his leadership and goal kicking over the years.

Banger - for his huge consistency. Not as eye=catching as Roo, but probably a better average performance over. a very long time. Won a final in Adelaide off his own back in the last quarter.

The Doc - an absolutely dominating player in his time - and Premiership Captain, but over a shorter period.


It's not right to compare champions in different eras and make claim that one is/was better than another. They have all made an enormous contribution to the Club, with individual highlights being very easy to recall for all players. No doubt about them being the top 4 - it's just the ranking that's the difficulty.

[Dave McNamara]

Check-out our Team of the (last) Century.

Dominated by blokes from the modern (TV) era. That's hardly surprising. Yet there's one bloke in there who played pre World War 1. Lead our goalkicking several times, won the (then equivalent of the) Brownlow, and was generally considered the best player of the era ...

(GO can tell youse all how good that bloke was. )

[BigMart]

Rob Harvey

No one did it better for as long

More times in the best players column than any other

More BOGs than any other

More possessions than any other

Best individual game ever... 4 goals, 46 possessions

Most possessions in a season, and second most

More Games than anyone else

More AAs than anyone else

In three very different eras was a dominant midfielder.... 91-95 he was a jet His 96-98 period he was unstoppable. 2003-2005 he was still winning games off his own boot... 15 years after initially doing it?

For me
Harvey
Lockett...
Stewart
Riewoldt

Going heavily on their overall achievements .... Not so much just impact at their best

[skeptic]

Roo easily...

Best ever

[SainterK]

Story has a bit of writing to do yet...

[mr six o'clock]

Check-out our Team of the (last) Century.

Dominated by blokes from the modern (TV) era. That's hardly surprising. Yet there's one bloke in there who played pre World War 1. Lead our goalkicking several times, won the (then equivalent of the) Brownlow, and was generally considered the best player of the era ...

(GO can tell youse all how good that bloke was. )

It's gotta be Roy Cazaly !

[saintspremiers]

Best player or best overall player/person?

plugger best player due to sheer magic talent. Can't go past him.

But as the full package it's probably now Roo. Will certainly be Roo if his form holds for this season and next.

He's another Trevor Barker - heart and soul of the club, both knocked back big offers from other clubs and both very personable people. Met Barks once and look forward to meeting and speaking to Roo at some stage in the future I hope (like probably thousands of other fans).

[bergsone]

All greats................seen em all,but still reckon Doc was the best,just a pity the old black and white footage doesn't do justice to how good he really was,but that's just my opinion.Could make a case for any of the others mentioned

[Toy Saint]

Baldock was outstanding in his era, possibly the catalyst for those of us in the 55-65 age bracket following the Saints. Known as Mr Magic, he could do things that have never been repeated.

Ian Stewart was all class, an excellent mark and amazing kick, he won 3 Brownlows, pity one of those was at Richmond.

Lockett is possibly the best footballer who has ever played the game, pity he went to Sydney.

Nick Riewoldt has redefined the role of a CHF, the toughest position on the field.

St Kilda has been blessed with champions, I reckon Plugger was the best, but Roo may be next best

[bigcarl]

On sheer talent and match-winning ability, it's Lockett for me. But Riewoldt is in my top 5 along with Stewart, Baldock, and Harvey

[perfectionist]

You can only talk about the players that you have seen, but can rely, to some extent, on stats for those you haven't.

For me, my eyewitness account goes back to 1960. Before that, the stats tend to show Billy Mohr as someone special. I remember Roy Wright (Richmond 2 times Brownlow winner) saying that Harold Bray was also an exceptionally skilled player.

In my time, I draw a distinction between the most skilled players and the best - some being on both lists and others not. Without a doubt, the most skilled Saints player I have seen - any player as far at that is concerned - is Tony Lockett. No-one I have ever seen can match his skills with both hands and both feet. His marking was near perfect. Along with another (Peter Hudson), he was the most accurate at kicking for goal. But, he was a little "lazy". That is, not every game saw his best effort.

Contrast that with Ian Stewart. Another two sided player who showed the guts at every contest that we saw from David Armitage yesterday. He was one of the five who won us our flag (the other four were Baldock, Murray, Neale and Cooper).

