Trout gone end of Year

[takeaway]

If you're going to take a pit stop, don't do it with the finishing line in sight. That's why any coach worth his salt would'nt have cared if we lost the McLelland trophy and would have risked losses for the sake of the big prize in September. He should have demaded to rest some of his key playmakers in rounds 16/17/18 and 19. Give them 2 weeks off and it didn't have to be all in the same games. Then....you build back momentum and perhaps even give some of the young guys on your list more opportunities to show whether they can add a different edge or some surprises to your team. The competition for spots and the doubt that it would have created in some of the players minds might have had them playing out of their skins in the finals.

We had a great team. We had great leaders. We were a strong club when Lyon arrived as we'd already played deep into September in 2004 and 2005 and were finalists in 2006. Yes he was good...but Lyon was like Andrew Mcqualter or Robert Eddy. He needed to play his role and help the team achieve it's full potential. He failed.

OK coach. You obviously know the way to win a GF. I certainly disagree with your strategy outlined in the first para. A lot would argue that the worst thing you could do would be to give players a couple of weeks off before the finals. Who knows either way? Certainly not us.

The saint's coach with the highest win/loss record for the club was like Mcqualter or Eddy? Play his role? Nuff said.

Can you read? Can you comprehend and retain more than 1-2 ideas? I know it's difficult if twitter is your go to for news and analysis but my first sentence said: "If you're going to take a pit stop, don't do it with the finishing line in sight."

That's exactly what you said - give some of his key playmakers two weeks form weeks 16-19 off and try to bring back momentum? Isn't that a pit stop for those players? Contradicting yourself. I am sure Lenny Hayes would have a loved a break for two week rounds 17-18 and be replaced by some youngster - not.
I'm pretty sure you have never coached - what a shambles that would be.
Never been on twitter, I actually watch football.

[Scollop]

If Lyon is your coach and you respect him and believe in his gameplan, his tactics and his overall management of the team and if Lyon demands that one or 2 players take weeks off to fix their niggles, then you do it. You believe when he tells you that he has the faith in you to get the job done in finals, and you believe that your spot is safe, then you rest up and you go at 100% when you come back into the team and you have 3-4 weeks to build back momentum

Anyhow, perhaps Lenny wasn't a bloke that needed any time off and Lenny didn't have any injuries preventing him from performing at 100% week in week out, but it's a long season and it's the coaches job to get the best out of his players in the most important month of the year. The aims and the prize is the finals, not the bloody McLellan trophy. Lyon had players that were not in the best form (mainly due to lack of a rest in the home and away rounds) and mainly due to being sore or carrying injuries. We have seen in recent years that the players through the players association have demanded the bye.

We have seen that the AFL has created a weeks break for all teams and NO footy at all for a week after the last home and away round. It's not fuckn rocket science. Even machines are turned off once in a while in factories and on mine sites for a rest and some maintenance. Anyhow, sorry to all for the same old boring discussion and looking backwards. I'll try and refrain from engaging next time

[Sanctorum]

Let's get this thread back on track...I'm delighted to read that Elshaug and Kingsley are reported to be gone at the end of this year. But I'm going to get back on my hobby horse and point out once more that the same focus, if not greater, should be on Danny Sexton. For those of you who missed my earlier posts about this bloke: Danny Sexton was recruited by North Melbourne way back in 1990 but apparently failed to play a single game of senior footy. Following that introduction into the big time, he turned his hand to coaching at junior levels and working his way up the ranks until in 1996 the Saints took him on board in a player development role.

Over the past 12 years (not kidding, 12 YEARS!!!) Sexton has remained with St Kilda, earning big bucks in a variety of coaching positions. Sexton is now Director of Coaching. He is the MR BIG of the St Kilda coaching panel, with oversight of ALL the coaches, including Richardson. I have not the slightest doubt that Sexton is the most powerful football personality at St Kilda, he brings his influence to bear on every coaching issue, move, decision, that is made, and he doubtless has a big say on recruitment and things such as player development and fitness. Richo won't be able to fart without Sexton knowing about it, because he sits right next to him in the coaching box, even followed him down to the bench when Richo goes there (no doubt hoping to get away from Sexton, or perhaps Sexton suffers from wind and that's why Richo has moved into the open air...). Simon Lethlean, who was appointed General Manager Football this year is nominally Sexton's boss, but even he would have had to rely on "12 years at the Saints Sexton" to advise him on what's going on...

