What really frustrates me

[rodgerfox]

Or maybe you are like RF who thinks anyone can play in the bottom 6 apparently even him.

Well let's be honest, it's pretty clear that our 'bottom 6' are pretty pungent - and it hasn't exactly had a huge impact over the past 18 months, has it.

[Sobraz]

OP harsh on Gardiner and very harsh on Ray.... Both clearly in our best 18, and have been very solid all year...

Was mentioned in this thread Ray not being able to play the MCG, watch the Cats game again... He was tremendous that night... Had a bad one against the Pies, wasn't alone however... Best overhead mark for his size in the team IMO...

Mini is lucky noone is really pushing for his spot now that Stevo is also in, however, Id be giving Lynch a run in Mini's spot for the next few weeks..

With Raph and Dal to come back in, Dempster and Mini are on thin ice...

Zac stays in, but must be more confident in his own ability, and play a more assertive role... At 50 games now, he should own fullback, and play it like he knows it.... He has the ability, just has brain issues...

[Mooksy]

There's a certain group of players who continously get games and I can't for the life of me understand why.
Raph Clarke (my fav player) is in and out of the team based on his form, the way it should be (and injuries too).

But the following:

Zac "I never learned to punch the ball" Dawson:
I just don't get it. What is his purpose in the team? Almost week after with (with the odd exception like last week) his opponent will out muscle him or the ball will just drop to the feet of the pack for the crumbers to lap up. Seriously, how goals on Sunday would have been prevented if Zac just clobberred the pill forward or through for a behind.
Add to that that he's not damaging and doesn't run a lot either.

Andrew "The Ghost" McQualter:
This is the one that really frustrates me. Armo, Stevens, McEvoy, Raph etc all get dropped for having poor games whereas Andrew has had 16 of them this season. I nick name him the ghost because you never know he's playing until at least after half time when he bobs up for a clanger... like the gettable 3/4 goal he missed.
I would go as far to say that Raph has a more positive effect on the forward line playing off a back flank that mini has had this season in any game.

Michael Gardiner:
Am I the only 1 that thinks he's in a form slump? Haven't seen him contribute much in a while... does he do anything other than the contest? Was sad to see Leon Davis spoil his mark in the backline in the 3rd.

Sean Dempster:
Well there's already a thread about him

Farren Ray:
I asked this in the thread about Peake last week (i know how that sounded), but he ever play well against the trend? A real butter boy IMO.


Finally...
what is with our reluctance to kick the ball long under pressure. I know we like to chip it around and find the right option but seriously put the damn thing on ur boot instead of handballing it to space when there are no options.
Why are we so afraid to take the game on... kick to 1:1 contests etc. Its so irritating to watch

How on earth can you leave Kosi out of this list? Selective

[SaintTom]

Cannot for the life of me figure out why Gards is on that list. Extremely solid in my opinion, I feel that we're lucky to have a ruckman of his calibre playing as well as he is.

Good point about Dawson. I was a real wrap for the guy last year, but not so this year. Can any Dawson-defender tell me what he really adds to the team? Structure won't cut it I'm afraid, because I feel we have strong enough one on one defenders in the likes of Fish and Blake to cover him were he to be dropped. He is not a strong one on one defender, generates no run off the backline, does not have pin point skills with the ball to warrant selection...aside from his height, I can honestly not see a point in his favour at the moment.

I feel as though Dempster should stay in for a few weeks. Hasn't been terrible, I think some here are harsh on him.

Any news on where Raph is up to? Hope he gets over his injury soon, he's someone who I think needs a few games under his belt before finals to get into the kind of form he was in.

[dcstkfc]

Andrew "The Ghost" McQualter:
This is the one that really frustrates me. Armo, Stevens, McEvoy, Raph etc all get dropped for having poor games whereas Andrew has had 16 of them this season. I nick name him the ghost because you never know he's playing until at least after half time when he bobs up for a clanger... like the gettable 3/4 goal he missed.
I would go as far to say that Raph has a more positive effect on the forward line playing off a back flank that mini has had this season in any game.

McQualter 2009 v 2010

2009 Averages: 14 disposals, 0.9 goals, 4.7 tackles
2010 Averages: 14 disposals, 0.5 goals, 3.9 tackles

So realistically he's 0.5 goals and 1 tackle down on his input last year where no one was questioning his spot in the team.

[noob]

His statisitics isn't what is seen to be yeah his tackle count is one down but i think everyone would agree that when the opposition have the ball we lack that physical pressure from last year. Last year McQualter had 4.7 tackles but it would have felt a lot more because of constant pressure and chases on the ball carrier. This is year its being more of a zone and wait for the opposition to make a mistake by foot or hand

[maverick]

There's a certain group of players who continously get games and I can't for the life of me understand why.
Raph Clarke (my fav player) is in and out of the team based on his form, the way it should be (and injuries too).

But the following:

Zac "I never learned to punch the ball" Dawson:
I just don't get it. What is his purpose in the team? Almost week after with (with the odd exception like last week) his opponent will out muscle him or the ball will just drop to the feet of the pack for the crumbers to lap up. Seriously, how goals on Sunday would have been prevented if Zac just clobberred the pill forward or through for a behind.
Add to that that he's not damaging and doesn't run a lot either.