Then there is the Doc. In many ways, you had to see him play to know how he played. He was about the size of Leigh Montagna, and yet dominated the CHF position not only for the Saints but also for Tassie and then Victoria in interstate games. Literally, unbelievable.

I have also rated John McIntosh and Joel Smith as two of the most skilled players I have seen.

In the last twenty years, players such as Robert Harvey, Aussie Jones, Kosi, Brendon Goddard, Nick Dal Santo, Luke Ball and Lenny Hayes stand out.

Then there are two others. It is hard to imagine a more complete footballer than Nicky Winmar. He could, and did, do everything. But, on the one day that it mattered (in 1997), on the night before, the worst tragedy of his life befell him. His father died. Cruelty knows no welcome occasion.

And there is Nick. It will not come as any surprise to those who have been following my posts here over the last 7 years about how I regard him. There has never - never - been a better mark of the ball in the history of the game. That epitaph alone brings near to the top of the list. But he has been, and continues to be, so much more. If any parent wanted to raise a child into the world of Aussie Rules footy, there could be no better example to which they could point. That is the mark of an enduring champion.

And he has been our champion.

[White Winmar]

Check-out our Team of the (last) Century.

Dominated by blokes from the modern (TV) era. That's hardly surprising. Yet there's one bloke in there who played pre World War 1. Lead our goalkicking several times, won the (then equivalent of the) Brownlow, and was generally considered the best player of the era ...

(GO can tell youse all how good that bloke was. )

An unusual departure from your usual sense of modesty, Dave.

[gringo]

Lockett was once in a century Roo is once in a generation. I wasn't born until the 1970s so hard for me to know what the older players were like. To me playing in the modern era, it is hard to measure performance from now against the era that even Leowe played in. it was slower and less accountable so hard to say that he would be equal to the current crop. We will never know but I'm happy to say he has been one of our very best players.

[Toy Saint]

You can only talk about the players that you have seen, but can rely, to some extent, on stats for those you haven't.

For me, my eyewitness account goes back to 1960. Before that, the stats tend to show Billy Mohr as someone special. I remember Roy Wright (Richmond 2 times Brownlow winner) saying that Harold Bray was also an exceptionally skilled player.

In my time, I draw a distinction between the most skilled players and the best - some being on both lists and others not. Without a doubt, the most skilled Saints player I have seen - any player as far at that is concerned - is Tony Lockett. No-one I have ever seen can match his skills with both hands and both feet. His marking was near perfect. Along with another (Peter Hudson), he was the most accurate at kicking for goal. But, he was a little "lazy". That is, not every game saw his best effort.

Contrast that with Ian Stewart. Another two sided player who showed the guts at every contest that we saw from David Armitage yesterday. He was one of the five who won us our flag (the other four were Baldock, Murray, Neale and Cooper).

Then there is the Doc. In many ways, you had to see him play to know how he played. He was about the size of Leigh Montagna, and yet dominated the CHF position not only for the Saints but also for Tassie and then Victoria in interstate games. Literally, unbelievable.

I have also rated John McIntosh and Joel Smith as two of the most skilled players I have seen.

In the last twenty years, players such as Robert Harvey, Aussie Jones, Kosi, Brendon Goddard, Nick Dal Santo, Luke Ball and Lenny Hayes stand out.

Then there are two others. It is hard to imagine a more complete footballer than Nicky Winmar. He could, and did, do everything. But, on the one day that it mattered (in 1997), on the night before, the worst tragedy of his life befell him. His father died. Cruelty knows no welcome occasion.

And there is Nick. It will not come as any surprise to those who have been following my posts here over the last 7 years about how I regard him. There has never - never - been a better mark of the ball in the history of the game. That epitaph alone brings near to the top of the list. But he has been, and continues to be, so much more. If any parent wanted to raise a child into the world of Aussie Rules footy, there could be no better example to which they could point. That is the mark of an enduring champion.

And he has been our champion.

Such an excellent summary, thanks Perfectionist. Just a couple of things, I believe Stewart Leowe was a better mark than Nick. Nick gets to more contests, but Leowe had stronger hands.

Also, whilst your summary is excellent you have avoided actually rating our champions in order. Not that I blame you.