To my mind, this is where the real focus should be. Unless it's a Sheedy or Malthouse, you can't tell me that 12 years continuous service at the one club in senior coaching roles is sustainable, especially when the team has been sliding down the ladder in the past 12 months.

We need to ask the St Kilda Board: "why does the club appoint as Director of Coaching someone who has had no playing experience at the elite level, and who has not been tried and tested at any other AFL club to ensure that he has the necessary skills to hold that very senior and crucial position?"

[8bloggs]

Given the game is now viewed very much as a 'business' it would be interesting to know how objectively the roles of the recruitment staff and coaches are formally assessed, and how often.
Any large business should have a formal performance process in place whereby the each person is assessed at least annually.
Assessment in corporations I worked for were rigorous in making sure before the new year starts that performance will be reviewed against pre-established performance objectives and specific targets that are measured and agreed between the staff member and their boss.
Does anyone know whether this is done for our recruitment staff and coaches?
I for one would love to know what the individual 2018 objectives are for each of our recruitment staff and coaches are, for example: what is the Director of Coaching supposed to achieve versus the 'Transition Coach' versus the Senior coach or the Forward/Midfield/Defence coaches? What role does Simon Lethlean have in making sure these objectives (if they exist...) work together to ensure the football department as a whole is effective?
If this was in place it would then be a lot easier to assess whether someone has done a good or bad job.

[chico2001]

8bloggs...too many hard questions there for the St Kilda FC to answer. My guess is that they would not be that professional. The club is not successful premiership wise so that is an indication of shortcomings within this organisation. Even Enstein would work that out.

No doubt there would be some elephants in the room currently e.g the AFL, debt also some long termers within the group who are not high achievers in the football world. I was shocked when it was revealed how many coaches and support staff they had employed. Quite a few layers of management and people who have not had football success have key positions. They lay this off by saying "other clubs do it that way"

The other elephant in the room is the amount of members and supporters who believe the club is on the right track to success. This gives the club an easy out to explain away failure..."oh, we have plenty of members and they trust in us" type bulls***.

[saintadamski]

Linton, well put together. Only problem is that we have won 1.5 games this year and that blows the thinking of top recruiting right out the window and that's a fact. That stat means more than any other data on the planet. It cannot be disputed. It has been said 100 times on various threads that some of the top recruits have not shone this year there have been a lot who have supported them as well and thats fair . Why wont someone put a pass mark on the saints for this year? should be easy for keyboard warriors such as us.
saintpav ...you reckon posters are feebleminded , give us the advantage of your 135+ IQ and tell us where we will finish on the ladder this year, how many games will we win with these very good players we have?

You have stated "and that's a fact" in a number of posts, and in all of them you should be saying "and that's my opinion", because they are certainly not facts.
Drafting from 2013 onwards is still very much a work in progress, with all players drafted still learning the caper, and we really don't know how they will turn out for another few years.

One of the main reasons for the current ladder position is the lack of senior players from the 2005-10 drafts/trades, and we also lost an important 2 from earlier drafts last year, 3 incl Dempster. Those drafts were not the responsibility of the current recruiting team. Current team not perfect, but I think Linton L has summed it up well.
We have certainly improved over the former regime.

Pass mark for the Saints this year would be a No. 3 pick, let the recruiting team add some more cream.

I tell you what is certainly fact takeaway - your delusion is fact
Ross Lyon leaving the club in a complete state of disarray - that's fact
Billings and McCartin are crap - that's fact.
The recruiting over the last 8 years since Elshaug has come on board has been diabolical - that's fact - trading away great players like McEvoy for Savage - It's like Ripley's Believe it or not.....I still can't quite believe it.

"Drafting since 2013 is a work in progress" I have never read such rubbish in my life....when does the 'progress' enter its completion phase - 2050??? 2080??