Andrew "The Ghost" McQualter:
This is the one that really frustrates me. Armo, Stevens, McEvoy, Raph etc all get dropped for having poor games whereas Andrew has had 16 of them this season. I nick name him the ghost because you never know he's playing until at least after half time when he bobs up for a clanger... like the gettable 3/4 goal he missed.
I would go as far to say that Raph has a more positive effect on the forward line playing off a back flank that mini has had this season in any game.

Michael Gardiner:
Am I the only 1 that thinks he's in a form slump? Haven't seen him contribute much in a while... does he do anything other than the contest? Was sad to see Leon Davis spoil his mark in the backline in the 3rd.

Sean Dempster:
Well there's already a thread about him

Farren Ray:
I asked this in the thread about Peake last week (i know how that sounded), but he ever play well against the trend? A real butter boy IMO.


Finally...
what is with our reluctance to kick the ball long under pressure. I know we like to chip it around and find the right option but seriously put the damn thing on ur boot instead of handballing it to space when there are no options.
Why are we so afraid to take the game on... kick to 1:1 contests etc. Its so irritating to watch

How on earth can you leave Kosi out of this list? Selective

Very.
Agree with others - inclduing Gardiner and Ray is laughable.

[dcstkfc]

His statisitics isn't what is seen to be yeah his tackle count is one down but i think everyone would agree that when the opposition have the ball we lack that physical pressure from last year. Last year McQualter had 4.7 tackles but it would have felt a lot more because of constant pressure and chases on the ball carrier. This is year its being more of a zone and wait for the opposition to make a mistake by foot or hand

I agree with this. In addition to this, we haven't quite matched 2009 levels in terms of tackling, last year we averaged 73.16, and this year 68.94, but more to the point the entire league has seen our success and whereas last year the league average was 62.08, this year it's 68.74.

[skeptic]

Very.
Agree with others - inclduing Gardiner and Ray is laughable.

See with Ray ppl have missed the point.

I didn't say he never plays well. WHat I'm saying is that he never steps up when the team isn't playing well.
Take the final series last year... 3 tough matches... were never on top in any of them and Ray was ineffective in all of them.

Take our losses this year... did Ray play well in any of them?

He only plays well when others around him are playing well. He doesn't perform under pressure or when closely checked IMO. Most overrated player in the team IMO.


On to Gardiner. I'm surprised at the overwhelming response that criticism has recieved.
I acknowledge that he's been an excellent pick and that he's a decent player but I'll ask my question again (admittedly I haven't seen a lot of footy of the past month)... does he do much more than the hit outs atm?
I don't notice this guy around the grounds at all.

Maverick,
On Kosi... level whatever criticism at me you will but I am a believer that our game plan is not suited for the big fella... he's better 1:1 in space, ball kicked to his advantage.
We know his skills on the ground and around play ain't great but we continually kick it to him in packs. I think criticism of him is harsh... what can you realistically expect of him.
His one goal on the w/e came from fast ball movement, resulting in a 1 on one

[SainterK]

On to Gardiner. I'm surprised at the overwhelming response that criticism has recieved.
I acknowledge that he's been an excellent pick and that he's a decent player but I'll ask my question again (admittedly I haven't seen a lot of footy of the past month)... does he do much more than the hit outs atm?
I don't notice this guy around the grounds at all.

Did you read my post skeptic, about Ross Lyon's comments on Gardiner, pretty sure his best is being conserved for finals....he is resting when he would of traditionally pushed forward earlier in the year.

[skeptic]

Did you read my post skeptic, about Ross Lyon's comments on Gardiner, pretty sure his best is being conserved for finals....he is resting when he would of traditionally pushed forward earlier in the year.

Interesting and duly noted (sorry i shouldn't have glossed over it)

All I'll add is that historically... seeing is believing

For the record... very good player on his day... need him to fire

[Teflon]

The issue is (if there even is an issue) that our game plan relies on the stars.

Probably moreso than any other team. Probably.

Certainly moreso than the Saints have seen for a very long time. So when our guns are out of form, getting beaten or not on the park - we are vunerable.

This whole 'roles' thing is rubbish I reckon. I still get the feeling that our coaches have been sucked in to believing their own hype about our 'roles'.

Dal Santo's role isn't what wins us game - it's Dal Santo. We can't lose him and just put in some spud to play his role.

Ditto Baker.

Ditto BJ.

Ditto any of our good players.


I think it's why people scratch their heads at the inclusion of guys like Pattison or Dempster (for example).

I think the coaches believe they're so brilliant in defining these roles that anyone can come in do it. In games like the Geelong one, or the 2nd half of the Brisbane game (and many, many others) - it appears they are correct.
But the actual reality is that these guys can't play these roles to effect. The only time they appear to, is when our guns are playing well.


But as I said, this may not even be an issue. We just need Lenny, Dal, BJ, Roo, Baker, Joey etc. to be fit, in form and on the park in September.

This is obvious.

When our stars play well - "role"players are bought into the game under less pressure.

When stars are beaten - its illogical to expect "role" players to pick up the slack and carry the team - wont happen.

All sides have stars and "role"players.
No news there..