We are on the bottom of the ladder with a shocking list:
Billings, Weller, Lonie, Newnes, McCartin, Sinclair etc etc
Our 'senior' players that we are building the list around - Gilbert, Armitage, Hickey, Nathan Brown, Savage, Geary....omfg....you honestly believe these guys would get a game at other clubs?!?!?!

The only light at the end of this long dark tunnel are a few of the youngsters
Gresham, Rice, Clarke, Long, Austin and a few others

To write that many of the drafts and trades are not the responsibility of the current recruiting team is pure fiction! You live in a fantasy land where you will be slurping sh#!t off a wooden spoon for years to come.
Change is needed and NOW! Elshaug must go ASAP!!!

"Let the team add some more cream" LIKE BILLINGS?!?! Your cream is curdled mate

[Teflon]

If Lyon is your coach and you respect him and believe in his gameplan, his tactics and his overall management of the team and if Lyon demands that one or 2 players take weeks off to fix their niggles, then you do it. You believe when he tells you that he has the faith in you to get the job done in finals, and you believe that your spot is safe, then you rest up and you go at 100% when you come back into the team and you have 3-4 weeks to build back momentum

Anyhow, perhaps Lenny wasn't a bloke that needed any time off and Lenny didn't have any injuries preventing him from performing at 100% week in week out, but it's a long season and it's the coaches job to get the best out of his players in the most important month of the year. The aims and the prize is the finals, not the bloody McLellan trophy. Lyon had players that were not in the best form (mainly due to lack of a rest in the home and away rounds) and mainly due to being sore or carrying injuries. We have seen in recent years that the players through the players association have demanded the bye.

We have seen that the AFL has created a weeks break for all teams and NO footy at all for a week after the last home and away round. It's not fuckn rocket science. Even machines are turned off once in a while in factories and on mine sites for a rest and some maintenance. Anyhow, sorry to all for the same old boring discussion and looking backwards. I'll try and refrain from engaging next time

All good sense if you weren't trying to paint that as all Lyons downfall/fault
Why no mentions of your hero GT in the 05 prelim who played injured players?
Anyhow, who cares what rubbish/spin people peddle and like him or not (I don't btw) but statistically our best coach since Jeans FACTS

[St Lenny]

Let's get this thread back on track...I'm delighted to read that Elshaug and Kingsley are reported to be gone at the end of this year. But I'm going to get back on my hobby horse and point out once more that the same focus, if not greater, should be on Danny Sexton. For those of you who missed my earlier posts about this bloke: Danny Sexton was recruited by North Melbourne way back in 1990 but apparently failed to play a single game of senior footy. Following that introduction into the big time, he turned his hand to coaching at junior levels and working his way up the ranks until in 1996 the Saints took him on board in a player development role.

Over the past 12 years (not kidding, 12 YEARS!!!) Sexton has remained with St Kilda, earning big bucks in a variety of coaching positions. Sexton is now Director of Coaching. He is the MR BIG of the St Kilda coaching panel, with oversight of ALL the coaches, including Richardson. I have not the slightest doubt that Sexton is the most powerful football personality at St Kilda, he brings his influence to bear on every coaching issue, move, decision, that is made, and he doubtless has a big say on recruitment and things such as player development and fitness. Richo won't be able to fart without Sexton knowing about it, because he sits right next to him in the coaching box, even followed him down to the bench when Richo goes there (no doubt hoping to get away from Sexton, or perhaps Sexton suffers from wind and that's why Richo has moved into the open air...). Simon Lethlean, who was appointed General Manager Football this year is nominally Sexton's boss, but even he would have had to rely on "12 years at the Saints Sexton" to advise him on what's going on...

To my mind, this is where the real focus should be. Unless it's a Sheedy or Malthouse, you can't tell me that 12 years continuous service at the one club in senior coaching roles is sustainable, especially when the team has been sliding down the ladder in the past 12 months.

We need to ask the St Kilda Board: "why does the club appoint as Director of Coaching someone who has had no playing experience at the elite level, and who has not been tried and tested at any other AFL club to ensure that he has the necessary skills to hold that very senior and crucial position?"

This is a good point you make and no one has even mentioned him on here. Very good at flying under radar. I have had a good google about him and there isn't much on there about him on there either. A real mystery man..........

[takeaway]

Linton, well put together. Only problem is that we have won 1.5 games this year and that blows the thinking of top recruiting right out the window and that's a fact. That stat means more than any other data on the planet. It cannot be disputed. It has been said 100 times on various threads that some of the top recruits have not shone this year there have been a lot who have supported them as well and thats fair . Why wont someone put a pass mark on the saints for this year? should be easy for keyboard warriors such as us.
saintpav ...you reckon posters are feebleminded , give us the advantage of your 135+ IQ and tell us where we will finish on the ladder this year, how many games will we win with these very good players we have?

You have stated "and that's a fact" in a number of posts, and in all of them you should be saying "and that's my opinion", because they are certainly not facts.
Drafting from 2013 onwards is still very much a work in progress, with all players drafted still learning the caper, and we really don't know how they will turn out for another few years.

One of the main reasons for the current ladder position is the lack of senior players from the 2005-10 drafts/trades, and we also lost an important 2 from earlier drafts last year, 3 incl Dempster. Those drafts were not the responsibility of the current recruiting team. Current team not perfect, but I think Linton L has summed it up well.
We have certainly improved over the former regime.

Pass mark for the Saints this year would be a No. 3 pick, let the recruiting team add some more cream.

I tell you what is certainly fact takeaway - your delusion is fact
Ross Lyon leaving the club in a complete state of disarray - that's fact
Billings and McCartin are crap - that's fact.
The recruiting over the last 8 years since Elshaug has come on board has been diabolical - that's fact - trading away great players like McEvoy for Savage - It's like Ripley's Believe it or not.....I still can't quite believe it.

"Drafting since 2013 is a work in progress" I have never read such rubbish in my life....when does the 'progress' enter its completion phase - 2050??? 2080??

We are on the bottom of the ladder with a shocking list:
Billings, Weller, Lonie, Newnes, McCartin, Sinclair etc etc
Our 'senior' players that we are building the list around - Gilbert, Armitage, Hickey, Nathan Brown, Savage, Geary....omfg....you honestly believe these guys would get a game at other clubs?!?!?!

The only light at the end of this long dark tunnel are a few of the youngsters
Gresham, Rice, Clarke, Long, Austin and a few others

To write that many of the drafts and trades are not the responsibility of the current recruiting team is pure fiction! You live in a fantasy land where you will be slurping sh#!t off a wooden spoon for years to come.
Change is needed and NOW! Elshaug must go ASAP!!!

"Let the team add some more cream" LIKE BILLINGS?!?! Your cream is curdled mate

Your post, santa, is a series of opinions, which of course you are entitled to state. I am just as entitled to disagree with most of them.

Thank you for confirming my post about the problems caused by poor recruiting 2005-10, which has now led to a dearth of quality senior players, and some of those you mentioned have been traded in by the current regime to provide some experience. I don't think you read or understood my earlier post.

Just to help you with Year 11 English, a FACT is "a thing that is known or proved to be true". Even when you quote something that may be a fact, you get it wrong. McEvoy was not traded for Savage - we got Dunstan as well, or Acres, one of them.

Keep your "opinions" coming though, for what they are worth.

[saintadamski]

Linton, well put together. Only problem is that we have won 1.5 games this year and that blows the thinking of top recruiting right out the window and that's a fact. That stat means more than any other data on the planet. It cannot be disputed. It has been said 100 times on various threads that some of the top recruits have not shone this year there have been a lot who have supported them as well and thats fair . Why wont someone put a pass mark on the saints for this year? should be easy for keyboard warriors such as us.
saintpav ...you reckon posters are feebleminded , give us the advantage of your 135+ IQ and tell us where we will finish on the ladder this year, how many games will we win with these very good players we have?

You have stated "and that's a fact" in a number of posts, and in all of them you should be saying "and that's my opinion", because they are certainly not facts.
Drafting from 2013 onwards is still very much a work in progress, with all players drafted still learning the caper, and we really don't know how they will turn out for another few years.

One of the main reasons for the current ladder position is the lack of senior players from the 2005-10 drafts/trades, and we also lost an important 2 from earlier drafts last year, 3 incl Dempster. Those drafts were not the responsibility of the current recruiting team. Current team not perfect, but I think Linton L has summed it up well.
We have certainly improved over the former regime.

Pass mark for the Saints this year would be a No. 3 pick, let the recruiting team add some more cream.

I tell you what is certainly fact takeaway - your delusion is fact
Ross Lyon leaving the club in a complete state of disarray - that's fact
Billings and McCartin are crap - that's fact.
The recruiting over the last 8 years since Elshaug has come on board has been diabolical - that's fact - trading away great players like McEvoy for Savage - It's like Ripley's Believe it or not.....I still can't quite believe it.

"Drafting since 2013 is a work in progress" I have never read such rubbish in my life....when does the 'progress' enter its completion phase - 2050??? 2080??

We are on the bottom of the ladder with a shocking list:
Billings, Weller, Lonie, Newnes, McCartin, Sinclair etc etc
Our 'senior' players that we are building the list around - Gilbert, Armitage, Hickey, Nathan Brown, Savage, Geary....omfg....you honestly believe these guys would get a game at other clubs?!?!?!

The only light at the end of this long dark tunnel are a few of the youngsters
Gresham, Rice, Clarke, Long, Austin and a few others

To write that many of the drafts and trades are not the responsibility of the current recruiting team is pure fiction! You live in a fantasy land where you will be slurping sh#!t off a wooden spoon for years to come.
Change is needed and NOW! Elshaug must go ASAP!!!

"Let the team add some more cream" LIKE BILLINGS?!?! Your cream is curdled mate

Your post, santa, is a series of opinions, which of course you are entitled to state. I am just as entitled to disagree with most of them.

Thank you for confirming my post about the problems caused by poor recruiting 2005-10, which has now led to a dearth of quality senior players, and some of those you mentioned have been traded in by the current regime to provide some experience. I don't think you read or understood my earlier post.

Just to help you with Year 11 English, a FACT is "a thing that is known or proved to be true". Even when you quote something that may be a fact, you get it wrong. McEvoy was not traded for Savage - we got Dunstan as well, or Acres, one of them.

Keep your "opinions" coming though, for what they are worth.

FACT - Billings just got dropped for this week.
FACT - you don't just get dropped because you're an A grade player
FACT - we are at the bottom of the ladder
FACT - Jack Newnes 4 tackles in 7 games of footy
FACT - If it looks like s*** and it smells like s***...Do I trust your 'opinion' that it's not s***?....not a chance

And thanks for the patronising year 11 English reference... What good is year 11 English if you write gold like this: "Pass mark for the Saints this year would be a No. 3 pick, let the recruiting team add some more cream." ...My God

[parkeysainter]

I vote TROUT stays.

Partly because he has a cool nickname.

[Dr Spaceman]

I vote TROUT stays.

Partly because he has a cool nickname.

I'm looking forward to seeing him this week, all kitted out for the occasion.

He'll be the RAINBOW TROUT

[parkeysainter]

Yep. Fishing for Trout on Sunday with the missus would be fun.

[asiu]

Yep. Fishing for Trout on Sunday with the missus would be fun.

a: its the ocean
b: sea run trout become torpedoes
therefore
c: the gear she is using is quite unsuitable

[SaintPav]

Yep. Fishing for Trout on Sunday with the missus would be fun.

[asiu]

Yep. Fishing for Trout on Sunday with the missus would be fun.

d: there are also question marks about the suitability of the latching system on her floatation device

one nibble and they'd be off

not that trout nibble
they more suck their prey

[axcellence]

The club is not successful premiership wise so that is an indication of shortcomings within this organisation. Even Enstein would work that out.

Interesting that Einstein level intelligence is required for this situation

[takeaway]

The club is not successful premiership wise so that is an indication of shortcomings within this organisation. Even Enstein would work that out.




Interesting that Einstein level intelligence is required for this situation


Yes, though he may actually mean Enstein, as in Frank. He'd work it out.

[Teflon]

Let's get this thread back on track...I'm delighted to read that Elshaug and Kingsley are reported to be gone at the end of this year. But I'm going to get back on my hobby horse and point out once more that the same focus, if not greater, should be on Danny Sexton. For those of you who missed my earlier posts about this bloke: Danny Sexton was recruited by North Melbourne way back in 1990 but apparently failed to play a single game of senior footy. Following that introduction into the big time, he turned his hand to coaching at junior levels and working his way up the ranks until in 1996 the Saints took him on board in a player development role.

Over the past 12 years (not kidding, 12 YEARS!!!) Sexton has remained with St Kilda, earning big bucks in a variety of coaching positions. Sexton is now Director of Coaching. He is the MR BIG of the St Kilda coaching panel, with oversight of ALL the coaches, including Richardson. I have not the slightest doubt that Sexton is the most powerful football personality at St Kilda, he brings his influence to bear on every coaching issue, move, decision, that is made, and he doubtless has a big say on recruitment and things such as player development and fitness. Richo won't be able to fart without Sexton knowing about it, because he sits right next to him in the coaching box, even followed him down to the bench when Richo goes there (no doubt hoping to get away from Sexton, or perhaps Sexton suffers from wind and that's why Richo has moved into the open air...). Simon Lethlean, who was appointed General Manager Football this year is nominally Sexton's boss, but even he would have had to rely on "12 years at the Saints Sexton" to advise him on what's going on...

To my mind, this is where the real focus should be. Unless it's a Sheedy or Malthouse, you can't tell me that 12 years continuous service at the one club in senior coaching roles is sustainable, especially when the team has been sliding down the ladder in the past 12 months.

We need to ask the St Kilda Board: "why does the club appoint as Director of Coaching someone who has had no playing experience at the elite level, and who has not been tried and tested at any other AFL club to ensure that he has the necessary skills to hold that very senior and crucial position?"

This is a good point you make and no one has even mentioned him on here. Very good at flying under radar. I have had a good google about him and there isn't much on there about him on there either. A real mystery man..........

Agree great post
Surely 12 years is enough in this caper - time to go Danny
I also think Wayne Hughes (who didn’t set the world on fire at Carlton) needs to go - don’t pick up Carlton rejects ffs look at their track record??????
Due diligence anyone? This is what annoys me most it’s freakin obvious stuff I’d expect a capable Admin to have in hand

[saynta]

Linton, well put together. Only problem is that we have won 1.5 games this year and that blows the thinking of top recruiting right out the window and that's a fact. That stat means more than any other data on the planet. It cannot be disputed. It has been said 100 times on various threads that some of the top recruits have not shone this year there have been a lot who have supported them as well and thats fair . Why wont someone put a pass mark on the saints for this year? should be easy for keyboard warriors such as us.
saintpav ...you reckon posters are feebleminded , give us the advantage of your 135+ IQ and tell us where we will finish on the ladder this year, how many games will we win with these very good players we have?

You have stated "and that's a fact" in a number of posts, and in all of them you should be saying "and that's my opinion", because they are certainly not facts.
Drafting from 2013 onwards is still very much a work in progress, with all players drafted still learning the caper, and we really don't know how they will turn out for another few years.

One of the main reasons for the current ladder position is the lack of senior players from the 2005-10 drafts/trades, and we also lost an important 2 from earlier drafts last year, 3 incl Dempster. Those drafts were not the responsibility of the current recruiting team. Current team not perfect, but I think Linton L has summed it up well.
We have certainly improved over the former regime.

Pass mark for the Saints this year would be a No. 3 pick, let the recruiting team add some more cream.

Just to help you with Year 11 English, a FACT is "a thing that is known or proved to be true". Even when you quote something that may be a fact, you get it wrong. McEvoy was not traded for Savage - we got Dunstan as well, or Acres, one of them.

Keep your "opinions" coming though, for what they are worth.

Both actually.

[saintadamski]

Linton, well put together. Only problem is that we have won 1.5 games this year and that blows the thinking of top recruiting right out the window and that's a fact. That stat means more than any other data on the planet. It cannot be disputed. It has been said 100 times on various threads that some of the top recruits have not shone this year there have been a lot who have supported them as well and thats fair . Why wont someone put a pass mark on the saints for this year? should be easy for keyboard warriors such as us.
saintpav ...you reckon posters are feebleminded , give us the advantage of your 135+ IQ and tell us where we will finish on the ladder this year, how many games will we win with these very good players we have?

You have stated "and that's a fact" in a number of posts, and in all of them you should be saying "and that's my opinion", because they are certainly not facts.
Drafting from 2013 onwards is still very much a work in progress, with all players drafted still learning the caper, and we really don't know how they will turn out for another few years.

One of the main reasons for the current ladder position is the lack of senior players from the 2005-10 drafts/trades, and we also lost an important 2 from earlier drafts last year, 3 incl Dempster. Those drafts were not the responsibility of the current recruiting team. Current team not perfect, but I think Linton L has summed it up well.
We have certainly improved over the former regime.

Pass mark for the Saints this year would be a No. 3 pick, let the recruiting team add some more cream.

Just to help you with Year 11 English, a FACT is "a thing that is known or proved to be true". Even when you quote something that may be a fact, you get it wrong. McEvoy was not traded for Savage - we got Dunstan as well, or Acres, one of them.

Keep your "opinions" coming though, for what they are worth.

Both actually.

He was traded for Savage and pick 18 - Luke Dunstan
You're still stuck on that little tid bit?
Well while you're stuck on that - we're stuck on the bottom of the ladder

BUT THERE IS HOPE - No Billings or Geary this week....I reckon we're going to be competitive!

[SaintPav]

Let's get this thread back on track...I'm delighted to read that Elshaug and Kingsley are reported to be gone at the end of this year. But I'm going to get back on my hobby horse and point out once more that the same focus, if not greater, should be on Danny Sexton. For those of you who missed my earlier posts about this bloke: Danny Sexton was recruited by North Melbourne way back in 1990 but apparently failed to play a single game of senior footy. Following that introduction into the big time, he turned his hand to coaching at junior levels and working his way up the ranks until in 1996 the Saints took him on board in a player development role.

Over the past 12 years (not kidding, 12 YEARS!!!) Sexton has remained with St Kilda, earning big bucks in a variety of coaching positions. Sexton is now Director of Coaching. He is the MR BIG of the St Kilda coaching panel, with oversight of ALL the coaches, including Richardson. I have not the slightest doubt that Sexton is the most powerful football personality at St Kilda, he brings his influence to bear on every coaching issue, move, decision, that is made, and he doubtless has a big say on recruitment and things such as player development and fitness. Richo won't be able to fart without Sexton knowing about it, because he sits right next to him in the coaching box, even followed him down to the bench when Richo goes there (no doubt hoping to get away from Sexton, or perhaps Sexton suffers from wind and that's why Richo has moved into the open air...). Simon Lethlean, who was appointed General Manager Football this year is nominally Sexton's boss, but even he would have had to rely on "12 years at the Saints Sexton" to advise him on what's going on...

To my mind, this is where the real focus should be. Unless it's a Sheedy or Malthouse, you can't tell me that 12 years continuous service at the one club in senior coaching roles is sustainable, especially when the team has been sliding down the ladder in the past 12 months.

We need to ask the St Kilda Board: "why does the club appoint as Director of Coaching someone who has had no playing experience at the elite level, and who has not been tried and tested at any other AFL club to ensure that he has the necessary skills to hold that very senior and crucial position?"

Richo reports to Sexton? Crazy if true.

Apart from not listening to his VM, what the hell does Jamie Cox do?

[IluvHarvey]

Let's get this thread back on track...I'm delighted to read that Elshaug and Kingsley are reported to be gone at the end of this year. But I'm going to get back on my hobby horse and point out once more that the same focus, if not greater, should be on Danny Sexton. For those of you who missed my earlier posts about this bloke: Danny Sexton was recruited by North Melbourne way back in 1990 but apparently failed to play a single game of senior footy. Following that introduction into the big time, he turned his hand to coaching at junior levels and working his way up the ranks until in 1996 the Saints took him on board in a player development role.

Over the past 12 years (not kidding, 12 YEARS!!!) Sexton has remained with St Kilda, earning big bucks in a variety of coaching positions. Sexton is now Director of Coaching. He is the MR BIG of the St Kilda coaching panel, with oversight of ALL the coaches, including Richardson. I have not the slightest doubt that Sexton is the most powerful football personality at St Kilda, he brings his influence to bear on every coaching issue, move, decision, that is made, and he doubtless has a big say on recruitment and things such as player development and fitness. Richo won't be able to fart without Sexton knowing about it, because he sits right next to him in the coaching box, even followed him down to the bench when Richo goes there (no doubt hoping to get away from Sexton, or perhaps Sexton suffers from wind and that's why Richo has moved into the open air...). Simon Lethlean, who was appointed General Manager Football this year is nominally Sexton's boss, but even he would have had to rely on "12 years at the Saints Sexton" to advise him on what's going on...

To my mind, this is where the real focus should be. Unless it's a Sheedy or Malthouse, you can't tell me that 12 years continuous service at the one club in senior coaching roles is sustainable, especially when the team has been sliding down the ladder in the past 12 months.

We need to ask the St Kilda Board: "why does the club appoint as Director of Coaching someone who has had no playing experience at the elite level, and who has not been tried and tested at any other AFL club to ensure that he has the necessary skills to hold that very senior and crucial position?"

I just can't believe this.
And absolutely not calling you a liar, I just can't believe this is the case!
Shocked!

[takeaway]

Linton, well put together. Only problem is that we have won 1.5 games this year and that blows the thinking of top recruiting right out the window and that's a fact. That stat means more than any other data on the planet. It cannot be disputed. It has been said 100 times on various threads that some of the top recruits have not shone this year there have been a lot who have supported them as well and thats fair . Why wont someone put a pass mark on the saints for this year? should be easy for keyboard warriors such as us.
saintpav ...you reckon posters are feebleminded , give us the advantage of your 135+ IQ and tell us where we will finish on the ladder this year, how many games will we win with these very good players we have?

You have stated "and that's a fact" in a number of posts, and in all of them you should be saying "and that's my opinion", because they are certainly not facts.
Drafting from 2013 onwards is still very much a work in progress, with all players drafted still learning the caper, and we really don't know how they will turn out for another few years.

One of the main reasons for the current ladder position is the lack of senior players from the 2005-10 drafts/trades, and we also lost an important 2 from earlier drafts last year, 3 incl Dempster. Those drafts were not the responsibility of the current recruiting team. Current team not perfect, but I think Linton L has summed it up well.
We have certainly improved over the former regime.

Pass mark for the Saints this year would be a No. 3 pick, let the recruiting team add some more cream.

Just to help you with Year 11 English, a FACT is "a thing that is known or proved to be true". Even when you quote something that may be a fact, you get it wrong. McEvoy was not traded for Savage - we got Dunstan as well, or Acres, one of them.

Keep your "opinions" coming though, for what they are worth.

Both actually.

He was traded for Savage and pick 18 - Luke Dunstan
You're still stuck on that little tid bit?
Well while you're stuck on that - we're stuck on the bottom of the ladder

BUT THERE IS HOPE - No Billings or Geary this week....I reckon we're going to be competitive!

As Saynta pointed out, we also got Acres as part of the trade! Fairly big tid bit! Sort of knocks your example of "poor" trading out the window! Lost pick 24 & a later pick.
I agree that we have a chance this week, not worried about Geary, but would have preferred Billings to Lonie. Though Billings probably needs a break from all the Dorothy Downer critics, and hopefully will be back next week with a clear head and his kicking boot on. A game in the 2's did an A grade player like Dal Santo a lot of good.
Remember, the cream always rises to the top!

[saynta]

Yep. Fishing for Trout on Sunday with the missus would be fun.

Bump. Just because I like fishing.